“Everybody thought the EU was about people coming into the country … no-one told of us the benefits”.

[MrsMurphyIWish]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cm2136jnjx1o

And the response to this very now deprived community is to vote Reform.

“Brexit has removed a key source of funding, which the area desperately needs. County Durham received £154m of EU funding between 2014 and 2020, about £22m a year. Since the UK left the European Union, it receives about half that amount, £12m annually, under the UK Shared Prosperity Fund.”

The story is sad (and typical of deprived areas - I know, I live in one). Towns feeling forgotten and never recovering from closed industry but why can they not see history will repeat itself?

The BBC did a program with ex Lib dem leader went to welsh town that voted overwelming leave and asked questions.

They knew the local college offer course for young people had been paid for partly with EU money they didn't care - fact it kept young people around they didn't care. They cared about lack of GP - nothing to do with EU - and other stuff not to do with EU - and when they was pointed out the shrugged and moaned more.

I don't think it's about logic - it's about feelings - feeling town people have been left behind - wanting change any change - that the wave Trump rode on in US.

I'm in Wales and Labour supporting voters have attacked me for pointing out 20 + years of labour government see little benefit - they lost loads of reasons why that's fine - why it's okay NHS and Eduction wholly devolved have worse outcome than rest of UK. Now polls look dicy and suddenly they've remembered we are here and we get ads and door knocks and talk of more money.

Poltical parties used to go to voters work out what they wanted - what they might be able to do and then sold themselves on idea they'd do it. Now I don't rate what Reform are promising or their ablity to do anything if they got power but they have managed to do what poltical parties used to do - work out what a section of populous want and sell themselves as capable of doing that - instead of whining voters are thick of stupid or should just automatically vote for them.

Nope, the money has gone, billions spent in prepping customs, paper work for Brexit, 100s of billions lost in trade/GDP and in having to deal in the delays (cost) of continuing trade with the EU.

Even our supposed trade deals are either the same as we had or worse & we still have to abide by EU rulings, we cannot go out on a limb, Brexit has also led to some drug shortages too, as manufacturers prioritise the larger market and 2nd tier ours.

I'm no fan of Thatcher but anyone who thinks being in the EU is a bad idea, should listen to her arguments on being in the Single Market, a SM she helped to design.

Having worked in marketing/advertising for 20 years, I remember thinking that the remain campaign was woefully inadequate. There should have been an EU flag flying from every EU-funded project, street parties celebrating what that funding had achieved, information going out to everyone pointing out the specific EU-funded local projects that benefited them.

Instead, it felt like Cameron et al truly believed that if they told the UK how to vote, everyone would just toe the line. They came across as the smug, entitled elite that they were. Johnson, Farage and co saw a power vacuum and filled it with a stories about underdogs and bulldog spirit that turned out to be bollocks. In the end, the remain campaign only had themselves to blame.

The EU appeals to tax and spend, centre left middle classes and people who like having a second home in France or want their children to do a ski season. If that isn't your thing, it won't appeal any more than the pro EU bunch would want a close union with Trump's America.

One of the benefits of EU membership was the freedom of movement of goods and services. It was fairly ignored by vast swathes of the UK population - even though it was the main tenet of a very popular TV programme back in the days of 4 channels only. Auf Wiedersehen, Pet showed what that movement meant.

The construction workers went to Germany to earn money, which they sent back to their families. And when the economy in the UK improved they went back. Remember all the Polish plumbers? Were we still in the UK for sure some of them would still be in the UK. But due to EU investment in Poland it has become an attractive place to live and work, and a lot of the Polish workers (not just plumers) would have gone back home. Incidentally, countries like Poland which have been in net receipt of EU funding, who are now more prosperous and expected to pay in more and receive less to fund newer, less well off entrants, are grumbling about their own versions of Brexit. Hmmmm.

And i know a lot of people voted for Brexit "to give the government a black eye" several (ex)friends looked me in the eye and said that, even though they knew it would be a huge upheaval for me. No "oh sorry, Bref, but that's how i feel" just glee that they would be punching the PM on the nose. And of course i don't expect my friends to vote in my interests over theirs, but it was an interesting visit (3 weeks before the referendum)

Another thing i heard from people - and be sure, i talked about the referendum to just about everyone i came across on that visit - was simply "i'm voting to get the foreigners out" and they sometimes meant all foreigners (the plumbers etc) and brown people. But more often it was brown people. People who don't look like us and weren't born here (even the ones who don't look like us and are 2nd, 3rd and 4th generation immigrants).

Do you think ANYONE listened to us saying: yes, a lot of immigrant populations are voting for Brexit because they want more visas for people from their original countries, to make it easier to bring family over (often aging parents, but also siblings, cousins etc). And why wouldn't they?

