To think you can’t actually get car seat advice from anywhere?

[carseatdramas]

Or can you?

DD is 5. She is in this car seat. I have the cybex for her younger sister who is a bit of a Houdini with straps so it works well. Dd1 seems to like it.

I mentioned it on a FB group and was annihilated (it was not even about car seats!) with PMs and messages telling me how awful it was she wasn’t rear facing / in a harness.

I keep reading that Halfords and the chain shops aren’t any good: fair enough. But the independent shops seem to just focus on RF as do FB groups.

So I don’t really know who to ask …

TBF there are also multiple of the FB car seat groups, and one of them is notoriously worse than the others. From the fact everyone apparently jumped on you for having a 5yo in an excellent HBB, I would assume that you were on that one. Don't ask me what it's called, because I don't want to be deleted but also, I honestly don't know - the ones I have been in previously have all changed their names multiple times and I've lost track of which is which. TBH the one I was in which I left because I felt as though I was contributing to something toxic was not the group in question, the "notorious" group is quite harmful IMO. There are others which are more reasonable though barely ever have posting open. But all of them suffer from the same FB problems of lack of nuance and circular groupthink. Sometimes this is because it's just hard to have a nuanced discussion on this kind of topic and some of the mods were very anxious about mixed messages getting out so they wanted a very clear line, but I struggled with this because I disagreed with the other mods about where the clear line is.

To me the clear line is the law, and everything over and above that is parental decision and I am very happy to share as much info as I can find in order to help parents make a decision that works for them. I'm happy to fight myths about RF but I'm also happy to add realism about the fact many people do choose FF, and I don't find it helpful to completely ban any discussion of the topic. Many ERF advocates have a different line which is RF at all costs for as long as possible. So we were just coming from a different place.

Agree the lady who runs Car Seat Ninja was always lovely and kind IME. Also Little Peas and Rear Facing Toddlers/Margaret always tend to give reasonable advice.

Cariad Babi do online car seat consultations. I've used them for baby wearing advice and would recommend.

cariadbabi.com/

Haven’t read all the messages so this might have been posted already, but the German company ADAC, which I think is like the AA, does very comprehensive third party testing of carseats and publishes the results each year. It’s really useful! You might need to translate the site to English.

https://www.adac.de/rund-ums-fahrzeug/ausstattung-technik-zubehoer/kindersitze/kindersitztest/

Thanks @BertieBotts . The weird thing is it wasn’t even a car seat group. I’m not in them because I just don’t want to RF. it was a photo where DD happened to be in the car seat and then it all went a bit mental … I just deleted the post and left the group, but it did have me wondering if I was doing something all wrong and I didn’t have anywhere to ask because the car seat groups are insane so …

I am really grateful for your response!

That specialises in extended rear facing. Nearly all the independent car seat shops do.

It’s not you, it’s them.

Harassing someone with DMs about their child being forward facing is just people scratching their activist itch, trying to feel like they’re doing good in the world when there are obviously many more productive ways to do that.

They have problems, ignore them.

Ask ChatGPT, it will give you advice summarised from the internet and take cues from you as to the responses, so if you tell it not to have a go at you about being forward facing it will just give you useful advice.

Which does review and test car seats ( actually crash tests them) so if you want solid reviews you could get a trial membership and see what they say.

I rear faced DC until four years old and and everyone I knew thought I was bonkers. You're babying them, why would you do that when the law says it's safe to FF, ooh mine would never put up with that! it's expensive, the seats are too big, why do you have to make a big deal of this etc etc.

So I'm a bit sceptical of PP (not saying you're doing this OP) who make out that they're shunned and disdained for FF (n real life at least. Obviously there's no accounting for FB groups as social media is poison and best avoided). I always suspect it's similar to the feeding debates where supposedly bottle feeding is looked down on, but in reality anyone who e.g. EBF for six months is treated as a weirdo for not shoving rice cakes down their gob from about 12 weeks.

OP the seat you have is fantastic and very safe.

Honestly @LimpysGotCancer in RL everyone I know FFs. The only exception is at a group I go to sometimes: it’s an outdoor playgroup and a lot of home ed families go. RF is more of a ‘thing.’ Online is another matter, though. Thanks for saying that re the seat: it did unsettle me a bit when I got such a negative reaction and I wasn’t even asking for car seat advice!

