A quarter of kids live in single parent families

[AdventAnnie]

One in four kids live in single-parent families today compared to 1 in 20 when I was born in the 70s.

Surely the priority to fund the cost of the benefits system and the affordable housing crisis, is to make both parents contribute much more to the cost of raising their children? Family breakdown tends to impoverish both parents to some degree, but so many absent dads in particular seem to get away with it.

What do you all think - if we could make these men pay more (without them claiming it all back in benefits at the other end!), would it go some way to solve the problem or not touch the sides?

You seem to have forgotten about the little inconvenience of deducting tax & NI etc.

I was assuming it was a net amount - why give the gross amount ? The net is what matters.

It's certainly a talent being so rude & offensive without (apparently) trying.

🤣🤣

Thank you. Your reply really cheered me up, actually! I do appreciate it.

I am so very sorry to hear about your diagnosis. I cannot imagine that at any age (I'm 56) let alone as young as you.

I hope you can wring out as much pleasure & joy out of your life as humanly possible xx

(I'd be a useless wet Nelly in your circumstances)

& that you & DH can find ways to make him & your DC as financially secure as possible.

from one stranger on the net I wish you all the strength possible & send lots of love.

but the support isn't FOr the adults, its for the children. Is it better to make the children suffer to punish the naughty adults?

Because it's normal to give the actual wage someone is on 🙅🏻‍♀️

Cultural difference I guess. In my country when talking about the wage we'd mention what actually lands in our bank account.

It would eventually. It used to count toward benefits and then there was a big campaign because families like my grandparents were being fucked over by it. My father was supposed to pay £64 a week, but didn't yet my GP's were treated as if they had that income for benefits.

The system then changed to it didn't count, but the RP only got £20 a week of it if they were on benefits. The rest was owed to the Sec of State to go toward the benefits bill.

However, once the debt to the Sec of state got so high it was decided that something must be done. So they decided that the best course of action to deal with the level of non payment was to let the RP's keep all of the money that they knew wasn't being paid

That was meant to say "It would eventually if there was a robust system of ensuring payment."

Child maintenance debt can't be included in a bankruptcy so generally any debt remains as a debt.

However, CMS have an appalling habit or writing to RPs and telling them they are writing off historical debt, without being clear to the RP that it's actually their choice if the debt is written off.

There was a very interesting case when I worked for CMS where a man died unexpectedly. He wrote a will excluding his children and his sibling was expecting to get his house. Was beyond fuming when he realised that his brothers 45k+ CMS debt would come out of his estate before any beneficiaries got their cut.

Agree that NRP should pay maintenance. Housing is a priority though for both parents. Unfortunately, a lot of the dads I know are low paid. (Retail or bar work) and have to live in HMO, bedsit or as lodgers. They pay full costs as there aren't top ups on low wages for singles. They can't coparent even if they want to. Maintenance is minimal because they can't earn more. To upskill requires costs and time at college/ courses.

Not really when people have to prove their identity and right to work (plus comply with DBS checking requirements) in order to obtain employment now. Same goes for removing driving licences - it'll take away any opportunity for many to actually earn money.

There are loads of powers that can be used before passports and driving licenses.

One of the most effective is putting a charge on their house.

Also making them realise that, like any debt, it can be sorted by sending bailiffs round to take your belongings and sell them.

Tbh though the single biggest thing that would change payment rates is a society change.

My ex messed around for nearly three years. Eventually out of absolute desperation I went to the military welfare bods on his base and said "what happens if I drop my kids off to him because I can't afford to look after them anymore?" His senior officers made it very clear to him, very quickly, that they'd look on him very unfavourably if the 'rumour' they'd heard was true. He started paying that week and never missed another penny.

If the NRP knew that their family and friends were going to be horrified at them for not paying then more would pay. If men knew women in the pub were going to say to each other "Oh that's payment-dodger Pete... avoid avoid avoid..." then more would pay. If they were going to be dropped from the five-a-side team, laughed at in the pub, or pulled up for the "I'm not paying her, she'll use it for her nails" then more would pay.

