Part time workers and bank holidays. Fair or unfair?

[crunchiesnuts]

I know that it’s completely legal and up to the employer, but I’m just curious about what people think about this.

I’m part of a small team (there are 7 of us in total). Everyone works full time, 5 days a week, except for one person who is part time, working 3 days a week. This person works Monday-Wednesday. When there’s a bank holiday, they switch their days and work from Tuesday to Thursday instead. Like I said, I know this is all above board and our manager is fine with it, but the rest of the team feels it’s a bit unfair since they don’t have a say and have to use their annual leave regardless.

I’m kind of torn on it. I know this person asked to work Mondays when she took the job, so it feels a bit like having the best of both worlds, but I also get not wanting to burn through almost all your annual leave just for the bank holidays. Recently, this person has mentioned how she doesn’t complain about the fact that the rest of us get more holidays and better pay (which is a bit confusing since we work more hours, so naturally, we would), but it’s stirred up some tension in the office, and I guess, some people think she’s rubbing it in their face. I’m just interested in hearing what others think. Even though it’s legal, do you see it as fair or unfair?

Yes that’s how it should work

but a lot of times someone is on a full time contract and then goes part time.

so you get a quick letter confirming you are now say 2 days a week and pay is 2/5 and holiday is 2/5. They don’t always go back and rewrite that entire holiday section for the amendment letter.

obviously large companies are on top of this but many smaller companies aren’t.

I had to point out at work that when we had all the bank holidays for the Queen dying and coronations, the part timers needed 2/5 of a day added to their allowance for example. (And had to use another 3/5 of an existing holiday day if they wanted to not work that day)

I'm speaking globally. We can't possibly know the minutiae of this particular role, so any arguments made are null - including yours - if that's the way you want to go.

Even if something doesn't impact you, you can surely appreciate it can still be objectively unfair?

Besides, as discussed it can impact them.

Scenario 1 - This is a very realistic scenario

Part time member of staff works Monday to Weds

On three bank holiday Mondays they swap their day and accrue 3/5th’s of a day for each of these days
Therefore they have accrued 1.8 days holiday to use another time in the year

They then take off as holiday the August Bank holiday Monday, Christmas Day, Boxing Day and New Year's day and don’t swap to work a different day.

For these 4 days holiday they have to use 1.6 days of their accrued bank holiday entitlement.

Do you really resent this employee from having 0.2 of a days bank holiday entitlement to use when they choose rather than on the actual bank holiday.

You'll get there. Enjoy yours.

No, it's not "unfair" because I'm not three years old.

And it could impact them, but it could advantage them. Working that out is just normal management.

I think that this poster must have escaped from the script of The Office.

It wasn't a concern ever raised by the OP.

The full timers would be better off spending their time more constructively to agree sharing out the weeks where a bank holiday falls. If you take a week a/l on BH week you only use 4 days of your a/l allowance. This is how I managed swapping from full time on ward shifts where I had an extra 8 days to take whenever I wanted to working Monday to Friday and being forced to take BH when they fell. No one was allowed to take a/l over Christmas (because the manager always took two weeks then 🙄) and staff with children obviously wanted time over Easter. But May and August gave me three weeks for 12 days leaving me three days to take randomly. Had I been able to take Easter as well I could have had five weeks a/l for 20 days allocation leaving a whole extra week to take. I wonder if any of the full timers have worked this out given their inability to understand pro-rata.

Obviously if the part timer works BH weeks to avoid using up her a/l on bank holidays then that helps free up those weeks for the full timers.
They should be grateful to her.

Of course its unfair, she will have more days she can freely choose as holidays than full timers. This absolutely fits the definition of unfair.

It also means, if cover for holidays is ever an issue, allowing her to do this impacts others who will have less available time on a rota they can book as extra free days have been taken up by her.

I dont understand why youre being given a hard time about talking about it, sounds like she kicked the conversation off.

That.

Exactly.

There's school kid level pettiness involved in objections to the part timer arranging her affairs to make best use of having exactly the same leave as colleagues pro-rata her hours.

Only if her being in the office on a day she would not normally affects colleagues have they a legitimate gripe. An example might be desk occupancy if A N Other uses the p/t workers desk when she's not there. One place I worked had that sort of friction when overtime shifts were offered and tue-wed part timer cam in early and grabbed the shared desk. Easily solved by them going elsewhere. No ill will involved; the p/t worker had been on autopilot.

