DP accusing BIL of racism

[Eastie77Returns]

DP is white (I am not) and from south of Europe. His sister is married to a man from their home country. DP and his brothers have never taken to this man. It’s all a bit complicated but he is from a very wealthy family, DP’a family is working class and very left-wing (FIL was a Communist mayor of a town) and DP has had many heated arguments with his BIL over various political issues etc and just seems to resent him. I have always found him perfectly pleasant.

Anyway. Just before Xmas we went to visit DP’s family with our two DC. BIL and SIL were there with their 2 year old DD. At various points in the evening BIL was taking pictures of all the cousins (our DC and those of DP’s siblings). He subsequently posted a picture on Insta with the caption “Alice” and her cousins” which had his DD and all of DP’s siblings kids but not ours. I had no idea about any of this until I heard DP shouting on the phone one evening and was able to understand the word “racist” (he was talking in his mother tongue) and other bits. Turns out he was talking to his DSis and accusing her DH of racism. She called me in tears saying her DH didn’t mean to exclude them and if we check the account there are pictures of them elsewhere. The drama rolled on as BIL apparently removed the offending picture and replaced it with another one of their DD with all the cousins this time including our DC (I’m not on Insta and saw none of this). DP told BIL to take the picture down, it’s too little too late. DP’s brothers joined in and also denounced him as a racist. Anyway, my AIBU is DP wants to cancel a planned trip to his home country during half-term where we due to stay with SIL & BIL. Our DD will be distraught as she absolutely loves visiting them. She plans to take DP’s language for GCSE and is desperate to spend as much time as possible in his home country. My gut feeling is BIL is not racist, I have genuinely never seen him be anything but kind and attentive to our DC and he has known them since they were babies (now 10 & 12). The picture issue is a puzzle though since he obviously had a picture with all the cousins that he could have posted to begin with.

AIBU to say we should still go? There is now so much ill feeling between DP and his sister but she has categorically told me she wants us to come. I do not feel comfortable visiting without him.

Nah, your dp and his brothers are making it up as they don’t like him. They sound jealous too of his wealth.

Hes a prick and they’re all bullies

First answer nailing it.

Difficult to say as I imagine there’s lots more to this from your DHs perspective. Maybe he knows things you don’t?
Has he actually given any evidence to suggest racism?

Also, I wouldn’t necessarily just go off what MN says obviously. You will get a biased response, as according to MN no one is racist! Just take a look at other racism threads.

It sounds as though your DP (and his brothers) has a huge chip on his/their shoulder as a result of BIL's wealth/social status, fuelled by their left wing upbringing. Making an allegation of racism towards a pleasant, previously-engaged and attentive uncle on the basis of nothing more than a photo upload is pretty outrageous behaviour, and I think the first step should be to unpick his reasoning for this. At face value racism is just one of a great number of explanations, with others being: genuine error/unthinkingness; the picture posted was just a "nicer" picture than the all-cousin option, or (less likely given that BIL's always presented as pleasant and not racist, but possibly plausible in the circs) that he finds your DP a chippy PITA and deliberately excluded his kids out of spite. I'd explore the racism accusation in a bit more detail with your DP to establish if there's more substance to it in the first instance, and proceed from there.

Ok so going by the MN mantra that the first answer usually the right one I won’t cancel our flights😅

I am the one usually quite sensitive to any signs of racism (I posted years ago when DD was a baby as I felt uncomfortable visiting his home country as it was/is an issue there) but in this specific case I’m truly unsure. I just haven’t picked up on that kind of energy from BIL. DP says I don’t understand BIL properly, behind the smiles he is not that nice.

Your DH sounds like he is out to cause trouble.

I don’t know, if my partner really didn’t like someone I’d listen, - if he’s not prone to that sort of behaviour he might well know stuff that you don’t.

BIL’s father owns several businesses in the home country. One of them was exposed by a local newspaper for employing migrants who live in bad conditions. The racism charge against BIL’s family, and him by extension, seemed to stem from that. Other than that the accusations are that BIL is ‘bourgeois’ and fixated on money. My impression of him is a pleasant, easy going guy but obviously I don’t know him that well.

Your dp is vile.

I'm in a mixed relationship with someone from another country, where people have been racist towards me.

The caption was factually correct. It WAS his dd and the other children WERE her cousins.

Was it all of her cousins? No.

Would I get het up about this if it were my SIL's kids and other cousins, but not my dd in this single picture, but others including dd had been posted ? No.

