To think people who work from home don’t understand this?! And they’re paid more usually

[Ugriap]

I work in a job where I can’t work from home. I get that’s my choice but when I trained, working from home was not common. Now it is in a lot of places. I know I can re train but it’s not that easy!

I can’t just go to appointments during my lunch break. I can’t ever do this. So I have to book leave if I want to get my haircut or dental appointments. Or I go on a weekend so I’m basically having less free time.

A close friend is a high earner and she is always galavanting round during the day then catches up on her work in the evening at her convenience. I can’t understand why people like this don’t get that I don’t have this flexibility?! My time is so much more limited. I feel really isolated from the friendship group these days

I hate to break it to you but life isn’t fair! Never has been, never will be.

I’m 45 and bottom rung of the ladder in retail and a lot of my friends have high paying jobs wfh. Op anytime I get bitter about my lot I thank goodness I’m not working overnight in a hospital or a care home. You’ve honestly got to get over this and be grateful for what you do have (let’s start with it sounds like you’re Monday to Friday? That’s good!) (sorry to be that person if it helps I don’t want to be!!)

I don’t think WFH is what you’re aiming for, it’s owning your diary and working flexibly. Even before I was WFH I was able to slip off for appointments, school events etc. But WFH can build on that further, but only if you’re in a position to own your diary, it’s not guaranteed, I assume call centre workers would have less flexibility even if WFH.

I found in these types of jobs, that conversely, people couldn’t understand why I couldn’t do something at the weekend or in the evenings, because I was working on an urgent project, often 60 hours a week, even if from home looked good from the outside.

I'm not sure why you think it's 'unfair' that two people who do completely different types of job have different types of working days.

A surgeon's day is different from an accountant's day. A bartender has a different work schedule to a nursery worker. So what?

If you both work full-time hours, you both have the same amount of free time, it's just that your schedules are different. It's got nothing to do with who is senior and who earns more and who works from home and who doesn't.

There will be people way, way more 'senior' than your friend who aren't able to work from home. There will be people way more junior than your friend who can.

Meh. I am the same as OP's 'friend'. I WFH, earn a six figure salary and I flex my job round my life. I am winding down towards early retirement and have reached the point where I give no fucks anymore. The company has had blood, sweat, tears, my mental health and nearly my marriage off me, with some of demands and expectations they have placed on me and hours I have worked. I now gallivant as much as I can.

My sister is the same. She WFH and always seems to be at the hairdresser or at her kids' plays and assemblies. She is in a high powered role so I can only assume she catches up later.

I WFH in what would be a 9 to 5 in the office. However as I'm at home, I start at 7am, take lunch 12-1, and finish at 5.30. I never go anywhere or do anything I wouldn't do in an office during my working hours. I treat it very seriously.

I work part of my jobs flexibly WFH. I definitely work more hours than I'm contracted for. So I might take the dog for a walk in the day but end up doing more hours overall for sure.

WFH is still working. Your friend looks to have flexible hours, which is different. My work has hybrid working. I have my hair cut at the weekend when I'm not working. I wouldn't take a day off because weekends are for this kind of thing. We're allowed time off for medical and dental appointments for treatment. I frequently work more than my contractual hours so my employer doesn't mind me going for dental check ups in work hours.

I’d never go get a haircut in the middle of my working day if I was employed by someone else for set hours. 😂 People don’t (or shouldn’t) do that.

As it is, Dh and I are self employed, so we plan our work around life. Nothing to do with wfh though.

But I’ve always gone to medical and dental appointments if needed during the day. It’s protected time off, even when I was employed. Though I’d have to still get the work done.

Is it just me or when people say “gallivanting”, does anyone picture someone pretending to be on a horse (like a child does) and making clip-clop sounds as they “canter”

I WFH and have never worked so hard in all my working life (of 30 years). I rarely take a full lunch break and if you think everyone is able to get appointments at lunch time how is that possible? We get them at completely unreasonable hours in the day and have to take the time off or work it back.

You are being ridiculous too about WFH having less annual leave.

If anything, WFH people are at risk of over working as it's all too easy to keep working through the evening.