Agree

And none of the team would have a thing to say about it if her 'normal' working days were Tues/Weds/Thurs in the first place. Honestly, you couldn't make it up.

You have a poor understanding of how this works in law. The part timer is getting exactly the same amount of holiday pro-rata’d as everyone else. The flex she is offering gives a business benefit.

I would be having a word with your manager if it was me

And if I were your manager I’d be assuming you were short of work if you had time to whinge about utter non problems.

I don’t think it’s any of the teams business really, this is between your colleague and the company. I would say the issue should be between you and your colleagues and the company and why you should have to use annual leave for those days, that is what isn’t fair!

You’re being petty 🥴

It's interesting that legally a PT work can't be treated less favourably than a FT worker, just because they are PT. (Sorry, can't think of an example of the top of my head...)
But this case seems to be a PT worker getting a perk because she's PT. I personally think it does need clarification, especially as she can WFH on a Monday. It is creating issues within the team - she seems to be resentful of the others holidays etc, not the OP!
Maybe she needs to be told she works her set days or moves her work days to Tues,Weds,Thurs......
FWIW I used to be rotated to work on a Monday (PT) but whenever it was a BH, my shift was moved so I wasn't paid double time!

People keep saying the PT worker is getting a perk.

She's not.

For each bank holiday in the year she gets 3/5ths of a day's leave. Exactly the same pro rata as her full time colleagues. If a bank holiday falls on a working day, and she takes it off, she loses 2/5ths of a day she can otherwise use when she wants to.

To that extent she's not advantaged but disadvantaged.

If instead she changes her working day that week she uses no A/L on Monday and banks 3/5ths of a day to use elsewhere. There are four Bank Holiday Mondays in the year so she might have 12/5, roughly two and a half days, to tag onto rest of her leave.

No real effect on her colleagues at all.

She isn’t wfh on the bank holiday. That would be unfair I agree if no one else can do that.
she is working Thursday rather than Monday instead for that week.

It didn’t affect you in any way, shape or form so just leave her to it.

The "perk" is she'll have holidays she can use on other days of her choosing whereas the FT have to use them on the bank hols.

Stuff like this does matter to some employees, and that is absolutely fine.

Id like to work bank hols and be free to use those days elsewhere when it's better for me. technically I can in my role but that would mean thats 6-8 less days im around for the team and wider company when most are working, and possibly less available days for my team to book if im taking them up (for cover). Not the end of the world but I understand feelings of fairness* matter to people.

(* = although there are times treating people differently is fine, i dont think this is one of them as its clearly causing some unnecessary friction)

Do you not realise that your PT colleague has to have the Monday off as the place of work is closed. I know you said that she could choose to work from home, but she chooses to have a long weekend.
If there were zero bank holidays you would not get those BH days added to your AL.
This only happens if someone works shifts, nurses, police officers etc.
Because they have a rota that could include a BH that they can’t take.
Please do not think you and your FT colleagues are being mistreated it is just the way it works. The PT colleague just doesn’t get the BH allowance in her AL.

The PT worker is getting bank hols in her allowance.

say she didnt change her hours the bank hol weeks in question, she'd work the tues/weds and have x amount of hours deducted from her holiday balance for the mon, as a mon is a working day for her.

As she changes her days - meaning for that week mon isnt a normal working day for her - she doesnt have the mon bank hol hours deducted, meaning shes free to take those as a hol on any day of her choosing, whereas the FT workers cant do that.

So op and her colleagues are entitled to feel the PT worker is getting a perk they arent. Because she is.

But how?

a PT worker who works 3 days a week accrues 0.6 BH of a full time worker so 5 days

conceivably if a person works M-W they could have all but 1 bank holiday fall on their working days so 7 days so they have 2 days where they are forced to use their non BH holidays to cover BH

how is that a perk?

In this scenario workers who's normal working day would fall on a bank hol have that deducted from their holiday allowance.

The PT worker changes her working pattern that week, so the bank holiday isnt deducted.

This means the hours that would have been deducted arent, so she can take those at any other time of her choosing.

So its a perk because she can choose when those hours that would have been deducted can be taken, whereas the FT workers cant. Granted some people might not see this as a perk to them if they like having bank hols off anyway, but i can see why some would value having choice over when they can take most of their hols.