To think *some* independent shops really aren't helping themselves...?

[BeansAndNoodles]

I'm massively supportive of small businesses, I try to use them as often as I can. We are lucky to have a high street with lots of independent shops. However, my trips to town are limited due to being short of spare time, plus parking costs a fortune unless you limit it to the free 90 mins that you get in the supermarket car park, etc.

But time and time again I go to one of the independent shops to find them randomly shut. I get that they probably only have one staff member so it's hard to stay open if anything out of the ordinary happens, but it's still so flipping frustrating.

The last few trips to town have ended with me ordering stuff online or going into one of the chains because the independent shops I wanted were closed for no apparent reason. The independent health food shop is the worst, they close for an hour at some point between 11 and 3 for lunch but it's not the same time day to day and they don't say on the closed sign what time they'll be back, so if you get there and it's shut you don't know if it's worth trekking back to that end of town in 30 mins or not. I tend not to even bother checking now and just go straight Holland & Barrat instead. Several more shops seem to rely on posting that days opening hours on their FB page, but thats hardly a reliable way to tell people if they're open or not! Last week I had an afternoon off and took a trip to a different town specifically to go to a shop that stocks work by local artists to get some cards and gifts, only to find it closed with no indication of why or if it was opening late or what. I checked their FB page while stood outside but nope nothing. Later that day (3 hours after their stated opening time) they posted that they'd decided to open later for the Christmas lights switch on and that they hoped people would come and support them

Anyway I've just seen yet another slightly passive aggressive plea from one of the owners of the worst shops for this, complaining how quiet business is and telling people to use them or lose them yada. Well yes I totally agree but more often then not when I try to use them they're not bloody open!

Ditto. I went to a hipster type cafe that was fairly new in the little town local to me, run by 2 cousins in their 30s, and a friend of theirs. They did ice creams, and sundaes, and knickerbocker glories, and fancy tarts and cream cakes - and also various pastries, and sandwiches and rolls etc... some vegan, some not.

I went in one time, (around June this year,) and a woman behind the counter said 'hello, there's a small table for you there, we'll be with you soon.' I looked through the menu and thought 'I really fancy a knickerbocker glory and a latte!'

5 minutes went by, 6 minutes 7 minutes... No-one came, no-was at the counter, I couldn't see any member of staff anywhere... I popped to the counter and waved a bit at a woman in the kitchen. She waved back and nodded (to acknowledge I was still waiting...) 3 minutes later - nothing, 5 minutes later, nothing, 7 minutes, 8 minutes.... I was like 🙄 It had been about 17/18 minutes by now! No-one else had come in, and only 5 or 6 couples were there, and 3 lone people like me. (a few of them were waiting to be seen/served too!)

I just walked out and went to Morrisons Cafe, (Morrisons was 10 minutes walk away,) and I had a slice of egg custard and a latte for about £4.50 in total. Would have cost me about £11.50 for the knickerbocker glory and a latte in the 'hipster' cafe.

I gave them another chance. I went about a month later, and walked in. (It was midday.) As soon as I set foot in the place, a woman called over 'we're closed to the public at the moment, there's a party due to start in half an hour. ... can you come back at 2.30pm?' Errrr, OK then - I will just hang around like a fart in a lift for TWO and a HALF hours, until you're ready to let me in...

Haven't been back since. I just go to Morrisons Cafe now, or McDonalds, or Costa. The place in question has been open since March 2025, (9 months so far.) I doubt if they will last long....

As has been said, you can't just support these 'independent' places purely because they're independent/family run... Not if the service is shit, and they cost twice as much (or more!) as the big conglomerates! They are far much likely to get shirty and arsey if you complain too! (And not give a refund, or vouchers.) As someone said, they will often try to make any 'complaint' your fault.

Disclaimer, not ALL small, independent businesses are like this of course, but more than enough are!

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@FofB I'm always confused by the political thing, do they really think people will buy from them because they agree with their politics? And do they not understand that people who don't agree might just go somewhere else?

I really get annoyed when I see the "use it or lose it" brigade ranting online about their shop etc.

No one deserves to have a successful business. If you do not have enough customers to be successful it's either because your product is not appealing, your price is too high, or your hours are not convenient.

It's not up to the public to solve your business woes. Plenty of independent businesses have adapted and remain successful. So it is possible. But it requires hard graft and creativity, not ranting and guilt tripping on Facebook.

