SEND - children’s needs to be reassessed from year 6 2029?

[missbish]

Are they taking the piss? After the struggles parents have trying to secure support for their child, they’re then going to threaten to take it away once they’re due to go to secondary? Ds goes to secondary this year so I don’t think it will effect him but I am so angry for those it does effect.

The government have said they are going to put 4bn into this plan

If you are going to spend 4 billion - i would prefer to make it useful by listening to what actually helps.

We all know there is 'no money tree' but this thread is full of distressed parents wondering if support that works for them now will be taken away and replaced with support that is also costing money but isnt suitable.

It could be a great plan but people are scared and not trusting after terrible experiences.

And the fact is if children are so ill they can’t access school, the state has to provide something and an EHCP is very much needed to keep them in education when they make progress.

I mean, you tell the ed psyche who assessed my child that then.

I think if we made schools less stressful environments then a lot more children would be able to cope better. I think part of the reason more children with SEN struggle with school these days is that schools are often huge and high pressured, with a big focus on exams and results right from primary.
If we spent some of the money on smaller class sizes and replaced the curriculum with something less result focused and more holistic, a lot of children might manage better. Also, if local authorities opened far more special schools instead of money grabbing private companies who charge extortionate fees and are constantly in the news for the abuse of vulnerable children, it would be better for everyone concerned.

Such children need mental health support, things like CBT, confidence building

But this is not education. This is for parents to provide. Its not up to schools to make children happy.

Totally agree. Exams are unnecessary all together in primary. In secondary, they should also think about returning to new labour’s reforms and allowing more coursework again.

My DD is in year 10 and I think she has dyslexia but because she didn’t fail all of the tests in the screening (though she did fail half including comprehension) they won’t give her a diagnosis. She’s absolutely brilliant at her coursework lessons but failing the exam based ones already. She falls to pieces in tests, says her mind goes blank entirely. This isn’t uncommon for kids with some sort of SEN but actually also NT kids.

I think exams are futile in humanities subjects too, I say this as a humanities academic. All it proves is that the student is able to memorise and regurgitate information under pressure.

It’s up to schools to provide education for all.

Will your child go on to live an independent life of work?

But the support now is endlessly trashed and deemed inadequate. We’re spending endlessly with outcomes not improving and yet more SEN children. We can’t keep going

I agree, school is so hard for the kids. Someone upthread mentioned how they go from play based learning in reception to sitting behind the desk all day in year 1, and it’s right ! It’s way too much for them, they’re so little still and no wonder the wheels fall off. My ds got to year 4 and couldn’t cope any longer, they’re work literally blew his mind, he was starting to notice the gap between him and his peers also

If we spent some of the money on smaller class sizes and replaced the curriculum with something less result focused and more holistic, a lot of children might manage better

Even the cost of reducing class sizes from 30 to 25 would be enormous. Where are 20% more teachers going to come from? And extra classrooms. There are just shy of half a million teachers (full time equivalent) in uk state schools. You'd need another 100,000. At an average cost including pension contributions of about 50k per teacher, the teachers alone would cost £5 billion extra per year. Without allowing for building changes, extra supply teachers, extra admin staff to cope with a workforce 20% bigger.

Amd most kids with SEN wouldn't even register the difference between 30 & 25 kids per class.

And the purpose of education being state funded is that its a public good to have an educated workforce. Wtf is a "holistic" curriculum? We need to educate doctors and engineers and computer scientists and nurses and architects and people who can actually read, write and manage maths in every day life.

I do agree there should be alternative routes from age 14 - especially for trades - we desperately need to promote training more bricklayers and roofers and plumbers and electricians.

I can’t possibly answer that can I, he’s 11. Lots can change between now and adulthood.
I’d like to think he could.

Early diagnosis and appropriate interventions for those 'capable' children you reference is actually the key to helping them flourish and not need to rely on incapacity benefits due to severe mental health problems. Late diagnosis is what is cripping the whole 'system'. This has been proven. I'm not seeking a diagnosis for my daughter so she can go onto benefits and opt out of society. I'm doing it so that she has the right support to thrive, have the same opportunities as others take for granted and to try to ensure she doesn't end up self harming or committing suicide.

