Vegan baby

[Expecteddeclathon]

In your opinion, is it ok for a baby to be vegan from weaning (6 months)?

Isn't it called dairy because it's the building cows go to get milked? Therefore milk and all products made from milk are traditionally called dairy but women don't go to a building to get milked so you can't call breast milk dairy.

No judgment here of vegans, I am vegetarian. But just wanted to share that my friend had to swap her child from vegan to vegetarian/pescatarian (the kid decided they want to eat fish fingers!) as the child wasnt growing well and it seemed to be linked. They raised their other two children vegetarian as a result.

Soy contains an excess of oestrogen, so not always a great choice for children.

I think that, as all animals do, the needs of my child come first. That's how the species survives.

Whether we deserve to survive as a species is another issue, but as parents we should be giving our children the best shot at being healthy and strong. Which is what animals other than humans do for theirs. Lions don't question whether they should source alternative protein for their young, they feed what they need.

I'm sorry if I am repeating 100 others as the thread is too long to read all the posts (but I have read all of OPs posts). A vegan mum/vegan baby MUST supplement B12. There is no adequate natural source of B12 for a vegan. It must be a supplement or artificially fortified food. It is probably worth getting specialist medical advice on how to do this appropriately. Without B12 the child will develop nerve issues and cognitive impairment/learning disability amongst other things.

https://www.vegansociety.com/resources/nutrition-and-health/nutrients/vitamin-b12/what-every-vegan-should-know-about-vitamin-b12

Yes, as others have said, as long as adequate care is taken around protein and minerals etc. I've always been veggie and my son was (still is) lactose intolerant so has been mostly vegan (doesn't have to be religious about it and reaction not as bad as it was when he was little but still gets the squits from ice cream etc) for most of his 30 years.

He had a soya formula when I stopped feeding him.

Please make sure your baby gets enough saturated fat for their brain development, and at 6 months they need iron. Would you consider giving your baby eggs? They are nutritional powerhouses, especially the yolks. They are comparable to breast milk in that they contain similar fatty acid profiles, high bioavailability, and essential nutrients like choline, Vitamin D, and iron. I am a nutritionist, btw.

All dairy is milk but not all milk is dairy.

Dairy refers to a food product which is farmed agriculturally for human consumption.

Human milk is biologically for human consumption. It is not farmed.

Cows milk is not vegan. Human milk is vegan. I would even raise a question at whether consuming the milk of a human other than your own mother is vegan?

I think vegan is too restrictive for a baby, vegetarian gives a lot more options for healthy fats, calcium, b12, iron etc. I also find most vegans I know eat a fair amount of UPFs, and supplement. I think babies are best weaned on whole foods/homemade with as little ultra processing as possible and to get their nutrients that way.
You need to speak to a dietician or a paediatrician

I would be very careful with this, as babies are developing. They need fats etc. If you plan to do this, I would do research AND along with a nutritionist who specializes in vegan diets for babies/children.

I would be very concerned that baby is getting their nutritional needs met. I’d book an appointment with GP or reach out to health visitor for some advice on how to do this safely and to ensure your baby is getting what they need. Make sure you are going to regular weigh ins to ensure they are continuing their growth path and I’d consider continuing to breastfeed for another 12-18months.

My issue is that I don’t understand why this conversation is even happening. Veganism is a system of ethics. Breast milk is vegan. Vegan mothers breastfeed their babies.

Why are we discussing what food group breast milk is in? How is it remotely relevant to whether or not it’s appropriate to raise a child as vegan?

Shouldn’t we be talking about what vegan babies don’t eat? Why are we discussing something that they do eat?

If you haven’t already, speak to your GP or local feeding clinic for guidance to ensure the child is getting a balanced diet. You will just be inundated with opinions here that are not based in fact.

Would this be a compromise?
https://www.ahimsamilk.org/

No it isn't. The child will lack essential nutrients for healthy growth.

Because some people have nothing better to do than try and pick illogical holes in other people’s belief systems to hopefully prove them wrong. It’s a ridiculous argument.

As a happy carnivore it wouldn’t be for me - however it is entirely your choice to make. I would advise speaking to a paediatric nutritionist to ensure they are getting everything they need because it is very very easy for a child to become malnourished and venture into problems and SOME individuals vegan diet can be absolutely rubbish! Just as some meat eaters have shit diets of course. You really do need to do the research on this and instinctively I wouldn’t be entirely happy with it but it’s not my child!

As I said in another comment, the actual definition of veganism is "abstaining from the use of animal products and the consumption of animal source foods" - the philosophy is optional.

Breast milk is an animal product, so it's NOT technically vegan, even if ethical vegans find it non-objectionable. But vegan mothers should breastfeed their babies if possible, yes.

I was merely correcting your misinformation that breast milk is NOT an animal product. It absolutely is. That's really all that needs to be discussed.

All health agencies say it's OK as long as it's a balanced diet with the usual fats , proteins, carbs, vitamins. I'm not the best person to give tips as I went vegan after I raised my kids omni and if they want to change now they're old enough to choose. But there are plenty of vegan families out there, I'd ask them rather than Mumsnet tbh. Speak to your own doctor as well if you are worried. What I will say is that my omnivore husband has low b12. I also know at least 2 other omnivores who are low on b12 and get injections. Deficiencies are very common on any diet. That doesn't mean pay no regard to nutrients, it's just a fact that meat/dairy doesn't equal health.

Veggie yes without a doubt, prob not vegan because would be time consuming and difficult for most working mums and dads. I personally think it's very hard to get the nutrients into very young children going vegan and be a lot of supplements, such as B12 and calcium. I'd probably allow cheese and eggs, good source of protein.

Actually, its does. The pancreas stops producing the enzymes required to digest meat and the gut microbiome also lacks the bacteria required. It takes a while of very gradually introducing it in small amounts and building it up to be able to effectively tolerate and the digest meat. For some people, they never can.

Humans have and do drink the milk from other animals that produce enough of it, sheep, camel, horse etc. Its not popular here as such but around the world there are different preferences

we dont drink the milk of every single animal, say cats, dogs, rabbits, giraffe etc etc because of practicality and logistics. We've chosen the animals that give the best yield and are easier to herd/farm. Thats obvious

Humans are omnivores, we have developed to be that way, the amino acids in plant based foods are sometimes not wholly present in each protien source which means you need to be really really careful as an adult making sure you eat the volume needed and variety needed to get the right types of protein. Its very hard with a small baby.

I wouldnt do it, but OP has made up her mind by the sounds of it.

That’s not the definition of veganism. This is the definition of veganism from the Vegan Society, the people who literally invented the word (they brainstormed it at their first meeting in November 1944). You can’t say “the philosophy is optional” when it’s literally defined as a philosophy.

Breastmilk is vegan.

"Veganism is a philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable—all forms of exploitation of, and cruelty to, animals for food, clothing or any other purpose; and by extension, promotes the development and use of animal-free alternatives for the benefit of animals, humans and the environment. In dietary terms it denotes the practice of dispensing with all products derived wholly or partly from animals."

I don’t think it’s good for any child to be vegan or vegetarian to be honest; unless you do it with expert help and are absolutely certain they are getting a balanced diet and enough protein and nutrients. I suspect most aren’t to be honest..!

I'm ignoring that entire debate on both sides as it's entirely non-sensical and utterly irrelevant (not to mention incredibly tedious).

Do what you like, just don’t go on about it to everyone. I have a colleague who has raised her children vegan from day for and Christ, doesn’t everyone know it. She literally teared up at a picnic once when my toddler ate a steak sandwich and told me I was going to be responsible for her future heart attack.

But seriously, it’s your child. Do what you like.