AIBU to be hurt and offended by husband suggestion of changing will?

[honeylulu]

I wondered whether to put this in legal matters but it's really about how I feel and if I'm being unreasonable to think like this.

Background - married to husband for 25 years (together 30). We have two children together, one a young adult at uni and I've just started secondary. This is my first marriage, he had a short marriage/divorce before we met. Neither of us have any children other than the two from our marriage. When our first baby was born we made mirror wills leaving everything to each other or if predeceased by spouse then to the children of our marriage (worded like that as we knew we would likely have another). Those wills have been in place for over 20 years. If it's relevant I drafted the wills as they were quite simple (I'm a solicitor, not a probate one but know my way around the basics).

Our house is the biggest asset, owned as joint tenants and no mortgage. There is also an age gap - he is 65 and I am 51. I'm also the higher earner and a lot of the lifestyle extras we enjoy (holidays, home improvements) are possible due to my income. We've both had modest inheritances over the years and put them towards paying off mortgage so completely merged into family assets.

Recently my husband's younger brother died suddenly. Still early days but he has left H half his estate. Won't be a vast amount but maybe 150k or so. H dealing with probate solicitors and remarked last week that we ought to get our wills updated (I don't disagree with that as some of the details are now out of date). The shock bit was that he said he is thinking of changing things so that I am only left a life interest in his assets so that they remain untouched for our kids to inherit when I die. Obviously that only applies to cash assets and chattels though he seemed to think it also applied to "his share" of the house (I reminded him that as joint tenants we dont have shares).

I am sensitive to the fact that he is shocked and grieving so we haven't talked about it properly. I did express some surprise and ask for the reason and he said it would be to keep his money safe for the kids in case I got remarried or conned by someone or it all went on care home fees. I have said fairly lightheartedly that I was quite offended as I also have our kids' best interests at heart and there is no way I would remarry etc for those very reasons. Being a lawyer, I'm extremely practical and risk averse.

I did ask why this change now, as it would have made more sense to insist on such a provision when we made the first wills in my early 30s, when it would have been a more realistic possibility that if I was widowed young that i could have remarried/had more children with someone else. He didn't explain further but I think the change is the inheritance he will now receive. I also suspect (which is why I have not pressed it further) that it has been prompted by his grief and sense/fear of his own mortality.

Why is it bothering me so much? It's not the money itself, it's the feeling that he doesn't trust me to do the best for our children. And our marriage vows - all that I have I share with you. It also feels a bit of a slap in the face that all the time I've had more income/savings I've been happy to share the benefits with the whole family but now he's getting a chunk of money he wants to keep it safe from me.

I'm not even sure it would be the best thing because if (assuming i do survive him) if I wanted to give the kids a house deposit or wedding gift I can only do that from my own funds. I couldn't give them anything "from dad" because his money would be locked up until I died.

So, am I right to feel hurt?
Or is he just being practical and sensible (and I should cut him some slack while he's shocked and grieving) considering I won't be left "poor" anyway? To be fair he's also suggested I should do the same in my will which would leave him worse off if I die first.

Sorry it is long. I didn't want to leave out/drip feed anything. There is probably more detail if needed but those are the main points I think.

I sort of see his point that he wants the kids to benefit - so there may be better ways of doing it eg he may be better off doing a variation of BIL will to leave it equally to your kids (in trust till they're 25 so less likely to be frittered away). that way the 150k is outside of inheritance tax from yours/his estate because it's been left directly to them, but leaves what you have now just as it is.

There’s a saying along the lines that when a spouse dies women mourn and men marry. In my experience this seems to be pretty accurate.

@nonumbersinthisname

i also don’t get the “avoid care home fees” bit. Yes, they are astronomical (my siblings and I are currently paying £5500 per month for my parent) but surely the very reason you save for your old age is so that you can be comfortably looked after?

That's fine IF you have all your mental faculties. But if you have severe dementia and don't even know where you are, don't recognise your spouse/family, etc., then it really doesn't matter whether you're in a council funded crap care home or an expensive self funded one, does it? You almost certainly won't notice the difference, yet your "estate" is being constantly eroded and you may well end up in the crap council home anyway when your funds run out!

Obviously very different indeed if you've still got your mind and want to live in comfort, relishing the support you are getting and being well looked after, enjoying entertainment or other facilities provided in the care home, etc.

