in thinking that breakfast clubs are for working parents

[nametaken]

and not for non-working parents who can't be bothered to organise breakfast for their dcs.

Tinylady, nametaken had the same attitude as you. That it was pure laziness.
But I am hoping that both she and you, having read the thread, as I have said in my previous post, but you seem to have completely ignored, have now realised that many people can/do/should be able to use them for whatever their reasons.Many people have given valid reasons why they should want to use them.
Would you deny a SAHM with a sick dh, a place ?
Or if they had an appointment/wanted to go somewhere and had no one else to ask. Some reasons are more serious then other petty ones. SO WHAT ?????
Surely even you can think of a reason why someone should be entitled to use them.

I must admit I did think breakfast clubs were just for working parents but having read this thread I can see now that if the club is a facility that people can pay for then yes, anyone should be entitled to use it.

I was referring to the free ones really which my brother and partner use. They are just takers, taking something because it's there. They are living on benefits, their benefit payment is calculated to allow for breakfast, but they are sending their kids to the club and spending that money on even more fags. How can that be right? If the after-school club was free too you can bet your life the kids would be sent to that as well

If my dh was sick, how does sending my dcs to breakfast club help in any way?

Yes, let's have breakfast clubs for those people that need them but come on - who really needs 2 breakfasts? Followed by lunch, after school snack, dinner, pudding and cereal before bed-time.

Nametaken's real question, was about her brothers taking the mick.
But .......
Many people have children who have ferocious appetites. My ds does. That kid eats anything. And he is a gannet. But there is nothing of him.
2 breakfasts is only a problem if your child is overweight, surely ?

Breakfasts/getting ready in the morning can be a struggle. Getting everyone up, washed, out the door. As I have said, it can takes ds ages to eat cereal.
If you had a sick dh, you might be very glad of droping off your child, and having a bit of time to go back and care for your dh.
Or god forbid, why should you not drop them off and go and get your .......haircut ?
You are allowed to - it is not a crime.

I'd die before I let my kids leave the house with no food in their stomach just because I wanted a haircut .

I am failing to get my point across then Nametaken.
The whole point of a breakfast club, is that you are paying ( mostly) for a service.
Would you eat before you went to a restaurant?
Would you clean you house before the cleaner came ( don't answer that one, bcecasue I know that lots of MN's do,) but you get my point.
If you are sending your child to a breakfast club. You don't feed them before they go. They would be pointless.
And the parent may be sending them to the club, for different reasonms to the next parent.
But it is a choice.
Neither, for example, do you need to send your child to nursery. Either private nursery or free one (at aged 3).
It is a choice. And at most, a breakfast is provided, and all children are encouraged to partake, becasue it is also social.

Ok, you've sold it to me - I guess it is just a service after all.

Now all I have to do is persuade my school to open one. Why havn't we got one?

We haven't got one either

PB - I know! £1.15 is extortionate isn't it (tongue in cheek emoticon)

My dd1 doesnt go for dinners even though she is in p3 as there is so little she eats. Are we still getting it free for p1-3? I think the money is only promised to the summer. I hate making packed lunches, adn the school food is so good. Ds loves it and dd2 is very keen for when she starts!

I believe it is going to continue next year but don't quote me. I am sure that it was mentioned at the meeting of Glagow Parent Councils' Forum last week - but I might just be imagining it.

God, we are so messed up about parenting in this country... Primary schools are in the main warm and friendly environments where children want to spend time. What on earth is wrong with using a breakfast club, albeit provided under the wraparound childcare initiative? If anything, having x percentage of children at them who actually want to be there, and have the choice not to be, means that the potentially unhappy little mite whose parents have no choice but to send them to school clubs might actually feel part of something happy. Honestly I can't see what the fuss is about; if people choose to use them, and and their children are happy and entertained, that's a good thing, surely?

I suppose, trying to understand another point of view, the sad thing is that some areas do not appear to have the capacity to take all the kids that want to go.

It makes me appreciate the provision here in Glasgow - which, tbh, was started 'cos so many of the kids here are deprived and weren't getting the best of breakfasts (if at all) and it benefits all kids to have their peers starting the day with a decent brekfast. It helps with concentration!

It might also be the case that the school can't afford the staff or even recruit them.

As I said earlier in the thread, the club at our school started off for quite different reasons, became very popular and turned into a childminding service for which the staff were not paid.

If it helps, our out of school club (ie after school and holidays) is set up as a limited company with charitable status. That means it is effectively "owned" and "run" by the parents. We do get a subisidy from the council - but that is decreasing and running costs for the staff (manager plus carers) and premises have to be paid for by the users - who of course can either claim tax credits or get child care vouchers (so saving tax) via their work.

