To think drunk drivers should lose their vehicles?

[SassyPearlEagle]

Just been reading about Latvia, they've had this law for 3 years and seized over 2,000 vehicles. They're either donated to Ukraine, or auctioned off to raise money for the police - one Ferrari was sold for 176,000 euros.

Why don't we do the same here? Stop pussyfooting around with fines and driving bans, just confiscate the bloody car as soon as the breath test is failed.

My dad was an alcoholic and crazy driver. As a terrified child sitting in the back I used to wish he'd get stopped. Losing his car would've been a quick and effective punishment, I think. So fucking tired of hearing about drink/drug drivers killing people.

I thought they were meant to be proportional but were capped at least sometimes?

E.g. for one of the drink driving offences the fine is capped at £2500 (the other is unlimited I think) and there are various articles noting that poorer people are often more substantially impacted by fines than wealthier people.

https://sentencingcouncil.org.uk/resources/common-offences/drink-driving/

I'm sure Ant out of Ant and Dec got a huge fine but it would have barely touched the sides

My friend drove without insurance a few years ago and the car was impounded and he had to pay a few hundred to get it out.

I assumed this was standard but maybe not.

I believe in punishment that fits the crime.
Drunk drivers should work in hospitals or clean up roadside accidents (don’t know how either of these would work) but I think they need to see the potential consequences of their actions.

Regarding proportionality of fines; well yes, there are caps but at the other end there are processes in place for people with lower incomes to return to Court for adjustment.

To be honest, I have never thought fines were a particularly effective punishment unless fixed penalty at time of offence. Deprivation of liberty, time or movement, or property, and unpaid work always feels more appropriate.

“If a drink driver’s car is destroyed in an accident, or if it does not belong to them, they will pay a fine equivalent to its value”

@SassyPearlEagle In the article you shared it said the above . I don’t know if co-owning would count as belonging to them or not.

I actually don’t mind too much if it’s owned by someone else. If you use your car so recklessly that it’s akin to being a weapon that weapon should be removed from you.

It’s not the same but it’s slightly similar thinking behind how a gun that is used by a couple is removed from a house, even if it just one person is considered unfit to use one. Maybe people’s partners would be more compelled to try and stop their drunk spouse driving off if they had to face consequences too. On one level It might be a shame for them to lose the car, but the person they need to blame would be the partner they chose.

My scepticism to it is more around the fact I’m sure if this is a good deterrent, would have had to see stats of how it’s worked in other nations.

Why are you assuming that drunk drivers are unemployed?
I had an ex that was caught drunk driving. He was already working in a hospital.

This seems to be widespread across a number of European countries. In France a judge can order confiscation or in some cases must order. A co owner can object as can defendant. this includes some compulsory.
Compulsory confiscation
The judge must order forfeiture of your vehicle if you commit one of the following offenses:
Recurrent driving while under the influence of alcohol
Recurrent drunk driving
Repetition of refusal to submit to blood alcohol level checks
Recurrent driving after drug use
Repeated refusal to submit to drug use checks
Repeated driving of a vehicle not equipped with an immobilizer, despite a prohibition by a judge following a conviction for drinking and driving
Repetition of refusal to comply
Refusal to comply in case of aggravating circumstances
Recurrence of large excess speed (equal to or greater than 50 km/h of the maximum authorized speed)
Manslaughter while driving in aggravating circumstances
Unintentional injuries while driving in aggravating circumstances
Driving a vehicle with a false driving license
Driving a vehicle despite a judicial decision to suspend, cancel or prohibit the issue of the license
Motorized rodeo
However, the judge may not impose the confiscation penalty provided that give reasons for its decision. For example, because of the circumstances of the offense, your personality, the value of the vehicle, the consequences of a confiscation on the living conditions of your relatives.

Despite my previous post, unpaid work is incredibly complicated and costly to deliver. You would not believe the number of people who suddenly become unable to ‘work’ when faced with Unpaid Work Orders ! And, don’t forget they have to be monitored.

Working in hospitals, lunch clubs, clearing gardens, litter picking, etc. etc. all have to be monitored and could take work away from employed people.

It's a minefield.

I believe that not only should the punishment fit the crime but also fit the offender. No point fining a millionaire £100 but tag them and confine them to their home 7pm - 7am for a while....?

I don’t think drink drivers are unemployed - in fact I think it’s the opposite and many people who work stressful jobs use it as an excuse.

But I think instead of bog standard community service, the roles should be related to the crimes they commit.

Although I’m not sure how it would work for people like your ex who likely worked with people affected by road traffic accidents and still did it.

He was a porter in a children's hospital. His name and crime was posted in the paper, so he was shamed enough. It did not affect his job though.
He lost his license for a year, had a big fine, had to go on a course, and his insurance went up so much, he could not afford a car again. He ended up getting a moped.

Not necessarily

I'm not sure a lifetime ban is proportionate for a first offence but I certainly would advocate a lifetime ban for any repeat offenders.

Well the partner of Thomas Cashman had a 'business' that almost certainly was used for money laundering. They were renting (common practice for criminals apparently, presumably because it's easier to pay cash with no questions asked) so she's gone back to a council estate with the kids.

Given that almost all drink and drug drivers are male there are some other things they could usefully lose................

Well I've learned something tonight, never knew that, 83% of convictions apparently.

Only one person owns a car. If you let or know your partner is going to drive your car while drunk, though luck!

Yes, my mum owns her car that she uses for her business. It wont be her fault if my dad uses it when drunk.

She should make sure he can't have access to the keys.

Not everyone drink drives in their own car for one.

He is abusive and wont let her hide them.

Yeah, cars get stolen etc

I think drink drivers should be permanently banned, licence gone. forever

There’s a lot to unpick there but are you supporting her in ending this abusive relationship ? There may come a time when she could end up being accountable for allowing him to drive her car.

I know it's easy to say but he can't make her not hide them if she doesn't allow him to.

Yes, it is partially her fault. She shouldn't let him have the keys.

No it wouldnt but she clearly knows what he's doing it. So deserves all the comes her way. Let's hope its not crashing into another car and killing a family. If she doesn't know time you told her. So yes car gone.