To end a friendship because of this?

[Boldness40s]

Am I being unreasonable to expect people not to talk over me and to have a decent conversation where both people have enough space to talk express themselves and feel properly listened to?

I am really struggling with my friendships. I am not someone who can tolerate this kind of behaviour anymore. I could in my 20s and 30s but not in my 40s. Recently, I have had to remove three friends from my life. Some removed themselves too as call them out as I had enough.
It almost like that is ok for them to display such bad conversations skills but not ok for me to let them know that I am not comfortable with.

I have categories the people I have come across

1. People who constantly jump from one subject to another without giving you any space to talk at all. You don’t get a word in. And when you finally do get a chance to say something, they don’t really listen they look somewhere else or start doing something else and you are left thinking I was actually talking.

1. People who talk over you all the time. They don’t give you enough space to finish your sentences. They try to finish your sentence, They just interrupt and keep talking.

1. People who suddenly give their attention to something or someone else while you are talking for example to their child, even when the child isn’t actually needing attention. I completely understand that children come first and I have children too but at least let me finish my sentence. Instead, they suddenly turn away, tickle their child, smile at them, and give them full attention, and I am left thinking, Okay, she is not listening to me anymore.

I honestly feel like I have no tolerance left for these kinds of people. If you do any of the above, you have very poor conversation skills. If you’re not listening, what kind of friendship is that? Why would anyone want to be friends if they’re never given space to talk or express themselves?

I’ve removed several friends from my life because of this. I’m absolutely okay being on my own, but I will not put up with this kind of behaviour.

I’m genuinely interested to know why some people have such poor communication skills like this.

Also if you come across any of these people, do you know why they are like that? I am still interested to know why even I often cut my relationship with them because I feel like I can’t find anyone that I can be friends with anymore. I am a little lonely 😭

Some people tell a really good story. I'm happy to let them talk. I'm enjoying listening to it.

The conversation doesn't have to be equal for someone to be good company. That's too rigid a stance for friendship to flourish.

If this is repeatedly happening to you I think this is more of a you problem than a them problem

It depends on whether overall you feel heard and listened to by someone.

Friendships involve give and take and sometimes one person will be more dominant in one specific situation. If that evens out over time I think you need to cut people a bit of slack. You can’t expect every conversation to be totally balanced.

But it sounds like these are people who overall haven’t really thought about your needs. I think you need to look at the big picture as opposed to focusing on each interaction in isolation.

For people who have ADHD and tell me that their friends are not ditching them that it is fine and that they are accepted for who they are. I understand where you are coming from. You know who you are and you find friends who can tolerate this and that works for you. But not everyone has to tolerate it.

It is actually really draining to listen to someone constantly without having any space to talk or express yourself. That is not a two way relationship it is one way. If you have no space at all to express yourself in a relationship I don’t know what you would even call that. Try to imagine it from the other person’s perspective.

I feel like sometimes ADHD becomes an excuse that because someone has ADHD other people are expected to tolerate everything because they can’t help it. I completely respect that you can’t help it and I know social situations can be very difficult and awkward for you as well. I truly understand that. But that doesn’t mean I have to put up with it if it is not good for me anymore. If it drains me and affects me badly I think it is okay for me to step back from that friendship.

Some people say ditching my friends. That friendship is draining for me and it is not healthy for me. So yes I chose to step back and I think that is okay.

What I would say is whether you have ADHD or not if you are aware of yourself and you are genuinely working on it I would absolutely be willing to continue a relationship with that person. If I can see that someone recognises the issue is aware of it and is trying to improve that matters a lot to me.

But with this specific friend I tried and I spoke to her twice very politely. I told her openly how uncomfortable I felt and how it was affecting me. I opened my heart to her. She completely ignored it and continued the same behaviour. I put effort from my side but didn’t see any from hers. That was really sad for me because I genuinely wanted the friendship to work.