There is a small town near my parents. It’s beautiful - quaint, old, has an abbey. Good range of independent shops plus a few chain ones. I went in a Sunday I tending to browse all these cuts shops.

they were all bloody shut apart from one charity shop - it doesn’t make sense to me. There are a large number of coffee shops / restaurants and they were packed. I would have thought it would have been a great day to open. I understand they won’t work seven days but assuming they can get weekend staff in you would think it would make sense

I've read so many scenarios on these pages where I swear I can identify the shops and places involved 😆

My best one was last Friday. A round day trip of 179 miles to the historical/touristy town I was brought up in.I was to meet up with my DSis for lunch to do the annual present-swap,then I wanted to go shopping to an artisan jewellery collective - amongst other places - before catching 2 trains back home.I had money to spend (including Christmas money from my DH) .

Said jewellery workshop was shut; they'd decided to close that day because they had a stand at a huge local Christmas craft fair on the Sunday so they were grabbing 'time in lieu'.Just a sign on the door,apparently no other indication or warning.DSis hadn't picked up any info about the closure on the local town FB page or anything so I was pretty disappointed.

I hope they did well at the craft fair;they probably took more during that than they would have done in the shop during a normal day off-season(despite my potential purchases😆 and Christmas approaching)but when they're already shut on Mondays anyway it's a bit annoying to say the least that they won't stick to their hours for the rest of the week.

Tangential whinge incoming...

I get driven up the wall by how many shops don't have door numbers anywhere on the shop frontage... if you're looking for a particular number (not a particular business) you end up having to walk into shops and say "can you tell me what number you are?" and then count four doors up and then go in and say "you are xx number aren't you?"

"Several more shops seem to rely on posting that days opening hours on their FB page, but thats hardly a reliable way to tell people if they're open or not!"
Have you ever responded to their FB posts asking that they give more advance notice and/or stick to their stated opening times? Or contacted them with 'tried to shop with you today, you were closed'?

Yes indeed. To give some balance to the argument, I sometimes go to a particular quaint market town in the Midlands, and an eatery opened 2 years ago, doing pizza, pasta, wraps, hot bacon babs, and sausage baps/egg and sausage baps, cheesy garlic bread etc. Quite simple to cook food, but tasty, and great after you'd been to the pub, or had a busy shopping trip... (They're open midday to 11pm daily, except Sunday when they're open from midday to 9pm.)

They are also very reasonably priced, and drinks are a decent price too. Also, they come to you within 2-3 minutes, and the food rarely takes more than 10 minutes to come. Longest we've waited (when there were 5 adults) was 17 minutes, but we were warned it may take 20 to 25 minutes... (So it was sooner than they said!)

They were so popular, that they couldn't cope with the masses of customers, and opened another place 15 minutes walk up the road. (About a year later...) Both places are always packed. You go at midday on a Thursday, Friday, Saturday, or Sunday, and you will get a seat, but go at 10 minutes past, and they're full. 38 tables! (That hold around 100 customers...) The other place (15 minutes walk away) will be the same. That one is about 20% bigger.

Just 4 months ago, the unit next to their first place came up (was a kebab, fish and chip, pukka pie type of place, and they did curries and biryanis and suchlike too.) That had around 48 tables... and was on 2 floors. (It was a restaurant not a takeaway,) and they jumped in and got this too. There is an alleyway between them. So they now have 3 places, and in the 3rd place they have branched out to North American and Canadian food, (as well as other types of food,) and it's always rammed! And it's even bigger than the first 2!

Great service, delicious modest-priced food, and reasonably priced drinks. Also, some nice puddings/desserts to choose from for afters!

The 4 people who own it/run it, (1 woman and her husband, and the woman's brother and his wife, all in their 30s and 40s,) deserve every success, as they work so hard, and always have a smile for you!

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Parking is up to the LA. And LAs see parking as a revenue stream. I have noticed our local small town (I live in adjacent city) has shops closing down since the council started charging for the formerly free carpark. They saw a revenue stream and did not compute that people who park there will be spending in the shops who pay rates to the council. I suppose it matters little to the council whether their rates are paid by small or large businesses but it does seem unthinking to impose parking charges and esp if you are a small town with niche businesses. Disaster.

Small business owner here. DH and I are in at 8am to sort out staff/workshop and then we open our showroom at 9am. Don't close for lunch, a happy lunch break is a hot drink and a sandwich at the same time, and we take it in turns to stay on until the rush hour is over. We've had 2 weeks off all year, as there is no one to cover for us and we advertise the hours on local FB pages/Google at least a month in advance.

What really fucks me off is clients who come and look through our sampling (each sample book costs us anything between £50 and £180) and we've got several thousand of them. We update/check them constantly, and try to offer the best prices we're able given we have a lot of online competition. I spent 3 hours this week with a lady, ordered her batches of samples to have at home, did a site survey.. and she emailed today to say she's gone to John Lewis as they had 10% off this week. What I want to reply is with a bill for my 3 hours. But can't.