Brexit was far too complicated for the nasty misinformation that lots of campaigning was based on. For people who weren't doing well, economically, were bound to vote for change, people who were doing ok or who were more informed about what the EU does (including many many UK citizens in EU countries, who were not allowed to vote) were more or less bound to vote to remain. Vastly wealthy business owners were often more likely to vote leave because they believed it would open more lucrative markets and didn't need EU trade to make money. Others realised their trade was mainly EU and they wanted to stay.

And then the third of people - the fuckers - who didn't vote at all. Pretty much rendering the whole thing meaningless (and it wouldn't have mattered which way the result went, the fact that one third of people had no opinion should have been a huge red flag). The referendum should have been a qualified majority, and the fact it wasn't is the biggest scandal here, for me. (as well as outside interference)

But again: it is what it is. We all need to work for a better future. And that should be one that doesn't consign the regions to industrial wastelands and shantytowns of internal economic migrants all over the south east.

Yeah, well aphorisms about turkeys voting for Christmas come to mind.

This whole subject was thoroughly discussed at the time, but people in those kind of deprived communities were much more concerned about immigrants taking "their" jobs, "their" council houses, "their" children's school places, etc than they were about EU funding for development projects.

This is the Reform message isn't it?

Agree we need to put Brexit behind us. DH and I voted Remain and I remember crying on the morning of the vote as I looked at my then 5 and 2 year olds - however they have dual citizenship (thanks to DH!) so they have a least a safety net. I still don’t understand how people who were taken in by Brexit promises, who now concede they were “lied” to are prepared to do the same again.

The construction workers went to Germany to earn money, which they sent back to their families.

People are complex FIL was one of those builders in 80s and voted leave. IL got hit by travel restrictions and such coming in as well.

There area actually had an uptick - more middle class people moving in though they tend to drive or use public transport more so local shops were closing still or hadn't re-opened. Even FIL thought the eastern building trade workers were good and had better attitude than many UK one and his mate rented houses to some and they were great tennants.

I think the remain said ran a poor campaign and leave ran better one but made it about way more than the EU more about general dissatisfaction and Remain are still tapping into that and that is a worry.

EU funding is another name for UK funding so maybe the UK have decided to pump money into other areas too which need it.

The EU used to choose who we could fund but now it’s our choice and bear in mind we had these poor areas whilst it was compulsory for us to fund areas in Poland, Ireland, Spain etc.

Instead, it felt like Cameron et al truly believed that if they told the UK how to vote, everyone would just toe the line.

Camerons cowardice will be a bookmark in future histories. Similar to Chamberlain with none of the redeeming points.

Brexit could have worked out massively to our advantage as a nation, however a combination of incompetent politicians of both colours, and the financial devastation of covid, conspired against that.

Going forward, we are in a civilisational decline, that won't reverse, AI will be taking all the comfy WFH jobs, leaving thousands un-employed and with no bread, whilst China et al have cornered the industrial market.

This will also be a picture across Europe going forward - best la vie, nowt that can be done now!

My MIL voted for Brexit because she didn't like "...the Germans telling us what to do after we beat them in the war".

Every now and then she has a moan about something or other that wouldn't be happening if we were still in the EU.

I'm afraid I can't resist pointing out that she voted for this.

How could remain build a campaign based on EU funded projects when the UK paid in more money than it got back?

"Here look how lucky we are - the EU takes our money and lets us have some of it back - have a sausage roll and celebrate!"

But the UK was providing this funding to the EU and the EU was choosing what to do with it.

Playing devil’s advocate here, the government of the time were absolutely playing with fire holding the referendum, especially at the time they did. But politicians and the media had for years blamed all our woes on the EU. If they had wanted us to stay in the EU, there needed to be a longer, concerted period of highlighting the positives of our membership.

I also think it is important to address the fact that people did/do not trust the government. The booklet we all received regarding their position of the benefits of remaining in the EU was seen as a waste of public funding, and propaganda by many. You were never going to get a whole country doing their own independent research, or understanding the impacts of Brexit, but the government’s word would have been taken much more at face value if people had felt they were trustworthy.

And lastly, we were told this was a once-in-a-generation vote. After many years of the EU being blamed for out problems, there should have perhaps been an idea that if people voted to remain, there would be a period of absolutely trying to improve things, with another vote further down the line if people still weren’t happy.

These are just some thoughts I have had over the years, and I think the government should be held to account a lot more than they are.

As stated below on a typical year

I'm pleased this article has made it onto Mumsnet. I'm so tired of hearing Reform voters are thick as pigshit racist gammons.
No. Most of them are really struggling. They feel completely sidelined and they are completely sidelined.
And just for info, I am not a Reform voter, because I am lucky enough that society sort of works for me. It's a very privileged position.