I don’t think people should expect others to tolerate behaviour that hurts them just because someone has ADHD and “can’t help it.” I don’t have to tolerate it if I can’t anymore. I really hope you can understand that too.

You made me laugh. I do not want them to stare. 🤦‍♀️

I am aware that there should be balance

I am aware that not every single conversation needs to be perfectly balanced. But overall a friendship should be. It shouldn’t feel like a one way friendship from my side after years and years.

My OP is not based on a single conversation. It is based on the experience I have had over months and years with those specific friendships.

Tell me if I'm wrong OP (it has been known...) but generally have you been a people pleaser in the past, pushed your needs below others, not had people give you thought like you've given, and you're starting to think 'hang on, fuck this'?

Genuine friendships are wonderful and enrich your life, but if you've had a majority of friends who just talk over you and don't check in about things you mention (even I make sure I do this!) then perhaps this is about breaking a cycle you've noticed and not putting up with it any longer?

Or the ‘you problem’ could be that OP accepts this treatment from friends too often and for too long.

Thanks for asking politely rather than just attacking me and saying it is my fault. I am okay with these questions and I am genuinely trying to understand my part in this.

To answer your question no I don’t think I am a people pleaser and I don’t think I ever have been. But my boundaries were definitely not as strong in my 20s or even my 30s as they are now. One specific friendship that I had to step away from made me especially sad. We had eight years of friendship and I always hoped that over time it would develop and improve that I would eventually find a way to express myself properly. But it never happened.

So it is not like I suddenly decided to cut people off. I came to a point where I realised I can’t tolerate this kind of behaviour anymore. I do feel like it keeps happening to me but now when I notice similar patterns in other people I tend to step away from those friendships too. Maybe that is why because I was exposed to this for eight years in that one relationship.

After that anyone new I meet if I see the same behaviour I don’t have the years of patience anymore.
I am actually good at making friends and people generally like me. I can make friends easily. But maybe I attract these kinds of people because I am easy to talk to because I listen and because people feel comfortable expressing themselves to me.

Sometimes it feels like they don’t even realise I am talking when they talk over me. I don’t think they are aware that I am speaking at all. Maybe my voice is too soft or maybe I speak quietly. I don’t know. But this has been happening repeatedly especially over the last few years.

My tolerance for it has become very low because I have been exposed to this behaviour for so long being talked over, not being given any space to express myself, constantly listening without being heard. That affected me. So now when I see the same pattern in someone else I tend to step back much earlier.

Maybe that is the reason. Maybe it is because I am in my 40s now and I have finally realised that I am not going to tolerate this anymore. I have reached a point where I think fuck that no one gets to do this to me anymore, because it affects me really badly. And maybe that is exactly why this is all coming up now.

To end one friendship is entirely reasonable if it's just not balanced and there's a good feeling both parties are participating and being listened to. To have to do that to three, and for others to also stop being your friend does sound like something has gone wrong somewhere, either in who you pick as friends, or the dynamic that then plays out between you.

I am enjoying listening to 'Let Them' on audiobook at the moment, OP. One of the key points is not just to 'let them' do their thing and see you can't control others, it is also 'Let Me' think about what is in my control and what I could change/alter/do differently in the future. I think you have identified how you can distance yourself from these friends who are now not friends, and established your boundaries, but now you are stuck. It might be worth buying this or having a listen, as it makes the very important point that if you simply distance yourself and step back you can end up quite lonely and not connnected and that doesn't seem to be what you want.

Yes I think screen addiction has had an impact. People talk in soliloquises now. If you watch reality tv it’s the same people will talk about their problems and then someone else will talk about theirs but there’s no back and forth or natural flow. It’s all very odd.

Couldn’t agree more.

You definitely deserve to have friendships in which you feel heard and valued.

It shouldn't matter how good a listener you are or how softly you might speak; a genuine friend cares about what you have to say and makes room for that.