If you open a shop there will be a reasonable expectation that you’ll be open roughly 9 to 5 each day. It’s up to the owner to consider whether opening a physical retail outlet is appropriate for the level of customer service they can realistically provide. If they can’t staff the shop consistently enough to have good and reliable opening hours, perhaps they need to stay online or just do fairs etc.

I think many people underestimate the hours involved in an independent small business. When I ran mine, many were under the impression that I could work whatever hours I wanted and make loads of money.

There are probably many who go into it thinking this, when the reality is very different. Initially, long hours were required to establish the business, and often, no wage was taken until funds allowed it. Even when established and you were lucky to have staff to support you, you were constantly on the end of the phone, and it's impossible to fully switch off. The pressure to keep customers and staff alike happy was emotionally draining, with the added pressure that your income depends on it working out, and it was all just on you.

People can be very unrealistic about it - they want the status of owning the business but not the blood, sweat and tears that are required to build it. It really doesn't surprise me that this happens, but also the commitment to make it work is just as underestimated by customers alike and when I sold my business, a lot of people who always spoke to me when I had the business just stopped, would just walk past like I no longer existed. Why? Because it was no longer me providing the service, and I was no longer useful to them. They were only nice and kind when they wanted something, and often they wanted it yesterday and cheaply. To be honest, I wish I had put more boundaries in place to protect myself in the long term, as I got to the end of it all, and I wonder if it was worth all the stress!

After posting this, I'm now starting to wonder if they have the right Idea after all!!!!

@MrsLizzieDarcy That would make me mad too, but I think you'd find that anywhere. Even large businesses may spend a silly amount of time trying to win a client only for it to fall through. I get that you probably cannot match a JL price and your purchasing power is more limited. Luckily it is not personal.

Agreed. i tried twice to buy carpet from an independent shop. Both times I visited it was shut. Ended up going to a chain

I used to live in a little town like that ..you’d go for a coffee and find the place shut early for no good reason .
Before we moved in to a new house we wanted to buy all our carpet and flooring for the house from the local supplier in this small town .
We even made an appointment with him after finding it closed on a trip to check up on the progress of the new house .
Showed up for the appointment , a fair distance for us , and he was closed , we were set to spend a lot £££

Agree, so unreliable. I went to town and tried to get a load of Christmas shopping and an independent ‘niche’ shop was closed, and a number of stores didn’t have what I needed, the right size etc. so I had to go online 🤷‍♀️

They were only nice and kind when they wanted something, and often they wanted it yesterday and cheaply.

To be fair though, sales assistants talking to you in shops and pretending to care about you arent doing it because they truly care either. They just want your money...

Ruthin, by any chance?

YANBU
Hobby business hours do not generate healthy sales.
Nor does guilt-tripping customers for failing to work out which day/hours of the week a shop might deign to open its doors for business.
Serious retailers fit their opening hours around customers.. they do NOT expect customers to accommodate limited opening days/hours.
If a shop's business is slow/failing it is something the shop is doing wrong, not customers.

Then there's the inde's who ask you to crowd fund so they can sell over priced food and close every March as a tax dodge.

I find that so repulsive. I’ve unfollowed local small businesses for calling customers out too. There’s a local business that runs an honesty box that regularly calls out customers for ‘stealing’, complete with CCTV pictures. They’re usually elderly people who have made an honest mistake with payment.

Our town has a mini Christmas market. Basically six sheds along the main street. I walked through this morning and only two were open for business. If they can't put the hours in at Christmas what's the point?

I'm not sure why that's the potential customer's job? Seems an entitled way of looking at things? A lot of shopkeepers are competing with Amazon - always open, often free delivery, right to return and very good prices. And you're saying that the customer should be contacting the shopkeeper to inform them that they're losing business due to not sticking to regular opening hours? Well duh...

I posted early on in the thread and tbh I am so grateful to read the honest feelings around unreliable opening hours as I am pretty new to retail and I live in a place where most urban people would not believe how fast people close up for the day with no regard for the customer, and I have always suspected it was intensely irritating.
I had always said to DH that our shop needs to be different and always open if you have made the trip to get here - and we have kept to our word, it is open 7 days a week/ 365 a year. If you make the trip to support the local produce, it will be open. That's not always easy, but we haven't messed up so far.

I think what I am saying is that it has galvanised me to keep to that commitment!

Where I live, you aren't allowed to criticise local independents in our local Facebook group because it's not considered fair. You can however slag off Aldi, M&S, the local council etc.

I can see that people shouldn't be throwing unfounded accusations around, but I think it's ok to criticise opening hours or their unreliability, if staff are rude etc. If it's true, it's fair to say it in my view.