To think that moving overseas to escape your problems is daft

[Pavementworrier]

Because overseas will just have new problems (compounded by people thinking you're an annoying foreigner)

Considering that the UK has the highest rate of emigration of high net worth individuals in the world, people certainly are leaving.

It isn’t as simple as ‘the UK has lower taxes’. Income tax may be lower than in some countries, but that doesn’t by itself make for a comparatively attractive country, especially not if you’re caught in the tax band trap. You have to factor in things like business taxes, opportunities available and competitive wages, fiscal drag, the aforementioned tax bands, inheritance taxes, and VAT.

Take Sweden for example - higher income and payroll taxes, but ones that are applied at quite a flat rate (so there’s a less of a sense that the burden is only falling on those with more). Significantly, they’re much more competitive when it comes to taxation of business. There’s also zero inheritance tax.

I moved abroad 18 years ago. I wasn't trying to get away from any problems (I didn't even intend to move permanently) but when I read about quality of life in the UK these days, it seems I certainly avoided a lot of problems.

I lived abroad for 17 years. I didn’t leave to escape problems, but the problems I had at the time ( massive issues with step family and in-laws) meant I gladly left.

Whilst away I had the luxury of bringing children into the world stress and family politics free, and even though their tentacles reached that far, I lived in peace.

When I returned the issues raised their ugly head again, so yes my problems diminished overseas. Also I had a much better quality of life when not in the Uk.

I lived abroad for 17 years. I didn’t leave to escape problems, but the problems I had at the time ( massive issues with step family and in-laws) meant I gladly left.

Whilst away I had the luxury of bringing children into the world stress and family politics free, and even though their tentacles reached that far, I lived in peace.

When I returned the issues raised their ugly head again, so yes my problems diminished overseas. Also I had a much better quality of life when not in the Uk.

Depends on extradition treaties. Do your research.

"Wherever you go, there you are"

I moved to the UK 35 years ago from an EU country. I am very happy here.

Moving meant I could escape an abusive family environment and finally be my own person.

People have always moved to other locations for perfectly good reasons: work, studies, to be with a partner from a different country, to have a different lifestyle, to start businesses...

I think it is healthy for an economy and a population to have incomers bringing new ideas, skills and investment.

Agree, a lot of the issues I see people writing about on here just don’t affect me as I live in a country with very affordable childcare and free education up to Master’s level. There are problems of course but a lot of the basics are taken care off. There is also a very good work/life balance here and there are very few SAHMs (presumably because women choose not to be as they could be if they want to be).

Of course it doesn't. It's a change of scenery and culture, but every country is going the same way Britain is, just at different speeds.

One caveat; If you have complex ailments that NICE won't approve medicine for, or if you have cancer and want to not die, either go private or go to another country. We have the some of the worst cancer survival rates (for complex cancers and those that need early detection and intervention) in the developed world.

My Dad brother and many of Dmum cousins moved abroad - different locations for work in 60s. They've lived compared to my parents very glamours lives.

I think it's a combination of different ecnomics , probably persoanalities that were open to it and risk taking in general - and being new to an area. We've moved round UK came here decade ago and have in that time done all the local and no so local landmarks - kids my DC went to school with often haven't even the free ones - one I grew up near we didn't go to or went once or school took me.

Our college who have moved abroad all seem happy - some were moving woth foreign born spouces and have rased families or just for work. Many of IL freinds kids have apparently moved to Spain and Portugaul - not sure how they manage it but seem happy though work hard there as well.

Housing costs can be high in other parts of the world as well but not every where - and they are a major issue for many - plus UK media on a long down on country and many areas are run down. Depends why people are moving but I think many I know seem happier even when they have some of the same issues.

Poland and the Baltic states have some dodgy neighbours. At least in the UK we have Ireland and France, neither of whom are likely to invade.

If the problems are:

1. Cost of living. Frequently professionals earn a LOT more overseas. And therefore can afford a much nicer quality of life.

2. The weather. I agree to a certain extent on this one. I moved from the UK to a hot country. Only to find that I frequently got heat exhaustion. Having leisure time in a hot place and trying to work are totally different things.

3. Family. Defo solves this one! You only see them once or twice a year so a lot of the conflicts are avoided.

4. Healthcare. I've lived in 4 other countries. As an ex pat professional overseas, I had really good private health insurance as part of my package. As a result, the healthcare was fab. And the one country I lived in without it, their version of the NHS was better as well. ~

5. Other places thinking you're annoying as a foreigner is definitely dependent on where you go. Certainly, European countries are irritated by the British to a large extent. Not helped by our inability to speak their language. BUT further overseas, South America, Asia, actively like meeting people from other cultures. If your only experience of attitudes towards immigrants is the UK, I understand thinking that, because we're a racist bunch. But not all places have that attitude.

I'd love to go overseas again. But don't want to leave grandchildren and miss out on their best years.

I agree with the people who say - it depends on the problem. OP, you do seem to be particularly negative about people moving abroad.

