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So upset about ICE killings in Minnesota

903 replies

Allotmentblackfly · 24/01/2026 23:55

So upset about the killings. No investigation and victim blaming from the Trump administration. I see no hope for America. Trump will cancel the midterms possibly elections or will rig them. The most powerful western country - one we thought was our friend is dying
im so sad for the bereaved and do sad for the country

OP posts:
Thread gallery
48
1dayatatime · 30/01/2026 10:43

ScrollingLeaves · 29/01/2026 23:42

@1dayatatime That is Fox News is being selective. ICE was not only arresting illegals immigrants who were criminals. That’s what they were originally doing but that was not what was happening in this latest movement. They were being indiscriminate.

Absolutely that is selective- ICE are not only arresting violent criminal illegal immigrants that have raped children but also arresting regular illegal immigrants. But they have both entered the US illegally.

Equally @DdraigGochwas being selective in her link the case of a 5 year old boy. ICE are not seeking to deport children simply adult illegal migrants.

1dayatatime · 30/01/2026 10:50

LlttledrummergirI · 30/01/2026 08:43

Absolutely no comparison here, nothing to see, move along.

This is really offensive, minimises the death of 6 million Jews in the holocaust.

You are trying demonstrate equivalence of keeping Jewish people captive with an end objective to exterminate them with keeping people captive who have entered the US illegally with an end objective to return them to their home country.

This is woefully ignorant, really twisted and anti semetic.

RufustheFactuaIReindeer · 30/01/2026 11:23

I actually thought Obama was very reasonable on immigration. I voted for him
in 2008

he probably was…but most people seeing those conditions in the immigration centres would have an issue with it

so far if anyone says how bad the conditions are under trump posters seem to retort with ‘ well Obama did it’ as if nothing can change…or should change

RufustheFactuaIReindeer · 30/01/2026 11:26

We've had the same Holocaust fantasisers say 'ah but the nazis didn't start murdering Jews it evolved over 10yrs' yet when I and others pointed out Obama had detainment centres in 2016 with alleged mistreatment and in 10yrs it has notevolved to mass murder you get 'whataboutery!

you seem very fixated on the 10 years bit, though i agree completely with you regarding concentration camps

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 12:02

RufustheFactuaIReindeer · 30/01/2026 11:26

We've had the same Holocaust fantasisers say 'ah but the nazis didn't start murdering Jews it evolved over 10yrs' yet when I and others pointed out Obama had detainment centres in 2016 with alleged mistreatment and in 10yrs it has notevolved to mass murder you get 'whataboutery!

you seem very fixated on the 10 years bit, though i agree completely with you regarding concentration camps

I'm fixated on it because it has been thrown at me repeatedly 'the nazis didn't start with the mass murders it evolved over 10yrs' hence my 2016 link re US centres, that hasn't 'evolved' to mass murders.

I really think posters should try to show some sensitivity and awareness about the horrors of the nazi death camps and stop this sickening comparison.

RedTagAlan · 30/01/2026 12:55

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 12:02

I'm fixated on it because it has been thrown at me repeatedly 'the nazis didn't start with the mass murders it evolved over 10yrs' hence my 2016 link re US centres, that hasn't 'evolved' to mass murders.

I really think posters should try to show some sensitivity and awareness about the horrors of the nazi death camps and stop this sickening comparison.

It's the 14 points of fascism.

The 14 Characteristics of Fascism - Center for Pluralism

Just tick them off, weighing each point as you see fit. Fascism is not easy to define of course, but this is a good starting point. It's an old page, but valid.

We know what fascism led to under one regime, so it's not being disrespectful at all, in my opinion, to draw parallels and "learn from history".

And instead of being offended on behalf of others (is that not a leftie thing ?), ask Jews what they think of Trump. This from May last year:

Half of US Jewish voters believe Trump is antisemitic, poll finds | The Times of Israel

Quote from that article : " Close to 70% said the words “fascist” and “racist” describe him very or somewhat well."

Get that. Close to 70% of American Jews felt "fascist" described him somewhat well.

I am happy to be corrected as usual, if you have more up to date data.

The 14 Characteristics of Fascism - Center for Pluralism

by Lawrence Britt Spring 2003 Free Inquiry magazine Political scientist Dr. Lawrence Britt recently wrote an article about fascism (“FascismAnyone?,” […]

https://centerforpluralism.com/the-14-characteristics-of-fascism/

1dayatatime · 30/01/2026 13:08

RedTagAlan · 30/01/2026 12:55

It's the 14 points of fascism.