As someone who wfh and has been so busy this week that I've logged off at 11 most nights...I don't agree. Yes it's good being able to pick up the kids (I do this once a week, they're in after school club the rest of the time). But having to make up the time later doesn't mean I have 'more free time' overall. I've watched half an hour of TV this week and been one 20 min walk, other than that I've been working eating or sleeping.

Yes you get people who take the piss wfh. You also get people who take the piss in the office. I had a boss who most of their off site or customer meetings were beauty appointments! And I used to sit next to someone who chatted most of the day, disappeared off for fag breaks frequently, hung out at the kitchen gossiping for ages, and had loads of sick days

Yes, specifically, this lovely horse.

I work from home most of the time and I don't gallivant around either. Unless it's a hospital appointment or something urgent where you take what you are given I book everything in my non-working time as I work part-time.

If I worked full time I would book appts on my WFH days as I'd need less time out of the "office". But I would still try to get early morning or lunchtime slots as far as possible.

What is unreasonable are people such as utilities not recognising this and still doing things such as having so-called 'appointments' which are 'we'll turn up at some point in the day or maybe not'. Openreach an example.

I’m finding (maybe not you personally op) that people who don’t have the option to work from home think that people who do work from home aren’t actually ‘working’ during this time. To the point the person I am referring to once suggested I host a group of friends including them, during my working hours as I was ‘working from home’. Perhaps where you’re not currently doing it, you’re assuming you’re working and the WFH person is not.

In regards to the ‘gallivanting’ more context is needed really, ie have they worked several hours past their actual hours and are taking the time back? Have they got a lull in their workload vs a recent time where they were extra busy and therefore are flexible working after having completed their work? So many variables

I work from home three days a week. I can take time out to put a wash on or bung the dinner in the oven, but generally I need to be at my desk during working hours. I couldn't get away with going out for an appointment.

DH also works from home, but in a senior role. He pretty much does as he pleases, will definitely go out for appointments or for a walk. He is measured on his output, not the hours he spends at his desk. The flip side is that he often works late into the evening, weekends and is regularly travelling abroad for work. It's hardly a skive.

What I'm saying is that this isn't a WFH vs Office issue. It's a seniority/ how your contribution is measured issue.

I don’t think most people working from home in jobs that were traditionally office based can work like your friend. At my work we are expected to be at our home desk and available for calls, teams meetings, email responses etc.

If your friend is only ever inviting you to socialise during what are essentially both your working hours then she's unreasonable. She should be working. Not meeting friends.

If it's not that then I don't see how you're being excluded from the friendship group. Surely nobody expects to socialise during working hours?

The fact you think WFH seems easier than your work doesn't mean it's true for every job. And your friend sounds like she's either slacking off or is senior enough to keep her own hours.

You’ve misunderstood the work from home concept with benefits provided by an employer.

WFH doesn’t equal flexible working. That comes from having a great employer who offers good benefits and mutual trust. It can also stem from seniority, as flexibility is a 2 way street. When the business needs it, you step up and work the extra until the job is done. You hinted that she’s high salaried and senior, she probably has skills that employers need to provide more competitive benefits for.

Working from home can also equate to a lower salary as well as higher. It’s job, industry and location specific.

Lastly, annual leave in the UK is directed by government minimums. 28 days including bank holidays. Extra allowance is again based on an employer providing a good benefits package

I suggest if you’re not happy, suck it up and retrain rather than blame others. I upskilled the last 4 years and I’m not receiving the benefits. Yes it was hard, but it was worth it.

I would guess that the majority of people who work from home totally get it as at some point in the not too distant past, we worked in offices. 6 years ago there weren't that many wfh or hybrid jobs.

I get it, OP.
I'm dealing with the estate of a deceased parent at present, and bristle when people at various banks, solicitors, utility companies, insurers etc say they'll 'give me a ring tomorrow to follow up on x, y or z'. As if I can just pick up my phone while at work to take a personal call. The frequency with which this has happened makes me think that WFH is now so prevalent that being able to take personal calls during regular working hours is now the norm rather than the exception.

Well I think your friend can look forward to being the first person laid off.

eh? I've worked in offices for 25 years and I've always been able to take important personal calls that can't be done after hours, eg. solicitors, doctors etc. I just dip into a meeting room if it's a personal issue.