To think we should get rid of all titles - Sir, Lord, Ms, Master, Prince etc.

[Ohfuckrucksack]

No more Lords, no more Sirs, no fretting about Ms, Mrs or Miss and definitely get rid of Master, Prince etc.

I listen to the radio with them having to insert the 'Sir' and 'Lord' before people's names as though these titles make them more important people.

Have we not gone beyond honorifics? Most of these people have done very little to deserve their extra titles and some are actively harmful individuals.

I am still pondering on the Dr title for medics - because that is a professional title rather than honorary but wouldn't use it for those with PHDs.

@LoserWinner

I’d like to start with getting school children to address teachers by first name instead of Miss/ Mrs / Mr.

A big YES to that. First names would be far better.

My son went to a "strict" school where proper salutations had to be used in school, with the head being a "Dr Smith" and several teachers also having doctorates and having to be called "Dr Jones" etc.

But outside school, in residential outdoors trips etc., the teachers told the pupils to call them by their first names. My son said it was a revelation as it was so much more relaxed and casual and "barriers" between teachers and pupils were broken so much more easily. My son found himself sharing a canoe with the headmaster and initially called him "Dr Smith" and was pretty anxious as he wsa only 11, but he immediately said to my son "call me Dave" and it immediately broke the ice and son had a whale of a time in that canoe! That relaxed attitude continued throughout the week during mountain climbing, pot holing, etc. It was the same with all the outside school activities, clubs & societies, sports teams, etc - teachers told the pupils to use their first names!

Back at school the week after the outdoor adventure trip, it was back to "Dr Smith", but the barriers had been broken and son found himself a lot more relaxed talking to all the teachers (even those not on the outdoor trip) about problems with school work, other pupils etc., as it all taught him about "respect" when appropriate i.e. in lessons, but also that the teachers were actually human and not some different/strict species who were approachable.

We've evolved a long way since the "doff your cap" days. In most professions/workplaces, we don't have the "Mr/Mrs/Ms" crap when dealing with colleagues, line management, etc., so it's antiquated that schools still insist on it. A bit like the outdated attitudes on uniform. Schools need to move on into the modern world. It's the outdated attitudes that seem to cause a lot of the problems. Calling a teacher "sir" and having to wear a tie on a hot day aren't going to solve behaviour and achievement problems - they'll make things worse!

@LoserWinner

Dont forget the Levellers

Ahead of their time too .

I don’t think you understand what a PHD is or what people have to do to earn the title Dr or Prof.

I do, but don't see why they expect everyone else, outside of their specialism/profession to defer to them. It's irrelevant out of context.

Most people don’t.
My students call me by my first name.
I introduce myself using my first name.
I don’t expect people to refer to me as Dr when talking to me or when talking about me.

However, when I’m specifically asked to provide a title. I give them my title. Which is Dr.

I do. I still don’t think people should use the titles except in a professional context.

I don't think most people would unless specifically asked for their title though.... and on that basis I too would be happy if we did away with titles in almost all circumstances

It's the difference between 'using' and 'giving', perhaps.

I tend to agree. I often wonder why I have to enter a "title" when fillng in every single internet form. What purpose does it serve? I virtually never use any titles (either my own, or anyone else's) when speaking. I can't think of the last time. I would use them occasionally when writing a more formal letter/email, but less and less often. It would certainly save having to guess someone's gender their name. I can imagine there would still be a few occasions when some people feel awkward just using first names, but I think that will continue to reduce over time.

On the PhD/Dr thing. I have a PhD and work as an academic. I don't use "Dr" outside work at all. I mostly use "Mrs", used to use "Ms" more but gradually stopped (not sure why!). I feel that many people have achieved far more than a PhD but don't get to insert that information into their name, so it just feels a bit weird to do that.

At work I would never introduce myself as "Dr". We just use firstname surname (maybe job title) on initial introductions and use first names after that. "Dr" appears on official documents, my email signature, my office sign and that's about all. Not even on seating plans usually these days.

Has anyone ever introduced themselves to you as "Dr" at a party??

Important to remember that different countries have different views on this. My DP has business cards with just his name and others with every qualification including his 10m Butterfly certificate depending where he’s going to use it.

What if I’m asked for my title? As I was when completing a form online today.

But why do we need/want medical doctors to announce their profession as part of their name? Thinking about it, I think I would find it more helpful if plumbers, handymen and window cleaners would do that than doctors. I'm looking for those far more often.

I don't see why we need to give titles on forms at all. It's vaguely irrititating that we need to.

Personally I've always chosen "Mrs" or "Ms" not "Dr". Not sure why. I guess it doesn't really feel like my title outside work. But it's just personal preference.

My SIL and I have the same name, I have a D.Phil. and she's a medic. My brother calls me the real Dr FruAashild and her the useful Dr FruAashild.

I do always refer to medical doctors as medics rather than doctors, never use my title professionally (everyone at work has a PhD and uses first names), I only use it in formal situations outside work when titles are required. Much like most medics do.

A friend's wife introduces herself like this all the time!!!!

Met her first when she was his new girlfriend years ago and thought it was because the PDH was recent at the time.

She's nice but does tend to talk a lot about her job and her university days.

I use my title whenever a title is required but don't introduce myself as Dr X in general conversation. It's never needed at work as we all have PhDs but I would include my title on the first slide if I was giving a talk.

Sorry to continue the derail, OP.

But I’m wondering, not accusing.

Lots of people have studied to gain qualifications but why do ‘Doctors’, medical or academic need a pre-fix when the letters after their name tell everyone what they are ? My dentist has years of study and qualifications, practical and academic. I call him John but people who may not know him as well will call him Mr XXXX.

The sign outside his practice gives his given and family names followed by his qualifications.

Ditto the Veterinarians I have met. Why would I call someone ‘Vet’, or if they specialise in surgery, Mr, Mrs, Miss, Ms. etc. I call them by their names.

A PhD literally means doctor of philosophy and confers the right upon an individual to use the title Dr. It’s the traditional and original meaning of the word doctor as the qualification is a doctorate. It means someone has achieved the highest level
of expertise in their subject.
Someone with a doctorate has earned the right to use the title dr should they wish.

As far as I’m aware, medical doctors were given the right to use Dr as a way of demonstrating their medical expertise.

Totally agree.

My PhD took me 7 years doing it part time alongside a full time job and a young family. I think I deserve to use the title I’ve earned! Hardest thing I’ve ever done.

I’ve never introduced myself as dr or insisted that I be called that but if someone asks me what my title is I’ll say Dr.

Personally no I don't expect people to call me Dr. It's on official documents and if it is an option when filling in a form, I will use it but it doesn't bother me if the option isn't given and in everyday life most people just automatically use Mrs. However, there are times when I might want to emphasise it, generally to someone being patronising.

I amuse myself. I am "Dame" on one website, "Sister" on another.

Yes, I understand that.

My question was, when the letters after their name detail their achievements, do they need the prefix ?

Need as opposed to tradition.

They don't need it, no. But when people are presenting themselves they don't usually say the letters after their names, do they? So in speech you would say "Dr. Sonjadog" rather than "Sonjadog Phd".

I can't think of anyone I know that would write "Dr. Sonjadog PhD". That is saying the same thing twice... which would be strange.

I don't know any Drs who introduce themselves as such in social settings, so the people on this thread must know some unusually socially awkward Drs. The Drs I know use the title professionally, or in situations when they are being directly asked their title.