Autism and Merlin RAP

[Perzival]

I think it's fair to say that the amount of people diagnosed with autism has increased by a huge amount compared to the amount of people who were diagnosed with the separate conditions prior to the change in the diagnostic manuals and people with a dx can vary between being a doctor and having a family, mortgage, social life etc to requiring 2:1 24 hour support with very limited communication.

This week Merlin that own Alton Towers, Thorpe park, Chessington and Legoland have decided to not give their ride access pass to people who struggle in crowds. This has caused uproar within the Merlin/ theme park groups as the majority of people who have this struggle have autism.

For those who aren't aware, in order to get a Ride Access Pass (RAP) you have to give evidence of your disabilities to a company called Nimbus who then decide what type of issues you have and give you a card with various icons on that you can them submit to venues for reasonable adjustments.

Throw in the commentary around the SEND white paper and the government review into why so many people are being diagnosed and i'm wondering if this is a more general move and one which is becoming more acceptable.

As the diagnosis has gone from previously representing mainly boy/ men with quite complex needs to representing a vast array of differring presentations and with an ever increasing amount of people being diagnosed, aibu to think that this is just the start and more venues/ places will limit or remove reasonable adjustments for this group of people?

AIBU= No, there isn't a push back against the autism diagnosis and adjustments made for the dx

AINBU= yes, more venues will start to remove or reduce adjustments for those with Autism

To avoid drip feeding I have a ds with profound autism and would imagine he will likely always get various reasonable adjustments (still gets RAP) etc.

Priority access to theme parks isn't a god given human right. If the queues, which are part and parcel, are too much then maybe consider it's not for you. There's no way every single person who self diagnoses or is diagnosed as autistic or adhd deserves to jump a queue. I'm fully including myself in this. Too many people want special treatment for themselves or their kids. Not everyone, not every kid, but too many.

There are people with autism who are able to queue

For someone with Autism you lack empathy for others with autism who struggle to queue

Alton towers used to have the perfect fast pass method for the big rides (showing my age!). You scanned your ticket and it gave you a time, you came back at that time and skipped the queue. If they reintroduced this it could work for everyone. I’m sure the money they miss out on from fast passes they would make up from food/ drink/ shop purchases as people wouldn’t be stuck in queues all day

They do still have a fast pass system but you have to pay for it, it varies depending on how many and which rides you wish to go on. A pp said that her family spends some of her child's DLA on a fast pass which sounds like a really good use of the money.

I do struggle to queue though, but I don't demand special treatment as a result. We're raising a generation who will constantly expect no challenges, no discomfort, constant special treatment. You can call it lack of empathy if you like, I'm just being honest about my view.

You could anticipate they would love the rides because they will swing for hours on swings at the playground, they love going to local funfairs they love it when you go over bumps in the car...

People will give me stick I am sure, but, is there not a point at which the theme park experience isn't one you want?

I mean, Jeeze, I like rides, but not crowds so much, and especially not all the faff and planning, so I don't go to theme parks.

I think there are so many people whose kids are not "neurodiverse" who have these exact same issues that they find it hard to be really sympathetic. They either don't go, or wait years until the child is older, whatever.

When it was a few heavily affected people it's one thing, but when it is a lot of people that seem to have the same struggles as those not eligible, it's another.

Absolutely, I couldn't agree more with this.

A question I guess. Surely a big part of this is making sure that

• the parks have the capacity to honour the RAP
• the terms of the RAP means that it actually provides physical access to the park for those who need it.

I have no idea about the capacity of the parks. I hate rides etc and Legoland is the only one I have been to.

However one thing I wonder is whether the increase in people with social difficulties in queuing has simply meant that there are too many people that qualify for a RAP in the park at once, for the people who really can't queue to access the park? I mean if you can't stand for 1h and so you have a RAP, but then so many people have a RAP that even the RAP queue might be an hour and a half, then the park is not able to provide access for that person. The park is dammed whatever they do, but maybe it's better to have narrower qualification ranges to make sure that the RAPs allow access to those most likely to really need it, rather than have people using them that could maybe manage without, and have them being no use to those who need them most!

Not just kids - DH is like that and hates crowds and queues - he goes supermarket shopping around 9pm (also gets cross with on-line food shopping). We travel at bizarre times so he avoids traffic queues, parks miles away from where we are going.
Fortunately he doesn't like theme parks so it was just me and children but went on school inset days so it was a little quieter.

That’s such a pity. The pass made those parks accessible to ds. He manages a max of 15 minutes queuing before he shuts down from the intensity of stimulation from standing next to people, unexpected touch, competing smells, and noise. Waiting isn’t an issue because we can move around, or stand off to the side. It’s queueing that unravels him.