But I think the statistics show that it's the dementia patients who are the more likely long term residents of care homes whereas those with more physical illnesses tend to only spend a relative short time of up to a year or two.

I would be very hurt too. Financial practicalities aside, the attitude would bother me. He's happy to have a good lifestyle off your high earnings which presumably come from holding down a resposible senior job, but when it comes to risking his half of the assets he sees you as a silly flighty woman likely to throw it all away on a Turkish toyboy. I couldn't help feeling it was a reflection of how he really sees you.

If you only have a life interest in his half how would that look in reality - if the house needs major repairs who would pay for them, if your health means you need to downsize or modify the house and the children don't agree, if they want to move in? If they own half of the house would that effect their 'first time buyer' status when buying their first house or paying stamp duty?

By all means plan the most tax efficient way to share money and assets with your children, but deciding to do that unilaterally is not fair. There's nothing to say your children won't enter into short lived marriages and lose half of it, or.make bad investments etc.

if they did they’d be full of it. He didn’t give birth and go on mat leave and bring up children, the usual reason for a salary imbalance. On the contrary, she had the babies and also mostly or all the time earned more and always shared completely, and here he is for what sounds like the first time ever with a large chunk of money and he instantly jumps on how he can not share it or jointly decide what to do with it. Maybe it’s the grief, in which case he’ll be horrified to realise what he’s done and they can mutually plan new wills that work. It is not financial abuse one bit for her to point out she could act that way too, she just never ever has.

I think he is just trying to safe guard the kids, that’s all, because we can’t know what will happen in the future. You do read of some awful stories, and yes, seemingly intelligent women being conned.

Perhaps you could ask him to use some of that money to all of your benefit right now. Why not he hires a villa the whole family can go to for 2 weeks?

He could give your kids a gift each asap before the new tax year starts in April, and he could provide them with the same amount straight after.

Maybe now is the time to get that new family car if you need one, or other major purchase. Or house / garden renovations.

From someone who’s been on the other side of this; when my dad passed away suddenly, he had left everything to my ‘step mum’, under the belief she would leave it to me. Unfortunately she turned out to be a complete twat without him and completely cut me out of her life, so I won’t see a penny. If he’d of thought she would do that, he’d of 100% done the same as your husband wants to do. He’s just trying to protect his children’s financial future, I wouldn’t take it personally x

I've only read your posts and not the whole thread so apologies if a pp has mentioned this. This phrase stood out for me if I wanted to give the kids a house deposit or wedding gift I can only do that from my own funds. I couldn't give them anything "from dad" because his money would be locked up until I died. That doesn't have to be the case - it could be drafted to allow the trustees to advance capital to your children as residuary beneficiaries during your lifetime if it was appropriate.

My husband are in our late 50s and have recently made Wills as your husband has suggested.
We both thought it sensible to do as if the surviving partner remarried the kids may not end up with anything. I have seen and heard of that actually happening as I have got older several times, so not as uncommon as you would think. Who knows what is going to happen 10 years down the line after one of us dies.
We would still be able to move house, downsize etc etc after one of us died, so there is still flexibility.
It won’t work if joint tenants though, you need to become tenants in common. I did this part myself through land registry.

I think if any of us want to ensure our kids definitely inherit our part of the assets this makes perfect sense.

Honestly if my husband started talking about leaving me a life interest in anything I'd be considering if I wanted to stay in the marriage. We're either a team, or we're not.

No, he wants his ‘share’ of the marital home included too. That’s not on - especially as OP has been the bigger earner. He wants to have his cake and eat it. If he wanted to leave just the inheritance to his children he could easily set up a trust fund entirely separately from their marital assets.

Why do you think dementia patients are less aware of their surroundings? My mum is 95 and has advanced dementia and I can assure you she knows the difference. You seem to be making a case for a lower standard of care for those with dementia, which is really not nice.

What he is suggesting is really common and often advised by solicitors- the risk it's addressing is eg he dies, you remarry, you die and suddenly all your joint assets belong to some random bloke. Obviously there are ways to prevent this (eg you don't remarry or, if you do, you take care to ensure that you leave all relevant assets to your children) but they're not something your husband will have any control over from beyond the grave. And of course all the same risks also apply in the other direction.