If there were an impetus to set up a Breakfast Club in your area it might be worth talking to the school and/or council.

Where I am it is different as the council is running it as part of their "dinner" service and forms part of their running costs and is subsidised that way.

'If my dh was sick, how does sending my dcs to breakfast club help in any way?'

Its not a problem atm but Dh is off sick for a few weeks (GP suspects stomach ulcer, starting tests tomorrow). he has to be at the Surgery 9am. Now as I have a tiny baby that's no biggie, but if I were in work DH couldn't be in 2 places at once... some DH's have an active parenting role you know!

GodzillasBumcheek,

My son's school is in a fairly deprived area. I don't understand how employing more staff hurts low income families. The more kids who go the breakfast club the more profit it makes. Surely the more kids there are the cheaper it is for a low income family.

Parents have to pay £2.30 for every child. There has to be 1 member of staff for 8 children. It costs £7 to employ an adult. If you have 40 kids and employ 5 staff the school is making a massive profit.

There are some free places for families in desperate need. However you have to referred through your GP, health visitor, social worker or surestart to get one.

GB, I'm North-East too, Yorkshire. I'd get onto your school, maybe ask the PTA if they could look into the costing and such?

Remember if your PTA or some such does manage to to set one up that it is then that run it. Dh is fed up of other parents who use the Out of School CLub complaining about the recent (significant) increases in rates - which stopped the scheme from folding - and saying that "[they] should be looking for alternative funding". When he points out that the "they" are the other parents who have volunteered to be on the Management Committee, and who have asked the parent body as a whole for suggestions as to how to rasie money and who have spent large amounts of their time meeting with council bodies, councillors and other out fo school schemes to seek out ideas/best ptractice - they don't have a response

Ah PB, as a PA Mum myself (even our teachers wont join in), I can well see where he is coming from, but thats across the board- our old chairwoman left after being verbally abused on occasion for not soping X, Y or Z when nobody would help her!

Peachy. He is also chair of the Parent Council - but the Out of School Club is the real burden as it is a limted company and the management committee are all legally accountable for it to be run as a going concenr - something the othe rparents dont'seem to have grasped. However, he is determined that it is something that they will be forced to hear!

ReallyTired...£2.30? Per day? Well, i know a few that couldn't even afford that!

As for getting on to them about it...i really have no need for a breakfast club! My kids talk to me if they are worried (i am thankful i have such a good relationship with them), and have never shown any interest beyond SATS week. They are going to secondary in September so they won't be in the same school.

My interest in this discussion is purely hypothetical, as i can see both sides. In fact i don't see there are any sides at all, just a lot of misunderstandings and misconceptions.

I a baffled by this thread! I can't see why it's sad that my ds, a couple of mornings a week has his toast with his friends at school rather than being carted round the country in the back of the car while I get his big sister to school. What 's the problem?

"ReallyTired...£2.30? Per day? Well, i know a few that couldn't even afford that!"

Maybe, a lot of people couldn't afford it. But so what? Unless there is a real need for a child to attend a breakfast club I disagree with the state paying.

Those who are on a low income and really need the breakfast club for can get place paid for by surestart/ school. (Ie. mum with depression, or a child who has involvement with the educational welfare officer/ social services.)

Someone in Peachy's position would have no problem getting help. I have no idea how many people get help as its confidental.

I really can't see the fuss about people who send their children to breakfast club for social rather than work reasons. It generates income for the school and doesn't hurt anyone.

The fact that quite a few SAHMs use the breakfast clubs makes it impossible to know which children are being paid for because the families have social problems. I think this has to be a good thing.

There is certainly help out there- what there isn't is (yet) enough breakfast clubs in schools. I would consider ours a legitimate expense from ds's DLA anyhow. And i certainly referred people at surestart for this sort of scheme.

I'm probably alone, but I think it's really nice that kids ike their schools and friends enough to want to share breakfast with them. It's not an implication of laziness to use them- I'd find it far harder to get up at the time needed to use a club than to make my own breakfast! (Disclaimer: small baby who feeds through night LOL).

The lazy ones are the ones who give their kids cash for a bottle of coke and crisps to grab from the local shop on the way in; breakfast club implies some level of caring concern about diet, safe environment etc.

Peachy makes a good point in her last post. There's a woman who takes her three kids to school and buys them a bottle of fizzy stuff and a bun/cake/iced danish for breakfast (yes, breakfast, not a treat. She shouts at them to come and choose their breakfast and so on) each and every day of the school week/term/year. Irony is, she gets to school about ten minutes after the breakfast club closes the doors. IF she shifted her bum a few minutes earlier and skipped the daily visit to the bakery her kids could have a better breakfast and some fun with their friends.

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