Your DP has an issue with BIL that isn't anything to do with racism, or you, or your children - he has CHOSEN to latch onto a pic of his sister's child with her cousins (because that's exactly what it is) to vent that dislike.

There is only one person using your race, and your children's race here - and it's not BIL. You haven't seen racism from him previously because it isn't there - everyone who has experienced racism can spot it when it happens, so don't doubt your interpretation of BILs attitude to you or your children.

In your shoes I'd be disgusted at "D"P - your/your children's race isn't something to be weaponised against someone he doesn't like.

Some things are too important to weaponise - apparently you and your children are not. It would give me the rage - and the ick.

(Edited for typos).

If your 'D'P is such a wonderful guy, why hasn't he married you?

Oh come on, how do you know it's his choice?

We lowly wimmins can also choose not to be married. Not everyone sees marriage as a goal, or even wants it.

Nice bit of misogyny there.

I think your DH is blowing it out of proportion. My guess is that BIL just put the pictures of without overthinking it. I have posted pictures of my children with some of their cousins (but not all) and wouldn’t think I was ever offending anyone. I think your DH is being rather unpleasant here.

He’d happily marry me tomorrow. I’m not interested in marriage atm (and can we please not turn this into a debate on the subject. I have my reasons!)😬

It’s kind of ironic that he berates BIL’s family for running an exploitative business. When I posted years ago about not wanting to visit his home town, it was mainly because we had to stay with a local Don/criminal type who was close family friend and a surrogate father to DP and his siblings after DFIL died. God knows how many people that awful man exploited.

Crikey one picture and your sil says there were other pictures of cousins on Instagram too
Your dp and his brothers are being twats. Even if they don't like him or he is some form of devil in disguise - he hasn't actually done anything and your partner is making his sisters life awful

Has this got anything to BIL’s political opinions ? Or the countrys past history?

Whenever I’ve spoken to BIL about politics he has criticised both Left and Right parties
in his country. As far as I’m aware, he has supported Independent candidates. He doesn’t seem to have strident views on anything though. At family gatherings DP and his brothers, uncles will sit shouting talking at length about political issues and BIL will either look impassive or just move away from the discussion. I do suspect he thinks they are complete twats tbh but he is a polite man.

Well you certainly caught me there, but not, I think, in misogyny. The opposite.

Just, on a boringly legal and financial point, maybe get a civil partnership, if you donn't want marriage?

@Eastie77Returns your opinion is the most important one here

If you have never had a racist vibe from this guy, I think that's pretty telling. My own experience - I appreciate this may be very different to yours - is that people who are racist usually can't hide it for very long. And that's without spending lots of time with me. It sounds as if you spent lots of time with him - so do you think he's a racist?

The Instagram photo thing seems ridiculous. It is factually correct that the photo was of his child and her cousins. Not all of her cousins, but he didn't say that.

Sorry to say, I can really see how jealousy could be a factor here. It's taken me a long time to learn this - nearly all my time on this earth - but people will make up all kinds of desperate shit if they are jealous.

I take the label "racist" very seriously. But some people are throwing it around as if it's not serious. Is it possible that your DP does not feel the seriousness of making this allegation?

I can't see anybody doing forgive and forget after this. Is it his intention to drive a permanent wedge in the family?

Haha that’s the southern europeans for you ( my DH is one too 😉) ! I’d just tell him to calm down. You are the one who gets to decide if you’re offended or not.

No I agree, racists tend to show their true colours one way or another. I have never picked up on that vibe from him at all but I'm also conscious that I don't really know him very well. He is pleasant, quiet, good with our DC. I've never noticed him excluding them. He's just an ordinary guy really except he is wealthy via family money.

I've asked DP to clarify the racism. He says things like "you didn't hear what he said about the migrants (referring to the ones BIL's father employed/exploited)" but then won't explain what BIL said about them. There has been nothing concrete from DP so it does feel like personal dislike.

OP, is this the first time in all these years that your DH has ever suggested the BIL is racist? If not I honestly wouldn't dismiss it.

I'm going to be honest, I have an extended family with members who are absolutely racist. I could bring you around to visit and you would likely never know, and they all will tell you they have non-white friends. But when they're in a room full of white people they feel perfectly comfortable to say things that are unambiguously racist including the worst slurs you can come up with. They are simply practiced at compartmentalizing it all and carving out these little mental exceptions for certain individuals that they know personally.