‘You’re lucky you’re neurotypical and able to focus’

[Hangerbout]

I get annoyed that hard work and self-discipline is dismissed as ‘luck’ and a sign that someone is ‘neurotypical’.

I was reading a thread on here about WLI weight regain which then made me remember a comment from a colleague who had successfully lost a lot of weight on WLI, which then made me remember comment from another colleague who had recently got a private diagnosis of ADHD (which is in the title of the thread).

The comment from the colleague on WLI:

‘I was really struggling with my weight, which had increased due to menopause. When I took the drugs, total game changer. All of a sudden, I had no food noise. I was actually forgetting to eat. Then I realised, this is what normal is. This is how others normally are’

I just get aggrieved by these types of comments. Actually, sometimes the qualities of a person are a choice, not some kind of genetic gift. Is it just me that thinks this?

Well, science disagrees with you in a vast number of cases.

I am usually the #1 performer in any admin/repetitive tasks at work. As in, I normally perform about 25% better than my next nearest competitor. I put no effort into this whatsoever. My colleague shadowed me once to see if he could pick up tips, and his takeaway was, "she does the same things as I do, just really fucking fast".

But go ahead and think your judgement of other people is more accurate than science if you like.

YABVU perhaps you should try living with the shoe on the other foot! You have literally no idea how lucky you are.

Well I partly agree with the weight loss comments because even though I am slim, I really exercise a lot of self discipline and work very hard to eat well and keep track of my calories. It is very irritating when people think I am slim due to “luck” or lack of “food noise”. Lots of people on weight loss injections could lose the weight without them however, neurodivergent people will always struggle with certain tasks more than a neurotypical person so I wouldn’t be annoyed at those kind of comments.

It's probably a bit of both.

I think there's also a large element of practice and skill building - there are a lot of hidden skills behind "simple" things, which some people are lucky to have taught or modelled to them as a child (they may not specifically remember learning as it was just part of daily life) whereas others have to develop those skills as an adult. Including actual physical skills, such as planning and cooking healthy meals, and emotional skills, such as how to speak kindly to yourself and how to manage stress and low mood without resorting to biscuits or alcohol.

YANBU. I agree. I am slim, but I put a lot of unseen effort into it.

No one knows what problems other people have. I don't actually believe in the concept of being neurotypical I think everyone is different with their own problems. And I agree with the OP people who 'have a diagnosis' then lumping everyone else together is really irritating, they don't know what goes on in my mind any more than I know what goes on in theirs.

I can see how it would be annoying in a way, it’s like saying ‘if I had have had this it would have been easy’, kind of like the people who say ‘I don’t get how everyone can’t do this, I have this issue and that’s the reason I can’t’

Ps this thread will so be shut down

Some things I’m naturally good at. Some things I’m good at have required (and may still require) a great deal of effort.

Most people won’t be able to tell the difference.

Individuals would be better served by concentrating on improving their own performance in the areas important to them and spending less time on thinking it’s “easier” for others. You have no idea what other people’s lives are like or what is “easier”.

I’m slim, and put absolutely no effort into it whatsoever. Some people are just lucky in some areas, and unlucky in others. I also have ADHD, but just don’t get food noise in the way it sounds like other people do (I don’t really know what it means tbh, but I count my blessings for that. One less thing for me to try and be disciplined about and fail at)

I agree with this. I am not sure about the hard work/discipline aspect the OP raises so much, but I do think that ND people sometimes overestimate how easy "NT" (if there is such a thing) people find things. I don't really think most of the world finds focus easy and only ND people don't, for example, nor do I think "normal" people have no food noise, looking at the OP's WLI example.

Ultimately none of us know what it is like in each other's heads, but I think OP has a point about the division between easy for one group/hard for others, unless you're an extremely lucky person most people have varying degrees of difficulty with most things.

Ultimately you only receive a diagnosis if things become so disordered that it requires a "label." I'm autistic and I don't think I can fully explain how hard it is to sometimes just function

I don't doubt staying slim or focusing requires hard work for many/most people but for some, due to the way their brains and bodies are wired, they are much, much harder to the point of being almost impossible. So yes, you are fortunate.

I think you’re being really unreasonable on the ADHD point and discipline.. you’re showing you have zero understanding of neurodivergence if you think it can be fixed by an increase in discipline. It’s literally brain wiring and chemistry, it’s scientific, not laziness and a lack of focus. However I do somewhat agree with you on the weight loss point, I do believe that comes more down to a lack of discipline if you over eat, under exercise and therefore gain weight.