It's socially acceptable to dodge paying for your kids, or pay the absolute minimum and then complain if you're expected to pay the CMS amount, and whilst it's socially acceptable it'll be politically acceptable and therefore nothing will change.

Until "we will push CMS to use their powers" is a vote winner nothing will change.

YANBU

It is outrageous but also this country safety net has created a surplus of single mothers. No one seems to stay together for long but happily have several kids without thinking much of it.

In the UK it is normal to give the gross figure.

So assuming he’s on 45k with a 5% pension, he’d get around £2850. Minus £700 maintenance is £2150, minus around £1500 for a two bed flat around here leaves him £650 for absolutely everything else.

Very sorry for your loss.

Yes all us pesky widows, how dare our husband's die so young?
One in ten children will lose a parent under the age of 16 in the Uk.

The reality is most averagely paid people need every penny as a couple to sustain a reasonable standard of living. When they split, that money has to to cover two sets of bills/accommodation etc, so the State steps in and subsidises this. There is a complete lack of personal responsibility and yes, some men are bad eggs and the woman is right to separate from them, but not 1 in 4! Too easy to be supported by the state and not have to work through problems and tough times. And it’s what so many kids have issues.

Absolutely. Child maintenance is not seen as a priority bill or debt. Non resident parents still manage to pay rent or a mortgage, council tax, gas and electricity bills, buy food etc. If I am late paying a bill and don’t communicate with the creditor, eventually my details would be passed onto a debt collection agency. I am currently paying off a credit card- if I lose my job, the debt still has to be serviced. I can drop the payment to the minimum but I couldn’t just stop paying.

Also: misogyny. It’s alive and well on this thread. “A surplus of single mothers”. If you search social media for the reaction to the 2 child limit being lifted, it won’t take you long to find the typical comments about how women spend the money on their hair and nails, as if raising children doesn’t cost anything!

Yes exactly. HMRC can make you pay every last penny of your tax bill but a different government department can’t make NRPs pay a few quid a week towards their kids??

@AdventAnnie I’m a single parent. I don’t claim benefits. The two things don’t go hand in hand??

Exactly what my friend said when she became a single mum-she said she didn't want to claim benefits but that they suddenly needed 2 houses, 2 sets of bills etc, so daily life cost almost twice as much.
Plus so many people are out of work, and I'm not talking about people who are working hiding it, as you sometimes read about on here.

I live in a country with no CMS: you have to go to court to get a court order for maintenance if it's not paid. Worse it is not actually seen that it is the (usually) father's responsibility to provide for his children, but the (usually) mother has to show that she is in a deficit 🙄. It costs time and money to go through this combative system.
I went through this and I cannot get my order enforced as my ex, a lovely professional man, has gone "missing". This is a regular trick where your ex changes address, phone, job so you do not have a current address for him. Without this current address he cannot be served a notice for court. So he gets away with not paying a penny. I cannot find him. Meanwhile I am sure that another arm of the State has a current address for him but I cannot get it. The court won't get it. So I, and my children, are stuck with no maintenance.
Other tricks include giving up their job so they have no income.
Meanwhile the government have for several years sat on their own recommendation to establish a CMS. As someone else said, there is no political will to address this. Society doesn't condem the wastrel fathers. Meanwhile those same fathers are thrilled to be getting one up on the mother. Like so many issues where the majority who suffer are women and children, no one really cares.
And because we have a surplus of single mothers, I was married and didn’t see this coming. I work full time and have never received benefits. But my children have two parents and both should support them.

We need a national mandatory male DNA database so paternity can be established at birth.
if they go into arrears on CM, they lose drivers license, professional/trade license, passport and anything else issued by the government.

I live in the US. When I go to renew my driving licence there are signs at the entrance of the RMV saying "you cannot renew your licence if you owe child support"