The 14 Characteristics of Fascism - Center for Pluralism

Just tick them off, weighing each point as you see fit. Fascism is not easy to define of course, but this is a good starting point. It's an old page, but valid.

We know what fascism led to under one regime, so it's not being disrespectful at all, in my opinion, to draw parallels and "learn from history".

And instead of being offended on behalf of others (is that not a leftie thing ?), ask Jews what they think of Trump. This from May last year:

Half of US Jewish voters believe Trump is antisemitic, poll finds | The Times of Israel

Quote from that article : " Close to 70% said the words “fascist” and “racist” describe him very or somewhat well."

Get that. Close to 70% of American Jews felt "fascist" described him somewhat well.

I am happy to be corrected as usual, if you have more up to date data.

Defining fascism is famously described as like trying to nail jelly to a wall. You have given just one source of a definition of fascism.

Let's remember that both the movements of Mussolini and Hitler had their roots in socialism, they weren't called the National Socialists for nothing.

Specifically we can look at:

Totalitarian Control:Fascism emphasizes the subordination of individual interests to the state, similar to state-socialist models where the government controls the economy.

Economic Interventionism: Fascist regimes often rejected pure free-market capitalism, favouring heavy state intervention to direct economic production for national goals.

Populist Tactics: Early fascist movements sometimes used left-wing, anti-capitalist, and populist rhetoric to mobilize working-class, labor-oriented, and populist support.

Anti-Liberalism: Like some radical left movements, fascism strongly despised liberal democracy, individual rights, and pluralism.

State control of all education and healthcare is both a left wing and fascist ideology.

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 13:13

RedTagAlan · 30/01/2026 12:55

It's the 14 points of fascism.

The 14 Characteristics of Fascism - Center for Pluralism

Just tick them off, weighing each point as you see fit. Fascism is not easy to define of course, but this is a good starting point. It's an old page, but valid.

We know what fascism led to under one regime, so it's not being disrespectful at all, in my opinion, to draw parallels and "learn from history".

And instead of being offended on behalf of others (is that not a leftie thing ?), ask Jews what they think of Trump. This from May last year:

Half of US Jewish voters believe Trump is antisemitic, poll finds | The Times of Israel

Quote from that article : " Close to 70% said the words “fascist” and “racist” describe him very or somewhat well."

Get that. Close to 70% of American Jews felt "fascist" described him somewhat well.

I am happy to be corrected as usual, if you have more up to date data.

I'm not on about 'asking Jews what they think of Trump'. I'm talking about posters on this thread constantly using the Holocaust as a way to make their point.

Controlling immigration, removing illegal immigrants is what every other country is doing yet Walz and Frey are using Minneapolis to flog their anti Trump agenda and people on here have jumped on the bandwagon parroting 'nazis!'

Thay aren't nazis, there arent any death camps, no new Holocaust. Again please show some sensitivity and awareness.

RedTagAlan · 30/01/2026 13:40

1dayatatime · 30/01/2026 13:08

Defining fascism is famously described as like trying to nail jelly to a wall. You have given just one source of a definition of fascism.

Let's remember that both the movements of Mussolini and Hitler had their roots in socialism, they weren't called the National Socialists for nothing.

Specifically we can look at:

Totalitarian Control:Fascism emphasizes the subordination of individual interests to the state, similar to state-socialist models where the government controls the economy.

Economic Interventionism: Fascist regimes often rejected pure free-market capitalism, favouring heavy state intervention to direct economic production for national goals.

Populist Tactics: Early fascist movements sometimes used left-wing, anti-capitalist, and populist rhetoric to mobilize working-class, labor-oriented, and populist support.

Anti-Liberalism: Like some radical left movements, fascism strongly despised liberal democracy, individual rights, and pluralism.

State control of all education and healthcare is both a left wing and fascist ideology.

Oh my goodness. Its 2026 and the old "Nazis were socialist" trope is still being rolled out.

We can pinpoint this to Dinesh D'Souza of course. His 2018 Trump propaganda film " Death of a Nation" revitalized that old contortion of the truth. I remember a clip of Don Jr leaving the cinema... " Wow, did you know the Nazis were actually socialist? It's in their name".

Do we really need to go into this whole Overton horseshoe thing here ? Or will you be a good faith debater and acknowledge that fascism and socialism are not the same.

Note what I said in my post above. Close to 70% of American Jews felt "fascist" described him somewhat well.

