Late stage capitalism, AIBU to ask “what comes next?”

[overthinkersanonnymus]

I have seen a lot of posts on SM saying we’re in late stage capitalism, what happens after this stage? What does it even mean?

Im not very savvy about politics and the economy etc, but is this a good thing or bad thing, that we’re in late stage?

What comes next? All that is solid melts into air. All that is sacred is profaned, and man is at last compelled to face with sober senses his real conditions of life, and his relations with his kind. That's what comes next.

Nobody really knows what will happen. CEOs only care about the making the next quarter’s profits go up and that they go up more than their competitors, they don’t care what happens in the future as it will be someone else’s problem. Same with politicians, they only care about staying in power.

Money used to represent actual resources that are in the world, it kind of doesn’t anymore. Lots of made up numbers based on impressions and speculation.

Chaos

Revolution

Depends who you listen to.

Some people say late stage capitalism will be the start of a fundamental shift, and collapse of capitalism.
Others would say that capitalism is flexible and will adapt and evolve but still survive.

Sorry, I’ll elaborate. Birth rates are going down. We’ll be incentived to breed. But the ‘right’ people breeding. People who will create the workers of the future.

This will either lead to a revolution of the underclass (cf Russia) or a technological revolution which leads to us all working less. I hope for the latter, I expect the former.

When economic systems have failed in the past it's led to things like the fall of Rome or the collapse of the Soviet Union. The concern about what happens if global capitalism fails is the fact that everything is so complicated and interdependent these days. It's not like we can just pick up a hoe and start planting cabbages and return to the days of subsistence farming, most people no longer have the land or the skills to support themselves. So, indeed, what comes next? The Hunger Games? Mad Max? I don't think anyone really knows. Which is why it would be best to manage gradual change to a more sustainable future...hard to achieve while dinosaurs like Trump and Putin with their obsession with fossil fuels and the wealth and power they bring continue to hold sway.

We’re in capitalism, at least in the West.

when people say late stage they mean one of two things:

capitalism started somewhere after feudalism, which depending on when you date it and by country is anywhere from about 1600 to 1920, we are a long way one from that hence we are not in early stage

or they are implying something else will replace it soonish. Ideas on what will replace it vary.

We are all doomed

What are the ideas of replacements?

The great reset. In reality a make do and mend future for the many and a psuedo-Greek 2015 economy for most of us… sure we’ll be told instead of measuring GDP we’ll have a wellbeing economy, 4 day week etc, community wealth building and other crap to make us feel better about it… if it was so great the elite would join us and give up their wealth… BBC are terming it sustainability on a shoestring…under the guise of Net Zero as average couple recycling will save the planet vs a couple with mansions, yachts and private jets… economy never recovered post 2008 and the capitalist lie that wealth trickles down has shown that for many it instead bubbles up…

vis a vis… when we are even more skint and have plenty time on our hands we might want to do all this:

https://www.bbc.com/future/sustainability-on-a-shoestring

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20230502-how-to-make-your-wardrobe-sustainable

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20240115-low-cost-heating-hacks-how-to-make-your-home-stay-warmer-for-longer

No coincidence Plebs being pushed down make do and mend route just as energy/water/resource needed for AI and 4IR… that has no carbon impact it seems 🙄…

Overall bottom line is there will be no economic recovery as cannot promise more (growth) at the same time as enforcing less (Net Zero), at a time when most economies are essentially bankrupt.

Historically, when too much wealth and power has been concentrated in the hands of a very few, to the detriment of the masses, it has often led to a revolt. Sometimes these revolts succeed and become revolutions.

What is the replacement- usually some form of government that is supposed to benefit the masses more but ends up being corrupt itself 🤷‍♀️

I can only ever hear that in a Scottish accent

All the Teslas will soon be reprogrammed to run over the poor and needy

Well, there are a number of thoughts on what might replace it.

firstly, some people (mostly those who worried about a nuclear war) thought it might be replaced by a New Stone Age as most of the world is a radioactive mess and the what’s left of it has a population who have lost the technology

secondly, some people think it will be replaced with some version of communism/socialism like in Cuba or Laos

thirdly some people think it might be replaced with a totalitarian dictatorship (like Nazi Germany was and North Korea is now)

I don’t think anyone thinks it will be replaced by feudalism but I could be wrong.

It’s Socialist/Marxist theory, that doesn’t stand up to much scrutiny. There have been crisis points for capitalism before. This isn’t something that inevitably leads to revolution.

The situation in the UK and the US is in no way comparable to the pre-revolutionary Russian Empire.

Agree, but aren't we in large part to blame. If someone told people their pension or savings or investments wouldn't grow for a year, or a politician said they are going to put income tax BACK to 22% who would say yes do it...

Everyone moans about things that capitalism has created but no other system has worked as well. It's not perfect but communism leads to corruption and few very wealthy people who will do anything to stay at the top and lots of very poor people. Mixed economies can workin smaller countries but you end up with bureaucratic messes like British rail and British Leyland or too many people employed by the state leading to lack of entrepreneural strength and a burden on the state which can lead to issues like Iceland experienced in 2007.

That shit isn't gonna pay the bills

So @overthinkersanonnymus this is literally why we've got fools flirting with communism right now - late stage capitalism and incompetence / or design?

I think that's what late stage capitalism is.... People will go round in circles deciding there must be a better way... then maybe try communism again... then get overthrown....then try capitalism again.

I think we've got enough people raging against the communist machine for it not to happen, fingers crossed... if not, then I will be making a sharp exit from the world.

If the gap between rich and poor widens, there comes a point where the poor cannot afford anything and money effectively becomes meaningless. If AI development can be directed to replace human labour and to distribute necessities efficiently to the population, we can all live in a leisure utopia. And if the billionaires move to mars, all the better.

@NotAnotherScarf see in theory I'd try mixed economy again but then I look at this government and I think, maybe not!

certainly see the argument for water, for example, to be in public ownership. But competence seems to be a thing of the past.

World War followed by reset.

So how long is the late stage of capitalism expected to last? Are we talking 10 or 100 years?

Yanis Varoufakis suggests the replacement will be techno-feudalism… www.theguardian.com/world/2023/sep/24/yanis-varoufakis-technofeudalism-capitalism-ukraine-interview

Who knows but we are with 4th Industrial Revolution (4IR) in uncharted territory… WEF hypothesis summary pp14-19 - www3.weforum.org/docs/Unlocking_Technology_for_the_Global_Goals.pdf

If you've got billions and a secure bunker you'll be fine but nothing good will happen to those of us who don't. A cashless society, digital ID's and drones the size of bees will make us very easy to control.