That sounds far from confident, and while this isn’t a value judgement, shows why very expensive school places with far from guaranteed outcomes are basically a false economy. Presumably even with the best support your son (who I gather is of normal intelligence and able bodied?) stands a good chance of not working- in which case you’ll expect the social care and benefit system to take care of him for life.

This will cost millions and millions of pounds. Can you not see how unaffordable this is for all but the most disabled children?

I would rather they cut 1/4 out of the primary curriculum and focused on actually engaging children and letting them learn and consolidate their learning became constantly moving onto the next thing. I would stop testing in primary as well-there is no need for it. I would stop the obsession with phonics (remove the screener) and allow a focus on sight words if phonics isn’t working for groups. Phonics is great, but it doesn’t work for everyone, particularly those who are ND. Lots more play based learning throughout KS1 would help as well-active phonics, Forest Schools, outside learning.

I’d scrap uniforms and Ofsted too but that’s probably too controversial! Might save a few quid though.

If children are enjoying school because it’s not all too stressful every minute of the day, and they are actually able to succeed, then they’ll probably want to come in more so we wouldn’t have so many schools refusers or SEMH issues.

If you are going to spend 4 billion - i would prefer to make it useful by listening to what actually helps.

What parents have demanded for the last 10 years hasn't delivered better outcomes. There are more anxious young people not in school or work than ever before.

Of course there are lots of anxious youngsters and more severe SEND. That is also down to Covid. They locked kids and youngsters up for almost 2 years and it took until now for the NHS to get back on its feet to diagnose etc and there are still delays in things like speech and language. We always knew the young would take the brunt and we would be playing catch up for 10 years at least. It is hardly a surprise.
Education should be a happy place for most - all kids are learners, they need to all be given the opportunity to learn at their pace in a safe environment. I think that is all most parents are asking for.
We do not dump old people with dementia on their own at home either well past their economic best. We invest heavily there too. It is what it is. Most of us are working 40 years max but are supported via education for 20 years and then most of us for another 20 years in retirement too.

You seem to be very sure of the future yourself. We will do our best to help our son lead an independent life, he is a very intelligent kid (apart from maths) my sons struggles focus more around social and communication, he is already making his own computer games and building pcs, he is capable of working so long as he has support in place and the right environment.

Of course there are lots of anxious youngsters and more severe SEND. That is also down to Covid. They locked kids and youngsters up for almost 2 years and it took until now for the NHS to get back on its feet to diagnose etc and there are still delays in things like speech and language

The cohort starting school this year were born after all the lockdowns yet there are as many diagnoses as ever.

I believe the reasoning is that there will be a lot more targeted interventions earlier in education, especially sp and lang, which if picked up early can make huge differences to a child at secondary level. If ignored it’s teen years that becomes more problematic.

so I think the aim would be to be putting so much in earlier on that some children would not need an ehcp at secondary.

at least that’s the theory. The practice is very different.

imo they need far more OT input earlier too. They get so much more in the US and it makes an enormous difference

Yes - education. Which doesn't include mental health support, cbt or "confidence building". These are for healthcare services AND PARENTS TO PROVIDE.

What do you think parents are for? Parents need to accept responsibility for rearing their children and attending to their wellbeing.

@Peridoteage - prenatal and maternal healthcare is still impacting this cohort of children starting schools. Baby checks were down, speech and language has had severe delays since early 2020. Health and education in real life for children as well as poverty are not separate buckets. They all impact each other and greatly so.

My understanding is that mainstream primary schools are being encouraged to establish SEND hubs on site, which will mean that children will be able to attend their local school rather than being moved to specialist provision.
I think schools will feel forced to do this- by 2028 national inclusion standards will be in place - so I’m not sure schools will really have a choice
and that it will be done with differing levels of funding and expertise across the board.

I do think the knee jerk reaction now is to assume a child with any emotional difficulties is ‘SEN’ and therefore now the remit of school and CAMHS.

There is a cost for rebranding everything as ‘disability’, it makes it feel immutable and like something the parents can’t change.

Children are more likely to have ehcp strengthened tbh.

transition from primary to secondary is woeful. More (good) pressure on secondary to have the necessary support, attitude and resources in place to accommodate children

BP is absolutely right that lots of private companies are making a fortune out of send. That money should be being used for the same thing in schools we already have.