I still don’t understand how people who were taken in by Brexit promises, who now concede they were “lied” to are prepared to do the same again.

They feel them and their area have been left behind - social mobility done nothing but go down in last few decades - they want a decent life for them and their kids.

I personally don't think Reform are a serious party- but these people are fed up at being ignored and fed up they lives keep getting harder.

Instead of blaming the electorate and calling them thick why are the other poltcial parties getting in their with polices selling themsleves with a view to imporving those areas?

Thing is I strongly suspect I know why - as social moblity has declined more poltcians and their advisors come from a very narrow social economic strata and from same edcuational backgrounds and increasingly little to connect them with these communities - they haven't come up through trade unions or even churches ( more US in recent past ) many go straight from uni to political jobs - and areas become more disjointed not like they even have the links old noblity had with their workers in those areas. Instead of thinking how can we reach these voters they increaingly seem to sneer at them and look down and then act surpirsed those voters vote for people who at least appear to talk to them notice they exist.

It's not just poltcian acting another area - media more general from news to publishing - the doors in if you aren't from certain group/class have in last decades started to close - people there come from an ever narrower group and have little contact with other groups and then start to look down on those groups when they don't behave or think in the same way.

Those despairing at the fact that a majority of voters voted fro Brexit - don't worry, Labour seem to be trying very hard to get the UK back into the EU, despite the fact that voters decided to leave. They still have a few years left to carry on with this reintegration no matter who leads them.

Those despairing at the fact that a majority of voters voted fro Brexit

Actually they didn't. But carry on.

@Seymour5 We live in a very deprived area overall, vote reform sprayed on walls and flags everywhere. I live in the part of town that has a few roads where it’s another world compared to the streets full of terrace houses which were for mill workers and are still really cheap.

Many remain voters will look to their critical thinking skills but they often don’t have to live in it. Instead of hating leave voters it’s better to try and understand why and not just immediatley shout racist. I am upset my council is Reform and I would say I’m in an area where there is an actual chance of us getting a Reform MP. I’m mixed race in what is a very predominantly white area. What kicked off Reform doing so well here was the only local hotel took migrants. They laid off 25 staff and of course in a small town almost everyone knew someone who lost their job.

We have lived in this town for 26 years what made me stand out was my Southern accent and that’s all that made me feel different.I can honestly write that I have experienced some awful looks in my direction of late. DH actually saw a man really give me evils in a supermarket recently, he was utterly shocked. I remember looks like that when I was a child growing up in the 1970’s.

@Seymour5 We live in a very deprived area overall, vote reform sprayed on walls and flags everywhere. I live in the part of town that has a few roads where it’s another world compared to the streets full of terrace houses which were for mill workers and are still really cheap.

Many remain voters will look to their critical thinking skills but they often don’t have to live in it. Instead of hating leave voters it’s better to try and understand why and not just immediatley shout racist. I am upset my council is Reform and I would say I’m in an area where there is an actual chance of us getting a Reform MP. I’m mixed race in what is a very predominantly white area. What kicked off Reform doing so well here was the only local hotel took migrants. They laid off 25 staff and of course in a small town almost everyone knew someone who lost their job.

We have lived in this town for 26 years what made me stand out was my Southern accent and that’s all that made me feel different.I can honestly write that I have experienced some awful looks in my direction of late. DH actually saw a man really give me evils in a supermarket recently, he was utterly shocked. I remember looks like that when I was a child growing up in the 1970’s.

😆 🤣 😂

https://cepr.org/voxeu/columns/brexits-slow-burn-hit-uk-economy

"New data shows #Brexit has lowered UK GDP by 6-8% over the past decade. Investment down 12-18%, employment down 3-4%.

It's even worse than economists had predicted pre-referendum, because they thought there would be a bounce-back long term.

"Economists were roughly right on the magnitude of the impact, but wrong on the timing.

The consensus pre‑referendum forecast of a 4% long‑run GDP loss turned out to be close to the actual loss after five years, but too optimistic about the longer run."

This is a great example of the way the campaign asked people to vote with their emotions based on ideas. The 'will of the people' was one such idea. Many people were invigorated by the idea of the referendum itself, and the short term ability for everyday people to make a huge change. The will of the people was to gain the concept of sovereignty. We have that now. However, global politics is bigger than a blue passport. We are enmeshed with every nation we seek to trade with, and we have to follow their rules in order to trade with them, which involves a lot of compromise. EU membership meant we paid money in, we got some money out, but we also had easy trade with a huge economic bloc that had high standards and an insurance plan against war. They were the features that came with the subscription.