The bloody service charge!

[Ilovemychocolate]

Went out to eat twice yesterday…we are in Bath for a festive visit.
Both times our bill came with service charge added.
Both times I sent it back and requested they remove the service charge.
Now I know it’s Christmas, but adding the service charge, without informing the customer it’s completely their choice to pay it, is a year round practise.
I am not against tipping, but it infuriates me when it’s automatically added to my bill with the expectation I will pay it!
An I unreasonable to ask the restaurant to remove it every time?

I am a tipper and I'm often quite generous. That being said I think it should be my choice and the prevalence of service charges being added to small tables is really starting to bother me. When I worked in the service industry staff didn't even get those service charges.

What's the difference between a service charge and a tip, thought they were the same. I will never again enter the doors of gourmet burger kitchen after they tried to charge (using one of those at table portal things) a service charge AND a tip added automatically to my order before I'd even placed it or experienced said service charge. Luckily I was savvy and realised the order was far more than the food price, like 20% on top, and had to go back and re submit my order, unticking all the auto add on options. This is before I'd even spoken to a human being. And people wonder why some people feel naffed off at these charges.

This is such an idiotic argument. Try working in a restaurant and also working as a cashier in a shop, then see which job is by far the hardest and most stressful. Most wait staff wouldn’t work in restaurants if tips didn’t exist, it literally wouldn’t be worth the money.

I speak from great experience

I can see not many people work in hospitality in here. We have a restaurant and do add a service charge which is pretty standard in the industry these days. We pay our staff what we can afford to, some minimum wage some more but the government is making it harder and harder for survival in our industry so as much as we would like to pay everyone £15 an hour we can’t. With the cost of living the tronc (service charge) obviously really helps our staff it doesn’t go to us. If you disagree then yes ask for it to be taken off but remember many hospitality staff are on minimum wage because the industry is falling apart at the seams with tax rises etc. So if you want to keep independent restaurants in your area and have nice places to go then support them or you will soon see them close.

Top marks bbz for claiming Im rage baiting then going on to call me sweetheart 😂

And then wildly claiming people leaving a tip for "as expected" service is why places add on service charges. I mean, honestly....😂😂😂

Supporting independent restaurants means going to them, it doesn’t mean tipping. People are supporting your business if they visit, regardless of whether or not they tip, and they shouldn’t be made to feel like their custom isn’t valued if they don’t pay an automatic service charge regardless of how good (or not) the service is.

I’m a tipper and at times for great service a good one.

But I cannot abide the practice of adding a service charge. I always ask for it to be removed and then leave in cash. that way there is no VAT added and the server isn’t taxed on the tip.

Was it in The Ivy? Im from Bath and the Ivy always add the service charges. My husband sends the bill back and tells them to remove this charge. However he always tips the server in cash.

They shouldn't add a service charge. It should be part of the cost of the meal. You don't get a service charge at the cinema, or the pub, or the shops.

The thing is - the world has changed over the last thirty years

full time minimum wage is not a bad income - many graduate roles are being bumped up because the starting salary is below the new minimum wage. Minimum wages ultimately encourage wages to stick - other countries that have them show that wages will move to that point.

then we have people eating out a lot more than 30 years ago and there are a lot more restaurants/cafes on the high street

combine the fact that more people are earning the same wage as wait staff and you will find people can’t/don’t want to supplement that min wage when that is all they are on

its not surprising a lot of restaurants fail either - it’s competitive and because of the economy at the moment the demand has gone down a bit. Restaurants have no more right to exist than independent book shops or greengrocers. Do we give those independent shops extra money to support them?

I personally don’t mind tipping but I will choose how much and other people can choose too without being made to feel guilty

Not unreasonable.

The practice of adding service change that can be removed "on request" is basically guilt tripping customers who (typically) would feel awkward asking for that to happen. Particularly when you're in a group of diners and the others wont challenge it.
I get it removed or pay depending on the quality of service. So, my choice! But I'm more inclined to not pay just because they've pissed me off at that point.

I would much prefer that we didn't have any tips in the UK. If you want to charge £12 for the burger, charge £12 don't charge £10 then add a service charge to make it up.

What?

I nearly always tip. The service has to be pretty bad not to. I like the choice. I tip anywhere between 10 and 20%. I don’t want someone to decide for me. It’s added deliberately as some folk won’t notice and just pay it and some are too shy to ask for it to be removed.
And I have worked as a waitress in my youth.

There is no VAT added to optional service charges, it is only added to mandatory service charges, and yes the server is taxed on the tip.

Totally agree. So many people have not got a clue how hard it is to make a profit up in this industry at present.

If your business is not viable without guilting charity (and yes its charity), then your business is not viable.

Put your prices up if you need to take more money in. If your business is good and in the right location, it will survive

No it was Browns for lunch, then a lovely pizza restaurant for dinner.

We need to put a halt to the tipping culture; it's illogical and no one wants to see the UK & Europe going down the north americain route where tipping is expected at 20% or more (40% according to a recent tweet I saw).

We have a min wage which is increasing every year & far better employee rights v the US so id give up tipping everywhere if it were up to me.

What I hate about tips is the percentage charge, why should I pay more tip of if I get a £20 bottle of wine or a £50 bottle of wine, the waitress is still doing the same job either way - FWIW I always tip

Thinking about why I tip - it’s because I saw my parents doing it when I was growing up - but that was definitely more rounding up or leaving a note of service was good

i just don’t feel we are in the same world anymore though now that wait staff are guaranteed minimum wage. I would rather pay more for the food etc than have to pay a service charge and then make a choice if I want to leave a particular staff member a tip

if a restaurant can’t survive on higher then people have at least made their choice clear - the price is not worth it to them

I have a few independent restaurants I go to that I would happily pay more for and there are a few in the area that I have been to once because they weren’t great. Just because a restaurant is independent doesn’t mean it deserves to survive

Ime, people never correlate higher prices to higher wages for service staff, it's just not even a consideration for most, only talk about being ripped off and how the experience of having other people cook, serve and clean up after you is too expensive.
And for those that do, they genuinely seem to feel that as the customer and the one using the service, they're entitled to stellar service for less than it costs to provide that service and pay the people delivering it a decent wage, people say they wish they'd not put a service charge on and just charge more, but in practice balk at that as well.
People just don't want to pay for it, either in with the price or as an option, they expect someone else, the business or the servers, to subsidise the service they choose to use, which is in no way essential.

ETA - I also don't agree with the service charge as someone who works in the industry - I'd rather go without the tip/charge than people use it as another reason to have a moan and release their frustrations at me.

Christ almighty Mr Scrooge! How tight are you?

What on earth are you talking about?

VAT??

VAT isn’t added due to service charge!!!!

Why do some restaurants add a service charge? Aren’t waiters and waitresses paid minimum wage now ?