I said upthread that my friends are tolerant of my random ramblings and patient when I interrupt- I hope, because they know without doubt that I value them, care about their lives and make sure to listen and engage.

My ADHD misfires are almost like awful, incorrect punctuation in my conversations sometimes - not wanted or needed, but the overall context of the conversation is still there.

It sounds like that deeper connection hasn't been present, despite trying? I wonder if these friends have been a bit self centered?

New friends needed!

Maybe they are self centred maybe not. They are not bad people and I know they don’t try to dominate me or hurt me on purpose and I realised that they can’t help.
I am going to make new friends definitely 🤗

I have a friend who monologues (seeing her later this week). I am an introvert and find her exhausting but absolutely adore her, even though she asks me a question about a piece of info I've already shared (about 20 mins earlier).
What can I say? She is entertaining, hilarious and adorable and - at the moment - she is the one that needs to be seen in our relationship (it's been 10+ years and I am fairly sure we take it in turns, just mine are quieter!)

I have ADHD as already mentioned and I wholeheartedly agree. Friendship is connection; mutual love and support, expression and communication.

My husband constantly interrupts me mid sentence, I then lose my train of thought and forget what I’m saying as I’m just too tired ! He’s insistent that this is what a conversation is so I’m almost relieved to read people here saying it’s not , it’s rude !

Did you not read the post you quoted? If a friend didn't tell you about a significant bereavement because your ADHD was centre of the universe and you never gave the space to speak. It would be your friends fault?

If you have quite a few friendships and this is happening with a minority of them and it's fine with the others, then it's the conversation-hoggers not you @Boldness40s

They might be nice company for a short time but with the level of self-centredness that they are showing I'm not surprised you got fed up. You are definitely not being unreasonable.

Ive got two people in my life like this myself.

One is a relative I don't like. He's a decent man but he absolutely dominates the conversation and interrupts you and talks over you all the time. My then 4year old son once asked him "why do you talk over Mama all the time?" and he still didn't stop. The very final straw was when I went to see my new niece and was chatting, he saw where I was going in the conversation, interrupted loudly, took over my point and said it himself. Several people in the room gasped at the rudeness. I haven't held a conversation with him since - just say yes or no if he tries, leave the room if I'm alone with him and and never initiate a conversation myself.

The other one I'm very fond of now but we went through a difficult process. We have a hobby in common and she talked over me really very rudely at first. I was patient for a couple of years, but then when she kept on talking right over me mid-sentence I started simply keeping on talking, and kept on. Other times I stopped, waited, and then went back "as I was saying ... blah blah". When she actually didn't take offence to these tactics I got to the point of saying "Anne, let me finish please" in a friendly tone of voice. She actually listens now and we have a much more interactive style of conversation. Like I say, very fond of her and I respect that she backed off. Not many conversation-hoggers do.

I have a couple of friends like this.

I think I am spoilt because my friends tend to be in a similar job roles as me -Im a social worker - and we are used to listening to what people are saying all day. I have good conversations with my friends, we all actively listen and encourage each other to open up.

But as a result I always find it more shocking when I talk to others and they are simply not listening. They are staring at their phone, texting, looking around the room, etc. Like - why the fuck did you meet up with me?

I invited my sister into town the other day for a bit of shopping and a coffee and she was constantly sending whatsapp voice notes back and forth with her husband. The final straw came when one pinged while I was talking and she actually played it over me.

I told her I didn't like it she she just rolled her eyes and said "sorry" in a smiling cheeky way like a child being told off but not regretting what she's done.

They don't seem to realise how hurtful or rude it is.

Its definitely not you OP. I know for a fact I'm a good communicator and I never had this problem 10 years ago. It's a society problem. Our attention spans are ridiculous now.

@Cantheowneroftheredcorsapleasemovetheircar how would your sister react if you were as inattentive as her?

It is not that she doesn’t realise it is rude. It is that she is making it about you, not herself. She is putting it on you like you are the one in the wrong. All you can do is keep your boundaries in place.