Tbh, I haven't taken weight loss drugs. But have lost nearly 3 stone since starting ADHD meds, with no effort or changes...I just didn't have the intrusive impulses to eat that I had before. I also spend less money for the same reason, fewer controlling impulses. I will never know how it feels to be neurotypical in this regard, and as such would hope for the same consideration in return.

I have done very well academically, and it really irritates me when people assume I did so because I was born “clever”. I’m also good at crafts and so often I’ve had, sarcastically: “Is there anything you CANT do?!”

In fact, I was not brilliant at school at all, and it was only when I became extremely disciplined about studying and doing the hours and hours of work required to achieve good results (even when I HATED doing it) that I did well at University.

I don’t believe I will do well at anything, or learn anything, unless I am determined to put in the effort.

So when someone says, “Oh I wish I could knit like you; I’m so bad at things like that”. The voice (kept silent) in my head thinks: “Bet you haven’t sat down and put in the hours of perseverance required to learn how”.

Edited to add: I understand someone ND will find it harder to put those hours in, but it would not be accurate to think I achieve what I do exclusively because I am NT. My ‘natural’ setting is a bit crap at everything unless I try.

I don't overestimate NT people.

Yes we all have issues, its just I have these issues on top of every day issues and family problems and work and life so it's makes it harder to deal with everything with limited energy capacity. Good ol' dopamine.

I'm ashamed to admit this but I put my energy into work this week. I had a mountain of pots that needed dealing with and for 5 days I left it because my brain couldn't cope. I finally did it last night at 11pm and I was proud of myself for tackling it.

If you have those kind of issues then sure, you understand. Unfortunately this happens with multiple things. I hold down my job, my bills, my car, my shopping all of that but unfortunately my disability fucks up my home life. I also go to the gym and have to deal with my partner's mental health on top of my own issues so am trying not to burn out. Dead fun this shit is. Oh and I'm unmedicated so am raw dogging this.

What an outrageously ignorant and ableist thread. Neurodiversity is not a choice.

I was always told I wasn't working as hard as others - realised it was utter bullshit when I went to uni and could see the hours I put in. Finally got near testing and yep dyslexia and dspraxia and then everyone comments changed to well we always thought that.

It's increasingly ADHD as well as that in my family - and it's often a drag on ablities as most of my family are hard wroking and relatively successful.

My DC had to do a lot of support work at home on top of school day to catch up but once they had fundamentals they flew and have done well. Number of people predicting they never would was stupid though.

It's perfectly possible to be ND and work hard - in fact most have to to get same results.

YABVU regarding neurodiversity. Neurodiverse people can manage their condition but that is all. They can’t re-wire their brain!

On initial diagnosis, some neurodiverse people relax and stop masking after years of effort. It is because they are exhausted with trying to meet societal expectations. Being neurodivergent can feel like living as a blind person in a world made for sighted people. It is more effort just to function in a basic way.

Rather than resenting those who live with this kind of disadvantage, have some empathy for them. Your self discipline benefits you, so although you can feel sorry for yourself, remember that you are reaping the rewards and will continue to do so.

I would never think that. I'd think what incredible achievements this person has.

I would not think it was because you are NT. I also have achievements in my life and I'm ND.

I do believe though that some people have a more natural affinity with somethings. Yes effort can hone a skill but to some it can come so naturally, like creating art. I mean we can't all be good at things can we?

Like not everyone can sing. And some people might be able to sing but they don't have star quality. It's just different level of ability in skills and achievements isn't it?

But of course hard work features. And what did Theodore Roosevelt say? "Nothing worth having comes easy."

Just be happy with yourself, the rest of comments about your achievements is noise really.

You can only make good choices if you have good options

I think you're underestimating how much effort it can take to reach what other people see as a baseline for normal.

I'm dyspraxic, you wouldn't believe how much mental energy it takes me to not spill, break or drop things. Now that I'm a mother, I'm spending a lot of mental energy just trying to not spill, break or drop my child or things on my child!

On the converse side I'm naturally thin and have a low appetite. It takes 0 discipline for me to look a healthy/attractive weight. I absolutely understand that some people are different and can't stop thinking about food and that it plagues them and costs them a lot of mental energy and grief to constantly battle against their impulses.

It can be jarring to be told that you find things easier than other people, but just bear in mind it doesn't mean that you don't put an effort in at all, it just means it takes you less effort than someone who has a neurodiversity/disability/addiction