Fascist. Not socialist.

Any reply to that figure ? Or are you going to say the socialist kibbutz system is actually fascist ?

misscockerspaniel · 30/01/2026 13:43

1dayatatime · 30/01/2026 10:43

Absolutely that is selective- ICE are not only arresting violent criminal illegal immigrants that have raped children but also arresting regular illegal immigrants. But they have both entered the US illegally.

Equally @DdraigGochwas being selective in her link the case of a 5 year old boy. ICE are not seeking to deport children simply adult illegal migrants.

If "ICE are not seeking to deport children" why has a judge "temporarily barred federal immigration officials from deporting 5 year old Liam..."?

Judge blocks ICE from deporting or transferring 5-year-old Liam Conejo Ramos and his father - CBS News

Judge blocks ICE from deporting or transferring 5-year-old Liam Conejo Ramos and his father

A federal judge on Tuesday temporarily barred federal immigration officials from deporting 5-year-old Liam Conejo Ramos and his father.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/liam-ramos-5-year-old-minnesota-judge-deportation/

CJsGoldfish · 30/01/2026 13:56

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 13:13

I'm not on about 'asking Jews what they think of Trump'. I'm talking about posters on this thread constantly using the Holocaust as a way to make their point.

Controlling immigration, removing illegal immigrants is what every other country is doing yet Walz and Frey are using Minneapolis to flog their anti Trump agenda and people on here have jumped on the bandwagon parroting 'nazis!'

Thay aren't nazis, there arent any death camps, no new Holocaust. Again please show some sensitivity and awareness.

"please show some sensitivity and awareness"
🤣 You are the gift that keeps on giving

People use the 1930s Germany as a comparison because the similarities are chilling. You can lie, deflect, throw in whatever red herrings you want but it doesn't change that.

Paraphrasing from another source...
When a previously democratic nation descends into a fascist authoritarian society, it starts with things like lugenpresse, or 'lying press/fake news'
Then the people are told you have an enemy. In the case of the us, it's the immigrants. The 'imagined common enemy'
Then annexing of countries. Any of this sound familiar?

"every other country" is really NOT doing what the US is. Although, the US is more closely aligned to some pretty awful ones these days so I guess it's not entirely untrue.
To see opposition to the disregard of the constitution and of the law as well as the violent activities of ICEstapo as an 'anti trump agenda' is, quite frankly, frightening.

CJsGoldfish · 30/01/2026 14:04

1dayatatime · 30/01/2026 13:08

Defining fascism is famously described as like trying to nail jelly to a wall. You have given just one source of a definition of fascism.

Let's remember that both the movements of Mussolini and Hitler had their roots in socialism, they weren't called the National Socialists for nothing.

Specifically we can look at:

Totalitarian Control:Fascism emphasizes the subordination of individual interests to the state, similar to state-socialist models where the government controls the economy.

Economic Interventionism: Fascist regimes often rejected pure free-market capitalism, favouring heavy state intervention to direct economic production for national goals.

Populist Tactics: Early fascist movements sometimes used left-wing, anti-capitalist, and populist rhetoric to mobilize working-class, labor-oriented, and populist support.

Anti-Liberalism: Like some radical left movements, fascism strongly despised liberal democracy, individual rights, and pluralism.

State control of all education and healthcare is both a left wing and fascist ideology.

The Holocaust Museum has a good definition of fascism. Mango Mussolini is doing a pretty good job of it.

encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/fascism-1#:~:text=Definition%20and%20Beliefs,Fascism%20is%20characterized%20by:

RedTagAlan · 30/01/2026 14:15

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 13:13

I'm not on about 'asking Jews what they think of Trump'. I'm talking about posters on this thread constantly using the Holocaust as a way to make their point.

Controlling immigration, removing illegal immigrants is what every other country is doing yet Walz and Frey are using Minneapolis to flog their anti Trump agenda and people on here have jumped on the bandwagon parroting 'nazis!'

Thay aren't nazis, there arent any death camps, no new Holocaust. Again please show some sensitivity and awareness.

Quote, for the " most ironic comment of the thread award":

" Again please show some sensitivity and awareness."

Back at you Trump apologist.

You are aware that by supporting him and his regime, you are facilitating his version of fascism ?

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 14:49

RedTagAlan · 30/01/2026 14:15

Quote, for the " most ironic comment of the thread award":

" Again please show some sensitivity and awareness."

Back at you Trump apologist.

You are aware that by supporting him and his regime, you are facilitating his version of fascism ?