I hope it was ok to summon you Bertie!! I’ve had good advice from you and seen you offer the same to others.

I’ve also posted before that when I had 2x ERF seats in my car, I had a note on the windscreen left telling me how great I was. I mean nice, but batshit 😆

When I once needed a car seat very urgently, within an hour or two (supplied and fitted) I found Halfords extremely helpful.

I have not followed this car seat debate, but I find in very bizarre the car seat use of a five year old could be considered ‘contentious’ and discussing it ‘provocative’.

Why?!

@carseatdramas i have had excellent advice at John Lewis.

I had every intention of RFing my DD2 for as long as possible and got an expensive Axkid seat. She endlessly got her arms out of the straps no matter how much we adjusted them, tightened them and even used chest clips. Turning her when she was 2.5/3 meant she kept her arms in or we could see instantly when she took them out. I weighed up the options and decided that was safer.

DS is 2 in March and still RFing. I will keep him that way for as long as possible.

It all depends on the size of the child as well. I have large children so need to factor in their height and weight alongside the restrictions of the seat.

I've bought all my kids' seats from In Car Safety Centre, which is an independent, and while they do specialise in extended RF, I never felt pushed into it when making a purchase, and I felt like they were being sensible and pragmatic about the different choices, especially as my 2 kids were both >90th centile for height and weight, so outgrew seats early and would have needed the very expensive options if we'd wanted to stay ERF, which in the end we didn't.

There are some very vocal people when it comes to car seats, but the solid evidence is not as great as they'd like us to think (not surprising given the relatively small number of accidents leading to serious injury, you'd need a lot of data for a statistically significant comparison). By FAR the biggest safety step to take is to have a seat that is a) appropriately sized for the child, b) appropriately secured in the car AND the child appropriately secured within it. This sounds obvious, but you'd be horrified at how many parents don't achieve this, and those kids are much more likely to be seriously injured. For a 5 year old, after those things, the difference in direction of travel is tiny by comparison.

There’s a school of thought, possibly data based or possibly debunked, that said keeping children ERF, extended rear facing, in seats facing backwards up to 5+ years of age was better for their safety. This seems to have been perpetuated by some retailers only selling some brands and building up quite a following (I did use the word cult!) that not only extols the benefits, but who have also frequently made out that any parent choosing not to is a shit parent. At which point cue a lot of arguments in every direction, hence ‘contentious’. For whatever reason, mainly “facts” vs “facts” it hasn’t been possible to maintain helpful and friendly discussions on various fora.

All things being equal, it is safer to ERF for as long as possible. The impact in a collision on children’s spines is drastically reduced and they are better protected from side impact too.

However, there are times when the circumstances are not equal which some of the online groups refuse to accept. I was told to just tell my DD no when she took her arms out as if I hadn’t tried that. 🙄

Yes ‘tell her not to’ - errr. The Cybex is brilliant if you have an escape artist though.

The problem with some of these special interest FB groups is that they attract evangelicals and therefore aren't really the place for nuanced debate- these people want to be in an echo chamber and have their fairly fringe views validated. I joined a few re renovating Victorian properties as I thought it would be good for tips and ideas. I had to leave once I realised it was populated mainly by people who want to actually live in Victorian times and hate on anyone who wants underfloor or solar panels (and fgs don't mention ring doorbells).

This is so true. It’s actually a group about Tonie boxes but you’re right; there are people with literally hundreds of Tonies, more than your child could realistically listen to ever … !

We have a local lady who used to work for Mothercare and is now an independent advisor, from what I have seen on local pages she is very happy to advise whilst taking in peoples opinions. Yes she is keen on ERF but will also advise otherwise. If you PM me I can happily share her website details she maybe able to advise you remotely.

https://carseatninja.com/

Yes those facebook groups (one in particular) are known for being batshit.
Do you really need car seat advice though?? Look for an age/height appropriate seat from a brand you’ve heard of that gets a good ADAC score, check it fits your car. Job done. We have a Cybex booster too, for my 4YO. It’s a good seat.

That literally says extended rf specialist on it!