It sounds as if his brother's death has focused his mind on death as something real, not abstract. Definitely leave it a while as he is grieving but then I'd recommend you both take advice together on the pros and cons of redoing your wills as he suggests. I would try hard not to take it personally or assume that his concerns mean he doesn't trust you to do the right thing- he's simply being practical and suggesting a course of action that a lot of sols would say was very sensible.

(I'm also a solicitor in another field who has drafted her own super-simple will. I suspect that solicitors who do this sort of work tend to be more cautious because they have experience of things going wrong even when all parties are sensible and well-meaning. Definitely worth taking specialist advice, and I should probably do so too!)

I think he’s worried about Rachel and her inheritance tax changes. He is trying to ensure that HMRC doesn’t take two bites out of the apple from him to your DC. You’re the higher earner, you don’t need his assets when he dies. It is better for your DC to get some inheritance sooner rather than later after you die.

Hangry, I want you to get your ten horses! Why not?!

I have zero legal knowledge but only recently realised that any will (say of a widowed parent leaving everything to their DCs) is invalid on a new marriage from day one and the new spouse gets everything. I am not sure everyone realises this - even the widowed/newly married parent that they have inadvertently disinherited their DCs by poor admin.

I think this sums it up. His intentions may be honest in wanting to leave the inheritance to the children, but he seems to want to tie up his share of joint marital assets out of reach of OP should he die first. I’d be suggesting a trust fund for the children for the inheritance and insisting he leave the marital assets alone. There’s a big age gap here and in essence he’s trying to make sure he can control OP from beyond the grave.

I would suggest a compromise.

your DH varies his DBs will in favour of DC. A chunk of money for deposits in their 20s, rather than an inheritance as a mature adult will make a much bigger difference to DC lives. A much more tax efficient solution too.

The money that you have built up together should go to each other on trust that your DC will inherit at least half. Ask him why he thinks you might ever do anything contrary to DCs interests.

the choice isn’t posh private care home or scummy council care home. There aren’t any council care homes now, it’s whether the council will find a place for you in any private care home. They will try everything they can to not do that and to get you to stay at home in your house that crumbling around you with 4 brief visits a day from overworked carers to make you a sandwich and a cuppa. And who knows what state support will be available to us when we get to that age? I’m not optimistic.

I can assure you that no matter how ga-ga I may end up, I care very much whether I will retain my safety, privacy and dignity around people that look out for me, or lying in a bed in my own poo totally on my own waiting 8 hours for the next random, harassed carer to visit me. It’s no less than we’ve done for our mum.

My cousin has the same set up as you, and they have done as your dh has now suggested, for the same reasons. The only bit I’m not comfortable with is where your dh says he doesn’t want it wasted on care homes. Who exactly is he expecting to pay for your care?

It's always wise to revise Wills every five or so years.
In a few months seek specialist legal advice together.

In the meantime, ask DH if it would not be prudent to apply for a variation to his brother's Will and have the 150k directly go to your two children now.
The kids could have the means to purchase their own property due to the generosity of their uncle.

I get his thinking and yours.

He cant leave his half to the children if as you righy say.

I personally would be giving up the inheritaice in favour of th2 children ... avoids potential inheritance tax in the future.

I

How is it sensible? It’s a ridiculous suggestion and would make life very difficult for the OP in the event of her DH’s death. And don’t forget that it is she who has paid for the lion’s share of that house.

"DH wants to leave him the house, with me having a lifetime interest “so I can stay here as long as I like”. When he proposed it I burst into tears which surprised both of us.
Now, I have no problem whatsoever in that he will want to ensure that DSS inherits from his dad. But it was the blithe assumption on what would happen to my contribution (“well you don’t have kids of your own”) and the feeling of being trapped in this house"

Yes, that feels like taking all decisions out of your hands. What if you'd rather sell the house, and move somewhere else, or travel the world, or buy lots of <anything>?

Exactly. I’ve seen the sort of home ‘care’ provided by the NHS for my grandmother in recent years. If the OP or anyone else is in a position in the future to pay for a better standard of care in the future, then that is a perfectly good use the money and not something to be ‘ringfenced’ against at all costs. There’s no way I would want my own parents to struggle and suffer at the end for the sake of maintaining my inheritance.