The 2 child benefit cap lift will be cancelled out by the weekly benefit cap

[Pinkbowls]

I keep seeing all this talk about families with 6+ kids “racking it in” if the two-child benefit cap is lifted, and honestly, it’s hogwash. Here’s the reality:

If the Labour government does lift the two-child cap, it will mainly help low-income working families and families who are claiming disability benefits. These households aren’t subject to the cap, so the poorest families and those who genuinely need extra support for a third or fourth child are the ones who will benefit.

For a single adult with two children outside London, the monthly benefit cap is around £1,832 (~£423 per week). In London, it’s higher, about £2,108 per month (~£486 per week).

Now let’s break it down roughly for someone renting privately:

• Assume the standard allowance + personal allowance for the adult + child elements (for 2 kids) = around £1,200–£1,300/month.
• Private rent in many parts of the UK, and especially in London, can easily eat £800–£1,200/month.
• Add council tax support (which helps a bit, but only partially) and you can see that most of the cap is already taken up.

So in reality, lifting the two-child cap doesn’t suddenly create a pile of extra cash. For families on benefits but below the cap, the extra child element for a third or fourth child may only leave a modest amount after rent and council tax.

The idea that parents with 6+ children will suddenly be sitting on a fortune is completely overblown. The system is designed so that the support goes to those who genuinely need it, not to families already comfortably above the threshold.

The main winners of this policy will be:

• Low-income working families who are earning enough to be under the cap and can actually receive the child element for additional children.
• Families claiming disability benefits, who aren’t subject to the cap at all.

It’s important to separate myths from reality: this is about helping the most vulnerable and supporting working families, not about rewarding large families for being on benefits.

Hear hear. Some people really don't give a shit about anyone besides themselves, do they, but they're quick enough to tell people whose lives are really awful that they're not awful enough. This is actually one of the most depressing threads I have ever read on Mumsnet in terms of what is happening to basic human decency.

oh my god🤣

This thread is about the two child policy. It is hugely relevant if you're sharing your anecdotes. The general thrust of most arguments is that it can be irresponsible to have more than two children unless you have a pretty strong level of certainty that you can support them yourself.

Agree. In some online groups, I've seen many 'full-time' carers or people with disabilities receiving the highest payments due to having 'severe' conditions that prevent them from working, yet they still go on to advanced study, date, and have kids, etc. It can't have been all that time-consuming and severe if they still have the time, energy, and capability to do these other things.

Exactly. People should cut their coat to suit their cloth including the amount of benefits available (if they are planning their family on the amount of cash they will receive from taxpayers). I would like lots of kids. I can afford only two.

The entitlement of some people is mind boggling.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong but for a family to be exempt from the benefit cap, at least one person has to be on either dla or pip. You can't get those benefits for mild problems, you have to have severe needs.

I've been on various internet forums over the years and seen thousands of people moaning about people getting disability benefits, ehcp's, jumping the queue in theme parks etc. But i have never ever seen anyone post that they hope their child is disabled so they can avoid the benefit cap, or hope their child has a life limiting condition so they can have a free trip to Disneyland. If you don't believe me, go and have a look on the antenatal tests section of mumsnet and read the posts from terrified pregnant women waiting for the results of CVS, amniocentesis or nipt.

The benefit cap is going to be raised though? Disability won't come into it. I thought that was the point of the thread.

And to be a carer you have to care for someone on medium or high DLA/pip and trust me it is not easy to get!

Exactly. That's what my post is saying but I'm sure the poster knows that. They'd rather not use their common sense but denigrate others who do.

That was what this thread was originally about, but unfortunately its turned into a only have a disabled child/ren if you can afford to thread.

It said Entitled to have them! Who on earth would want to be Entitled to have loads of disabled children!
That is a vile thing to say!

Can't you see that the ability to study around caring or a disability might be quite different to your ability to hold down a job. And finding a job willing to provide the level of flexibility you need can be incredibly difficult

I see enough people on here moaning about the "unfairness" of people they work with getting reasonable adjustments or flexible working due to health or caring responsibilities.

Seems people are damned if they do, damned if they don't.

Its progressed a lot since then. Blatantly.

I wasnt responding to the cap I was responding to the comment about disabled people having kids

Other religions like the Catholic religion also find themselves having to have large families.

And yet the birth rate in Italy is 1.3 so some Catholics manage not to have enormous families.

However, it is the culture of many other British cultures to do so, particularly Pakistani and Bangladeshi communities. Other religions like the Catholic religion also find themselves having to have large families.
So, there really is a racist undertone to suggesting that the taxpayer should not have to contribute small amounts to support other cultures.

But if they live in Britain, they are perfectly aware of the prevailing culture and can make their own choices based on that and their own finances. Suggesting it's racist not to bankroll cultural choices is so ludicrious I'm not sure where to begin with that.

41% of households impacted by the cap have someone in the household that's disabled. The average for the UK is 32% and this is strongly skewed towards households with older people in them which these families presumably wouldn't have.

You can interpret this a number of ways but it's clear the a very small minority of these households will have children with life limiting illnesses. Learning difficulties, behavioural disorders, and ADHD are the primary condition for 80% of DLA claims. The science confirms that the mere fact that a child is part of a large family increases their risk of a behavioural disorder due to more stretched parental resources (not just money!). Basically it's a complex picture but it's wrong to assume that those avoiding the cap on the grounds of disability all have kids with life limiting illnesses or comparable to those being discussed on the pregnancy boards.

I'd like to see where it said "entitled to have them"?

You read what you wanted so you can make derogatory statements. It says 'entitled', which is 'entitled to taxpayers funding their choices'.

It has rather blurred the original issue though, which is a shame. The issue of benefits for genuinely disabled children is different from benefits for having more than two children and not being in work.

There but for the grace...

No, it’s not different at all. Having children is far, far, far more mentally and physically gruelling than an admin job. By a LONG way.

Anyone who pretends otherwise, or supports this fantasy idea of disability where one is only ever too disabled to work but is fine to have 4 kids, is utterly disingenuous.

I'm fairly sure asking taxpayers to fund certain people's cultural practices may not be so popular these days..

The line from a PP who suggested not funding these extra children was racist, that "Luckily, the Labour party recognise this and want to help" is concerning.

What do you work as?

If it’s not easy to get why are the numbers of awards rocketing in the way that they are? This is the disability benefit paradox - that apparently they’re ’really, really hard to get’ yet we have millions who have been successful. 5 million, in fact.

Legal.

Because the wealthy are renowned for milking the system to pay as little tax as possible.