to admire religious fasting for its discipline and commitment?

[catchingup1]

I’ve been thinking about this lately, especially with Ramadan just gone and the dry fasting of 24 hours by Jews and Mormons.

I can't help feeling impressed. Not in a gushy way, just genuinely. Going without food and water for long periods, while still getting on with normal life, work, family etc takes a level of willpower and discipline that I don’t think most people have.

It’s not even just the physical side. It’s the restraint, the routine, the intention behind it. The fact that people are doing it for something bigger than themselves, not just for a diet or health trend.

It's not just people who’ve grown up with it. There are converts every year across different religions who are doing these fasts for the first time as adults. They haven’t had years to “get used to it” and are choosing to take it on anyway. It’s a conscious decision, not just habit.

Even for people who have done it since childhood, plenty still find it challenging every year. It’s not like it becomes effortless, they’re still choosing to stick to it day after day.

Then you read so much now about people struggling with “food noise”, constantly thinking about what to eat next, cravings, snacking, not being able to switch off from it. So the idea of deliberately stepping away from all of that, even for a set period and managing your impulses like that. It does make me respect it.

I’m not saying it makes anyone better than anyone else, just that I admire the self control, discipline and commitment involved.

I came across this about the benefits of dry fasting:

www.bcm.edu/news/dawn-to-dusk-dry-fasting-leads-to-health-benefits-in-the-study-of-immune-cells

That would be something done by the more devout ( for want of a better expression) of Muslim but not something practiced by the majority. It’s something that is open to interpretation amongst Muslims.

Never once in 50 years in the region have I seen anyone collapse on the street or anywhere else from fasting yet you are claiming to have seen several women doing it in your very short time there?

This is quite abusive then within the community because its inevitable that someone will be tired, forgetful, grumpy, etc. They are denying their body basic fuel

This sort of mindset 'they're doing it wrong and need to show self restraint in all things' is the same as that belief system where women mustnt make noise when giving birth

Completely bonkers. The lot of it.

I was in an exercise class in east Lancs (so not hot) and a woman who was fasting collapsed.

It is abusive because someone gets tired, forget and grumpy? My manager is like this and eats every hour 😂

Denying basic fuel to the body triggers autophagy which is beneficial:

https://www.bluezones.com/2018/10/fasting-for-health-and-longevity-nobel-prize-winning-research-on-cell-aging/

Constantly fuelling up is bonkers.

What are they?

I have posted lots of others too.

I’m Jewish and I only fast on the 2 full 24 hours fasts one in August and one in October. I really don’t like fasting but see it as a religious obligation. I think if you have the mindset that it’s mandated it needs neither discipline or commitment, you just do it.

I think there are too many people on Mumsnet who just love any excuse not to eat.

So they spit? How delightful

I see you deliberately misrepresented what I said

For clarity, its abusive to say that because someone is tired, grumpy and forgetful and complains during a fasting period because they are suffering - that they are 'not doing it right' and need to display some sort of better self restraint

That is abusive.

And that is what a lot of these belief systems are based on, if you have a problem with restraining your food intake, well, thats a 'you' problem and you're not 'doing it right'.

You see it on all the diet threads as well, someone saying a particular way of eating didnt suit them - well they didnt do it right in the first place.

Very strange comment .
Not quite sure what you are suggesting

Why just religious fasting OP? You know there are people in the world with no water and food available, who have no choice? Im impressed by people surviving genuine hardship, not performative choices.

Yes. It was 40 degrees & I remember one incident very clearly. Our tourist hop on / off bus had to stay stationery to help a woman who collapsed in the street outside the shopping centre. I was told it was dehydration and heat stroke.

I also watched our tour 4wd driver take his eyes off the road multiple times to bust out the food & water from his Esky at the end of day call.

Call me a liar if like. It happened. But I live where it can commonly get to 35/37 degrees & sometimes 40, and the constant message is to stay hydrated. A lot of people (especially elderly) end up in hospital & yes, some die. I stand by my conviction that you should not fast from water. Food we can do without if you please.

That's not true for everyone.

I work better and feel better without breakfast and lunch. And no drinking either.

OMAD is better for me most of the time.

@ThatCyanCat

Yes, I believe fasting can alter your consciousness, which is part of the reason some grimoires/spell-books recommend it for magical practices that involve interaction with spirits. Changing one's consciousness is understood to assist in perceiving/communicating with non-corporeal entities.

Then they shouldn't be fasting if they are unwell. I'm sure certain people are exempt for age and health reasons.

Silly if they still choose to do so.

Yes, as a priest once told my DM (she was a teacher in a Catholic school), it was no wonder these saints saw stuff, it was because they were fasting.

I go as far as "dont eat meat on good friday" but I have no interest in actual fasting. I suffer from low blood pressure so need to keep the salts going and (more important) I am a Very Hangry Bitch to everyone when I am ravenous lol

Mixed feelings! Living and working in the Middle East, I have often seen people doing very physical jobs, doggedly carrying on in the heat.

OTOH I used to teach English to mostly young adult males, and TBH you could forget making much progress during Ramadan - most of them would evidently have been up most of the night, eating and drinking, and were pretty much fit for nothing. They were nearly all employed by various government ministries, and not usually doing physical work.

I think it's honestly really dumb that people will buy into doing something dangerous because their imaginary sky friend says they should. If it wasn't related to religion we'd call it psychosis.

Going without food won't harm you, but not drinking fluids could lead to serious health repercussions. I see absolutely nothing to respect or admire about that. I'd be interested also in how many people do it because they personally really want to, compared to how many do it due to social pressure or because they've been conditioned into it since birth.

I grew up in a very multicultural city, and went to school with many Muslim kids. Ever since I was a teenager, I've admired the discipline and commitment Ramadan takes. Especially when it falls in the summer months.
I used to talk to my Muslim school friends about it, we used to ask them stuff like "omg do you stuff your face as soon as you can?!" and they would just laugh and say no, we have a normal meal. The discipline and self restraint carries on even once they can eat. It's admirable.

I really think that society has lost any sort of disciple and order, it's not good for us. Food used to be dictated by the seasons, feast days celebrated only at certain times of year so they were actually special.
Now it's all "I can put my Christmas tree up in October if I want, why should I have to wait? I should do what makes me happy"
"I'll have a leg of lamb in the middle of winter or a punnet of strawberries, why shouldn't I? It's perfectly fine to have them flown half way around the world to satisfy my whim".
"I'll wear Jeans to my Nan's funeral of I want, how dare anyone tell me I can't?"

It's sad. And I think a bit of discipline and restraint would do us good.

I don't find vegans/veganism impressive either. Surely as a whole we should be less selfish and care about others (humans or animals) anyway, so it's really not that impressive to do the basics.

I mean there is nothing stopping you from trying it yourself for health reasons if you like. I know a couple of people with diabetes who do 16 hour fasts regularly. They drink water with a bit of salt in for hydration though. They find it keeps their diabetes in remission.

As a vegan, I agree. Being respectful to animals isn't compassion, it's justice. I've long thought that being vegan is literally the absolute bare minimum.