To think that the mansion tax breaks the principles of taxation

[NorthXNorthWest]

Most taxes fall into:
Income you receive
Profit you realise
Spending you choose

Council tax sit outisde of this. Its more like levy based valuation bandings and was a quick and dirty fix after the poll tax fiasco. It is effectively a service charge not a wealth tax.

Whereas mansion tax is the government estimating the value your actual house, then treating this valuation as pure profit then taxing you on this. Given the majority of homes are purchased with mortgages and paid for by already taxed money:

Why is

Mansion Tax = Estmated value × %

More reasonable than

CGT = Profit * % (Profit = Actual sales price - (Purchase price + actutal costs)

With actual costs being renovations not stamp duty or interest paid on your mortgage

I am not in the mansion tax bracket. I do accept that some taxes need to rise but I don't believe this is the solution.

I don't think it was thought out. Expensive houses aren't selling already because of stamp duty threshold it almost becomes a double tax on wealth, and it will trap some people in homes they can't sell. I'm not anywhere close to the threshold for mansions tax but you do wonder if it will be one of those taxes where the thresholds don't change and in 20 years every home owner will have to pay it.

There is only one principle of taxation:

Extract as much as possible under threat of force without people noticing, refusing to pay, and ultimately rebelling.

We've had taxes on property, windows (a proxy for the value of your house), and beards.

Interesting though that commercial buildings, or residential buildings owned by a company, are not subjected to the tax, nor people that rent a high value property.

I'm therefore waiting for some mortgage company to come up with some elaborate hire purchase scheme to replace a standard mortgage.

.

I don't think it was thought out. Expensive houses aren't selling already because of stamp duty threshold it almost becomes a double tax on wealth, and it will trap some people in homes they can't sell.

Similar to people who can't sell their fleecehold clad flats then.

There are no "principles of taxation".

The government demands. The taxpayer pays. End of.

I would have preferred more council tax bands and only having the single person's discount for lower bands.

"No taxation without representation" as the colonial tax dodgers got their dupes to shout.

Morons in Labour.
socialism does not work

Define "work".

Pretty sure you know what Google is right?
but I’ll bite. It destroys aspirations.

Hahaha yeah wouldn’t you like that.

Socialism worked for me.

Feudalism worked for centuries.

Once again (if you can ?). define "work". Or at the very least what "works" for you.

Did you mean 1500 per month?

Why not just put your argument across WHY socialism DOES work?

Companies which own residential properties already have to pay an annual tax on the property that is significantly higher than this new charge. And it kicks in at a much lower value.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/annual-tax-on-enveloped-dwellings-the-basics#what-you-need-to-pay

Not really. It's bonkers that lots of boomers live in 4 bed houses with huge gardens and their grandkids, who are working, cant even afford a flat. They need to be encouraged to live in smaller houses.

Well I'm GenX and I'm staying in my big house. We are the smallest generation, so don't worry, all the boomers will die, and then there will be plenty of free houses and lots of inheritance to buy them (unless the government snaffles it all).

I don’t agree with the mansion tax at all.

My house would have to triple or quadruple in value to be anywhere near the mansion tax, so it’s not a problem for me personally.

However, it is just a “fuck the rich” IMO. I do actually know someone who will be subject to it. They are people who started a business about 30 years ago, at huge risk to themselves (home as security). Worked guts out, took risks (that would be unacceptable to me) and finally sold business after decades of slog and sacrifice. Now own a property worth over 2 million and aged almost 60 as a result. All relevant taxes on earnings/sale paid and this home is bought from taxed income.

I just don’t think the govt should be able to essentially do a heist on people like this. Where will it end? Sweeping 1% of everyone’s bank account contents?

So can the govt demand 1% of everyone’s bank balance?

They were French invaders! To be fair, taxing their own a fair amount as they'd taken all the land.

It is sold as freeing up homes, but in a country with a chronic housing shortage it does not free up anything for ordinary families or create homes for downsizers. The difference between the mansion tax and SDLT is only the delivery. SDLT hits you once at the point of moving. A mansion tax is like council tax on steroids, its an annual drain on wealth for simply staying put. Different method, same outcome. Homes wont be freed up for ordinary families because these homes are now significantly more expensive to live in year after year + deposits and mortgage rates/ affordability still remain a significant barrier for most people. This is not the rich being dealt with. It is ordinary long-term homeowners being shaken down until they break. The genuinely rich do not lose from this. Thet have liquid wealth or access to other funds so they will hoover up the fire sale stock, and come out owning more of the country than they did before, all whilst paying less tax. Call it fairness if you like, but the end result is simple. The rich get richer, and everyone else gets forced out.

What are those arguments?

Agree socialism doesn't work.

Council tax and stamp duty were originally a fee for a service. Council tax should be called a local council services fee and stamp duty should be called a land registry fee.

It’s a shocking tax because it kills aspiration dead. It was actually what drove the recovery from the dark days of the 1970s - the chance to work hard, acquire wealth and do better for your family.

Anyhow this is just the start. It’ll be lowered to £1 million next, dragging in most London houses, many across the South East and some areas of the big cities. More wealth tax than mansion tax.

We shouldn’t be surprised when the Resolution Foundation have taken over the Treasury. Many Londoners hate this as they see themselves being dragged into the net. The same Labour MPs who failed seats will be kicked out at the next election.

Yes they could