Feels similar to me to the "go on holiday and your problems are still there". Some people i know are just miserable, moving abroad (going on holiday, getting a dog etc.) wouldn't help - they need to work on themselves, their relationships etc.

However, if you're fed up with the weather, or can have a different career abroad, or escape the 9-5, retire early etc something specific, then it definitely could help (if that thing is your "problem").

Your replies are a bit weird. Yes I think (like a previous poster) that moving overseas was the best thing we ever did for our family. The kids have had way more freedom and personal safety where we live and the education has in many respects (not all- choices of subjects are more limited especially for teens but it is wonderful for primary and middle years) been far superior and also more relaxed - 5-15 days per annum off at parent's request for family reasons, no nonsense about school uniforms and much more nurturing/inclusive etc and a much better way of dealing with bullying etc.

We also pay very low taxes but I don't universally love that. Some of the infrastructure could be better especially roads etc albeit that is caused as much by corruption and siphoning off funds than the low tax rate - Romania for example does much much better on a comparable low tax rate because its corruption index is nearly 20 points higher.

Also what healthcare have you experienced? Most EU healthcare is good and even in our adopted country which gets a bad rap from brits because it is technically not free at the point of delivery is actually cheaper than the NHS (e.g. hospital car parks are free which more than covers the £2.65 cost of an X-ray) and I am guaranteed to see a specialist of my choice within 28 days of the GP making a referral. So don't make me laugh about the NHS.

But all that said - I think it is better to have positive reasons to run towards something than to run away from anything. But sometimes breaking a negative cycle is of itself a positive.

Love this. Who said this?

Agree with this.
I moved to a country many Brits would consider almost Third world. It was amazing. Healthcare was awesome. Schooling was brilliant. Food excellent. Weather perfect.

As a place we found it to be inclusive. Positive. And support Timely as well as Affordable.

Having lived in Copenhagen for 20 months I can honestly say yes you can get a better lifestyle to some extent but it often comes with a price tag , so won’t necessarily be cheaper - contrary to what many seem to think UK tax is actually quite low relative to lots of Europe - the difference is our costs are not ‘if’ you want to live in nice relatively safe areas with a bit of life. Utilities and housing were cheaper in Denmark and the heating we had was amazing.

there are indeed places with a lot lower tax and in some cases none- which then tends to be loaded on goods and services instead - so it’s somewhat of a balancing act - if you go to Sweden or Germany or Netherlands or Spain and have a mid level paying job, chances are with a similar job you will have a mid level lifestyle there too - more tax, but more covered off - net result similar - so it really depends on your reasons for moving.

i have friends in Australia, same true where they live, higher wages, some very high aspects to costs. Better weather of course, but same is true in Spain or Italy etc .

There are things about UK I missed when in Denmark, but the reverse is also true. Lots of places are exceedingly beauracratic too compared to the UK - few places are perfect in every regard -

Over here, 1) I earn a lot more than I would in the comparable job in the UK, 2) Get free private health insurance, 3) My daughter can go to private, international school, 4) I pay much less in tax, 5) I get to go on a lot more interesting holidays.

I miss the UK in summer (although visit for 2 weeks each year). But until the point that the UK makes it easier to bring spouses back, I will stay abroad, with my family.

I can assure you that it is true. I had cutting edge cancer treatment where I live that has only just recently been authorised for use in the UK.

Agree. And my DiL had fantastic maternity care overseas. 121 midwife for the whole of her labour. A whole raft of tests within 2 weeks of having the baby. Would have taken months to access that level of care in the UK (waiting lists). And all state healthcare level.

Maternity care in the UK is shocking. So many avoidable deaths, of both mums and babies. There are so many inquiries into so many Trusts now, and the care is substandard.

Did it keep the ostrich away?

Do people really use the phrase 'theoretical metric' in day to day language?

Yes I will second a previous poster that maternity care in the UK is abysmal - I had a baby in Switzerland and I would not have one in the UK. I had one pregnancy in the UK that I had to tfmr and 1 pregnancy in Switzerland when I had my son. When I was pregnant in Switzerland it was discovered that I had a rare autoimmune disease that impacted my pregnancy that was never picked up in the UK. I had consultant led care from my 2nd trimester, 2/3 appts per week. Planned c section and 8 day stay in hospital as my son went to neo natal. It's a totally different experience vs the terrible experience I had whilst pregnant in the UK. I know everyone raves about the NHS but if you haven't got anything to compare it to, you don't know any better. Even my mum who worked as a nurse in the NHS for 40+ years thinks it's not fit for purpose. I know if depends where you live and depends on perspective but being able to make that comparison I find it terrifying how terrible it really is.

Elder care can also be pretty horrific - it was for Dad and know few other shocked at lack of basic care from NHS. It very much depends on where you are and what ails you.

There are worse places than the UK and there are better - and there are places similar but better for particular families.

One reason net migration is down is because so many more than expected have left - maybe they'll be back maybe they won't - but I expect most are more capable then outsiders at working out best for them.