Trump apologist? Now you're just making shit up.

I support immigatrion and border control. What has happened in Minneapolis <and nowhere else> is terrible, all down to the governor and sidekick mayor encouraging unrest.

There isn't anything 'ironic' about requesting that some of you please desist with the offensive nazi crap. Millions of people murdered and many others suffered terribly. This situation is not comparable.

1dayatatime · 30/01/2026 15:23

CJsGoldfish · 30/01/2026 14:04

The Holocaust Museum has a good definition of fascism. Mango Mussolini is doing a pretty good job of it.

encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/fascism-1#:~:text=Definition%20and%20Beliefs,Fascism%20is%20characterized%20by:

Again that is simply yet another definition of fascism. Fascism is a combination of nationalism/ militarism and economic socialism. All under an authoritarian rule.

Nationalism and militarism are generally associated with the right. However state control of key industries, banking, education and healthcare are generally associated with socialism and the left.

As for authoritarian rule then that can equally be under a right wing (eg Franco Spain ) or under left wing (eg China and NKorea).

RedTagAlan · 30/01/2026 15:34

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 14:49

Trump apologist? Now you're just making shit up.

I support immigatrion and border control. What has happened in Minneapolis <and nowhere else> is terrible, all down to the governor and sidekick mayor encouraging unrest.

There isn't anything 'ironic' about requesting that some of you please desist with the offensive nazi crap. Millions of people murdered and many others suffered terribly. This situation is not comparable.

Apologies Gloria for suggesting you are a Trump apologist. I am an ex tankie myself, and my spider senses appear to have been wrong. Tankies and Trumpists do share many characteristics after all.

I failed to properly weight that you are taking offense on behalf of others, a massive indicator of "leftness". Fox and Breitbart call that " Virtue signaling" I think. I did not apply enough weight to that part. And my error led to me making a wrong conclusion.

Sorry again. I will re-calibrate my spider senses.

What book of the Bible should I use for my re-calibration ? I find that book is best for self calibration.

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 17:05

RedTagAlan · 30/01/2026 15:34

Apologies Gloria for suggesting you are a Trump apologist. I am an ex tankie myself, and my spider senses appear to have been wrong. Tankies and Trumpists do share many characteristics after all.

I failed to properly weight that you are taking offense on behalf of others, a massive indicator of "leftness". Fox and Breitbart call that " Virtue signaling" I think. I did not apply enough weight to that part. And my error led to me making a wrong conclusion.

Sorry again. I will re-calibrate my spider senses.

What book of the Bible should I use for my re-calibration ? I find that book is best for self calibration.

Oh Alan not to worry and apology accepted many others have made countless mistakes so you aren't on your own.

I dont think it is purely a lefties trait to 'take offence on behalf of others'. Tbh when talking about mass atrocities it is a human trait to be appalled and for folk to use that atrocity for their own agenda is sick.

Maybe Proverbs for some reflection? it offers practical advice on how to avoid mistakes in the first place, emphasizing humility, listening to advice, and understanding the consequences of actions.

<wtf is a tankie>

RedTagAlan · 30/01/2026 17:11

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 17:05

Oh Alan not to worry and apology accepted many others have made countless mistakes so you aren't on your own.

I dont think it is purely a lefties trait to 'take offence on behalf of others'. Tbh when talking about mass atrocities it is a human trait to be appalled and for folk to use that atrocity for their own agenda is sick.

Maybe Proverbs for some reflection? it offers practical advice on how to avoid mistakes in the first place, emphasizing humility, listening to advice, and understanding the consequences of actions.

<wtf is a tankie>

If you don't know what a tankie is, I can't help you. There was me thinking you knew and understood global politics.

Do your own research. As they say.

:-)

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 17:29

RedTagAlan · 30/01/2026 17:11

If you don't know what a tankie is, I can't help you. There was me thinking you knew and understood global politics.

Do your own research. As they say.

:-)

God no, I've never professed to be an expert in global politics I just know illegal immigrants need removing, they need to go through the same process as everyone else if they want to relocate. I fancy moving to Califoriia but I can't just pack up and go there.

LlttledrummergirI · 30/01/2026 18:09

https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/report/immigration-detention/

https://www.nationalww2museum.org/war/articles/dachau-model-concentration-camp-1933-39

https://www.aila.org/library/deaths-at-adult-detention-centers

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Immigration_and_Customs_Enforcement

No comparison, nothing to see here.