He still only went on 4 or 5 rides before he’d had enough, so it wasn’t that he was getting any more rides than anyone else. And it was a huge boost to his self esteem to bring his dsis with him. It was only time that his diagnosis was an advantage on a day out. Usually his issues cut days short or rule them out.

I’m sure we look like a family taking the piss because ds looks so normal. He gets to feel normal too, doing something that all his friends get to do. Riding a rollercoaster is one of the rare times I see him experience uncomplicated joy.

For those who don’t get this, maybe the next time your child laughs, imagine what it would be like if you hardly ever got to hear that sound because that’s my life.

Did people get nimbus cards with self diagnosis? We had to provide evidence that he had a diagnosis and evidence of his difficulties.

I was uneasy about the privacy issues but put that to one side because it meant so much to ds.

People don't just think that people are taking the piss because kids "look normal:. They think it because they hear people talk about it or they talk about it directly.

I suspect there is a bigger issue with theme parks at play.

That is, they have become so busy, so many people, such long waits, and so much noise, that they are a problem at some level for almost everyone.

The busier and more stressful they get, the more people are really edged out of being able to use them.

But also, the busier and more stressful they get, the more people are tempted to fudge things to get easier access.

Now - if there were not special passes, at a certain point fewer people would go, and the park would need to make changes.

In some ways it may be that the passes have kept some people coming who otherwise would not have bothered. But it also means that the people who can't qualify are also waiting more and more in a more stressful environment. That is, it's meant they don't see that they need to reduce tickets or find some other solution to make the experience less unpleasant for everyone.

There are other places with rides as well as the Merlin parks. Paulton's Park in February or October half term is brilliant - even the most popular rides will have 10 minute queues at certain points of the day. I don't remember queuing for long for anything at Hyde Park Winter Wonderland (we went before it got dark).

You are delusional ! Do you expect people with autism on a severe spectrum to wait hours ? Or do you just think they are not worthy

Absolutely AMEN to this. Couldn't have put it better!

I think theme parks might not be the ideal location to take someone in that instance. More broadly, the point I was making was that I don't believe everyone who claims to need to queue jump is worthy, no.

Where do you think the ideal location is for those who are severely disabled with autism? Their world is already extremely small. Is it just those on the spectrum or all individuals with life limiting learning disabilities. Shocker that those with the cognivity that will remain childlike likes the excitement of a thrill ride

It’s the fault of people playing the system and taking things they don’t really need. The system collapsed and those who do need it suffer.

The more I think about this, the better it gets. People self elect out off stuff they don't like/want to do all of the time. I don't go to VR experiences because they make me feel ill, I don't go to expensive attractions because I can't afford it, I don't go to TV themed stuff because I have no interest. I don't go to big arena level concerta because I don't like crowds, I don't go on holiday in rush hour because I don't like traffic.

I started this thread because i was worried about the bigger impact of these changes to RAP and whether my ds would be limited because of association by diagnosis of people who are taking the piss. I do think the autism diagnosis needs to be split so people like my ds aren't impacted by the grifters or those who can't parent their kids when "they're a little bit bitey" towards their sibling as one poster put it.

I honestly feel the best way forward is to separate out those who have the most severe needs to protect them.

If you do agree with the changes please email Merlin and let them know:
[email protected]

Yes, but the key element of the theme park is rides, not queueing.

I do think it needed pulling back a bit, but it needed to happen any fairer way, and with the ability to challenge the classifications.

I totally agree. The difficulty is you will butt up against those who say that there's no such thing as mild autism, it's how mildly their autism affects others, and that it's unfair to subdivide. The impact of this being, is that the rights of the most profoundly affected, and their families, are reduced.

I don't have autistic children, but from having a child with a different (non-cognitive) disability, it feels like because the 'milder' affected are more capable of using their voice, to campaign for rights etc, and that their voice has become the main one heard. So autism friendly things are anything but for the profoundly affected.

It's very painful to watch.

This is spot on. I can't count the number of sessions, schools, autism friendly events etc that my son has had too much autism for.

By the nature of the disability (social communication) those who aren't as impacted are better able to advocate for themselves. It's crazy.

Totally. I find myself/my child excluded in conversations/considerations etc because ND is the only aspect that seems to be considered sometimes.

It's like doing low noise/autism friendly stuff, maybe having a quiet room and a fidget spinner is seen as making adjustments for kids with disabilities, without realising that only fits a segment of the ND community, not the more profoundly affected within that community and not all the kids that have other disabilities, including physical disabilities.