To seriously recommend Ireland

[Ionablue]

Before I start I completely get that it can be expensive, the weather is bad and many Irish residents are emigrating for accommodation & opportunities. But....
A very very large proportion of the Irish people seem put on earth specifically to restore visitors faith in human nature. Genuine and warm, great sense of humour
Many women in particular supposedly find Ireland blissfully relaxing, not just because it is a laidback culture but because the general male culture seems to revolve less around making women feel uncomfortable than in other countries.

Some of the countryside and heritage is literally heavenly. Co. Waterford, especially its western extremities eg Dungarvan. Ardmore, Lismore, is an undiscovered gem.

Yes its not cheap but the food can be exceptional.

Most ordinary people seem exceptionally well disposed to foreign visitors and many have relatives abroad.

In rural Ireland you can drive for miles without seeing a car.

The music is brilliant and the people seem enormously invested in live music.

Well, that's my tuppence.

Of course its Ireland!! Northern IRELAND.

You know what she means. The country of Ireland. Northern Ireland isn't part of Ireland the country. There is a border. Northern Ireland is part of the UK with the pound, the NHS, different social services, different leaders, a different history, different politics, different laws etc. They aren't one and the same no matter how many people might want them to be. Correcting people wrongly because you very much want them to be one and the same still doesn't make it so.

Just curious if you think South Korea and North Korea is the same country?

Never been would love to go

You know why the Highlands are so empty and picturesque, right?

Too hilly to build on?

? Wtf ?

They're both on the Korean Peninsula, and the fact that there's a border there is due to conflicting imperialists, not due to any innate differences in language or culture.

Obviously, cultural and economic development since the division of the peninsula has been in radically different directions. This doesn't diminish the fact that the two halves are part of an ancient culture that was distinct from neighboring cultures.

Like many borders all over the world that the Conservative Party had a hand in (in Eastern Europe, Africa, and the Middle East) the one dividing Ireland is also highly artificial.

Nope.

The person who I was referring to said Belfast isn't in Ireland. That's like someone saying Pyongyang isn't in 'Korea'.

I am going to guess that you were neither born nor raised on any part of the island. I merely surmising that you have no first hand experience of the deeply ingrained cultural idenities at play in the issue of being from the North of Ireland, or you are really playing devil's advocate by using this comparison. Maybe you're an Ulster loyalist? Northern Ireland is in Ireland.

Thanks for the map. I grew up there so I know that Northern Ireland is under British rule. However, it is not wishful thinking to say that it is in Ireland. I am Irish because I was born and raised on the island of Ireland. My official nationality is Irish even though I was born in the North. Northern Ireland is technically a part of the UK, but it is also part of Ireland at the same time. I am by no means a hard-core Nationalist but to many Irish people, Ireland is all of Ireland, despite the differing political situations.

They are obviously both still Korea. Just as Northern Ireland is still Ireland.

It was my day to day experience working for an Irish company, yes. And not just mine.

In Ireland?

I live 20 minutes away from the border . Have lived in the republic all my life but when I go out shopping or out for food I spend roughly half my time up north or down south and I have family living in the north for years. Not a nationalist either and yes there are some differences but regardless we are all living on the same island clearly.

But that’s not what I meant.

I know there are loads of Irish people in NI.
I wasn’t talking about Irish people or where they live.

What I meant is…if we’re talking about ‘Ireland’, in my head that means the state (ie ROI) not the island unless it’s specifically clear from the context that the Island is meant (rarely). So I would have assumed this thread was about ROI.

I did say I thought people in NI might think differently. I think people in GB do too tbh.

I do think your MIL to be (at the time) made an extremely insensitive comment and I’m sorry you experienced that.

That’s totally different. You can’t just drive between North Korea and South Korea in 5 minutes to do your shopping and go on a night out. North Korea is literally a horrific dictatorship. There is no comparison between these 2 states and Ireland/northern Ireland.

Growing up, it never crossed my mind that not being part of the Republic of Ireland bit of Ireland meant I wasn't from Ireland. In fact, we just referred to it as 'Down South', possibly in the way people in Manchester would refer to London. To say that people rarely mean the island of Ireland when discussing Ireland literally undermines the lived experience of hundreds of thousands of people living on the island who consider their home in the North of Ireland to be in Ireland!

Living in Ireland is different to visiting. Even for native Irish it’s hard to meet and make friends if you’ve moved to the area. I’m sick of the rain and it’s soooo dark in winter. Too much traffic on the roads, the country roads are not built for all these ridiculously oversized SUV’s. We’re living in dhs home town ten years now and I only finally feel settled.
dh and I always talk about how much friendlier the people up north are compared to the republic

Yes, the bungalows... 😱 🤣

As I said I recognise that people from different parts of the island probably think differently about this.

I only brought it up because there did seem to be some confusion on the thread about where exactly we were talking about when talking about Ireland, eg some posters were quoting crime statistics from NI and others were saying they weren’t relevant; a pp mentioned Belfast and another said that’s not relevant etc.

To check I wasn’t going mad, I did a quick survey of the people I happened to be with tonight. I simply asked, ‘If I said ‘Ireland’, would you think I was talking about the country (aka ROI) or the island…ie plus or minus NI?’
They all said they’d assume the country. Not the island. Not including NI.

All the people I spoke to tonight were from Cork. Day to day anything to do with politics, laws, schools, health etc…it’s always just the state that’s relevant you see.

I consider people from NI to be Irish obviously (if they do themselves), but if I were referring to, say, Belfast I’d always say it was in Northern Ireland, not in Ireland. I wouldn’t really use the term North of Ireland instead of Northern Ireland.

To say that people rarely mean the island of Ireland when discussing Ireland literally undermines the lived experience of hundreds of thousands of people living on the island who consider their home in the North of Ireland to be in Ireland!
I’m very sorry that you find it undermining, but I think what I said is probably true for a majority on the island. I think it’s certainly true where I am in the far south. Unless talking in particular contexts, Ireland now means ROI here.

I’m sorry if this is shocking you @Icelap. I’d be interested to hear what others further north in ROI think.

Also, just to add that I didn’t actually say upthread that ‘people rarely mean the island of Ireland when discussing Ireland’ as you said I did.

I actually said ‘I think when lots of Irish people say Ireland they generally mean the state also known as the Republic of Ireland, not the island’. I added that I thought Irish people in Northern Ireland may feel differently about that.

(While I did use the word ‘rarely’ it was only in reference to my own opinion, ie I rarely think this...)

So you did misunderstand and misquote me a little bit I think. I wasn’t undermining the opinions of those in NI. I acknowledge people there feel differently, but it’s just that we don’t all feel the same way about this and the confusion on this thread has made that clear.

Yes, very true. People almost think you or I are a troublemaker for spouting up that Ireland is Ireland.

Both sides of the border have the same issues in different areas, people focus on the negative up the north, as certain areas are highlighted and they focus on the positive side in the Republic, when both sides have the same problems depending upon the area you live in….

The Malone road won’t have the same experience as Andersonstown or shankill, Nor will Malahide have the same experience as inner city Dublin.
It’s interesting to see the difference perspective on how the country runs based on personal experiences.

I’m sorry if this is shocking you . I’d be interested to hear what others further north in ROI think.
From Derry to Kerry is Ireland.
I would say a lot of people feel Ireland is Ireland, stolen land, the Catholic communities in NI are very much considered Irish, the history and culture of Ireland is very much surrounded by the troubles, the bad deal we got loosing the 6 counties, as children in the 80’s we prayed for the people every night, relationships with NI and the republic have always been entwined, especially in the border counties and Dublin.