"As commandant of Dachau in 1933-34, Eicke was relentless in both the indoctrination of his men and the demonization of inmates. The latter he always denounced as “enemies of the state.” In October 1933, he codified the guidelines for his men to follow, called “Maintenance of Discipline and Order.” Investing supreme authority to decide and dispense punishments in the camp commandant, Eicke prescribed a range of carefully regimented and administered measures, including temporary loss of mail privileges, hard labor, binding prisoners to stakes or trees (for how long varied), and ordering special, exhausting exercises. Solitary confinement, with only bread and water granted, he encouraged. Corporal punishment, whether with a whip or with the punch, slap, or kick, was ingrained into the hellish existence inmates endured during their time in Dachau."

Again. It didn't start with the death camps.

Dachau, the “Model” Concentration Camp, 1933-39

In June 2004, while spending a weekend in Munich away from dissertation research at the Austrian National Library, I boarded a train in the city’s Hauptbahnhof (Central Station) for a short trip.

https://www.nationalww2museum.org/war/articles/dachau-model-concentration-camp-1933-39

NoKidsSendDogs · 30/01/2026 18:10

Notonthestairs · 29/01/2026 07:57

What nonsense is this?
Kicking a car does not mean you don’t value your life - unless you are suggesting all ICE agents are trigger happy goons.

You forgot wife beaters, rapists and pedophiles. In other words, trump's base.

DdraigGoch · 30/01/2026 18:15

RingoJuice · 30/01/2026 08:04

You mean to say government facilities that hold and process asylum seekers? They are the very same facilities used under the Obama administration.

There was no reason to disperse asylum seekers all across the US, where you’d have to trust that they leave after rejection. Many don’t. So what would you have us do? Nothing?

Obviously they should have access to clean water and decent food. So if there is a problem, yes, highlight and fix it.

The facilities closed by Biden and reopened by Trump.

The power to fix the problem lies with the administration. But cruelty is a feature, not a bug.

DdraigGoch · 30/01/2026 18:22

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 08:34

You do know it was Holocaust Memorial Day Jan 27th yes? Did you see any of the footage or hear any of the testomonies? Please educate yourself.

To liken detainment facilities in the US to the horrors of actual concentration camps is appalling and does your argument no favours. If you embellish and exaggerate one thing it does make one question what else you overegg.

I'm well aware. You appear to be unaware of what the words "never again" mean though.

Take it from an expert on the subject:
https://www.bu.edu/articles/2019/are-ice-detention-centers-concentration-camps/
"The analogy is correct, as many scholars have confirmed."

Are ICE Detention Centers Concentration Camps?

Rep. Alexandria Ocasio Cortez (CAS’11) (D-N.Y.) set off a firestorm after releasing a video comparing detention centers on the US southern border to concentration camps. Michael Zank, director of BU’s Elie Wiesel Center for Jewish Studies, offers his p...

https://www.bu.edu/articles/2019/are-ice-detention-centers-concentration-camps

DdraigGoch · 30/01/2026 18:25

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 08:53

We've been told this man was a harmless 'nurse' for days so to find out he was a violent agitator with form is relevant.

Nothing justifies anyone being shot however in a volatile situation with armed officers, much like Jan 6th riots then sadly mistakes will happen.

I don't think one person has said the shooting was justified, a pp has however suggested Babbitt's was justfied on Jan 6th as she was apparently about to 'lynch' Pence Confused.

Generally in chaotic scenes where armed officers are being obstructed it is best. to stfu and do as you're told.

Eyewitnesses said that Byrd's actions saved lives. An independent investigation completely cleared him.

No eyewitnesses have said that about Alex Pretti's execution because Alex did not threaten the life of anyone. And there seem to be no signs of a proper investigation.

DdraigGoch · 30/01/2026 18:30

Gloriia · 30/01/2026 09:25

It is horrific isn't it.

We've had the same Holocaust fantasisers say 'ah but the nazis didn't start murdering Jews it evolved over 10yrs' yet when I and others pointed out Obama had detainment centres in 2016 with alleged mistreatment and in 10yrs it has not evolved to mass murder you get 'whataboutery!'

I wonder if some people get some kind of perverse thrill from using false equivalence regarding the Holocaust and concentration camps. It is quite disturbing.

Edited

Here's a saying in Germany:

Wehret den Anfängen
[Resist the beginnings]

You have no idea where this might end if it is not stopped. The people of Portland, Chicago, Minneapolis and other cities intend to stop it before it's too late.