Fed up of cyclists not wearing hi viz clothing and no lights on bikes

[Jdot]

Yesterday about this time I saw about this time 10 cyclists including food couriers on bikes with no lights and no hi viz clothing. Black clothing

This really makes me cross. If car drivers hit cyclists that are not visible, drivers should not be punished for this

@Redpeach Carnage? I don’t think there is considering vehicle movements every day and cars are safer than they were. Speed limits have been reduced and pedestrians are generally safer. What’s problematic is cyclists always being in the right when they are reckless.

SUVs aren’t safer with regard to pedestrian / cyclist safety in a collision.

Most collisions are caused by cars.

There are too many collisions - there are weekly reports in my local newspaper - yet places like Helsinki & Oslo have really reduced these through adopting Vision Zero approaches to road safety.

I get fed up of people telling drivers they shouldn't be driving if they can't see someone all in black with no lights.

NO. Wear hi-vis. And that goes for pedestrians as well. Stop wearing black coats and expecting other people (not just drivers, other pedestrians, too) to see you.

It's also good when people put lights on their dogs' collars.

Why wouldn't you make it as easy for people to see you as possible? The lights don't have to be those strobing blinding ones, a light is enough.

I think the sale of black coats should be banned and everyone should have to wear highlighter pen colours :)

Yes its true that you need the highlighter pen type colours in dim light and an actual light/hi-vis surface in the dark. I have running t-shirts (Proviz if anyone wants to put the on their Christmas list) with a hi-vis surface and I light up like a Christmas tree when a car's lights or indeed a pedestrian's lights) shine on me, but they are not massively visible in dim daylight though they are fairly bright (and one is white).

But anything is better than wearing all black or other dark colours.

I got a hi-vis thing with lights on from my local garden centre for £5 which would fit over a coat if I needed it to but generally I wear it for running.

Agreed it is infuriating, especially if they are also wearing black. Not using lights in the darker is also illegal. Report them to tbe police. (I'm a former cyclist and normally defend cyclists).

Or maybe the infrastructure is shit and needs improving. In countries with better infrastructure he would be going to school alone from the age of eight on average.

Yep, DC had this last night when driving, had to hit the brakes and stop on the roundabout as a cyclist all in black with no lights just rode out across him. I looked at the dash cam footage this morning and the cyclist made no attempt to stop as they should have done.

Don’t disagree that some drivers are dicks or dangerous to cyclists regardless of whether the cyclist is lit up like a Christmas tree or not.

but the idiots cycling recklessly all in black at night fast, delivering ‘food’….it’s terrifying as a driver. Also, I walk to work mostly, I wear a white coat, so I’ll be seen, so many people walking all in black. Take some responsibility.

As a cyclist commuting in the dark - I agree that there are some cyclists with no lights, too bright lights, or dangerous e-bike drivers.

(fwiw I do think that ebikes need looking at - they really clog up the dedicated bike lanes and are generally manned by reckless, inexperienced cyclists).

I also have pedestrians regularly crossing in front of me - stepping into the cycle lanes. They are very rarely lit up.

But by far the biggest danger is drivers. Drivers turning left or right or into your road without giving you enough time or space, coming right up to you so you're pushed into the gutter or the blind spot behind them. Drivers on phones. Drivers jumping lights, impatient on crossings, parking or stopping on cycle paths or bus lanes. Drivers over taking, or undertaking, or paying no fucking attention to cyclists. (It isn't good enough to say "I didn't see him").

I have seen 2 fatal accidents involving cyclists (honestly you don't want to see that). There are roads I avoid in London and I'm an experienced cyclist - because they are notorious for killing cyclists. And I'm pretty sure drivers cause more crashes than either cyclists without lights or pedestrians wearing black.

@HelenHywater I don't suppose this discussion will get us anywhere because I suspect that the cyclists posting here are the careful ones and the drivers here are the ones that do their best to be courteous to cyclists. All of us would be better putting our energy into persuading local councils or the government into making better provision for the different groups and enforcing the existing laws. Certainly the laws about electric powered bikes need to be tightened and enforced as the vehicles should be regarded as mopeds IMHO.

Ha, I used to be a biker. High viz, headlights... the works. Still had car driver get me in a near miss and utter the immortal line... "sorry mate, I didn't see you".

Car drivers... open your fucking eyes and stay awake!

I'm a cyclist and I agree. Equally with pedestrians/joggers all in black.

Personally I make it a mission to have as many lights as possible as well as high Vis. I work shifts so often ride in the dark, especially now it's winter.

Another issue is 'pod people'. I can ring my bell and shout excuse me till I'm blue in the face but they can't hear me over their music as they bumble along, walking in the off road cycle path.

I wear all the hi-viz, have helmet, have lights etc etc. Ironically I feel safer cycling the in dark as there can be no possibility that drivers don't see me. When I cycle in daylight it is absolutely terrifying how many drivers don't appear to see me on the road.

@HelenHywater What about cyclists overtaking when it’s not safe? I’ve seen this as the biggest cause of near accidents. Flying along with no regard to road conditions and traffic.

My biggest annoyance is cyclists not using the expensive cycle paths! Why have we got them if they are ignored? Some cyclists really do have a death wish.Why would anyone prefer a busy road in rush hour?

Well yes but car drivers have less time to look out for hazards, read signs, work out what other drivers are doing, watch the speedometer etc. Theres a lot to process,

It only takes a few seconds to have an accident.

If a driver struggles with things like that, then they should not be driving.

People only choose a busy road in rush hour if the cycle lane is not fit for purpose. Which is surprisingly common. They are not crazy, they are usually making their best decision based on more information than you have available to you.

Live in Cambridge (Bicycle City) and while many cyclists ride sensibly, I am frequently gobsmacked by the huge numbers of bicycles with absolutely no lights at all!
I've heard arguments that people cannot afford to buy lights for their cycles so this is one reason for it. But at the same time we also see loads of extremely expensive cycles on the road - it beggars belief.
I think some of them have a death wish or at the very least are completely batshit adrenaline junkies.
AND there are often cycle sections on pavements but they still seem to prefer the (very badly maintained) roadway.
I think all cycles should have good quality lights fitted before sale, by law.

Nearly got squished this afternoon (still very good visibility) by a car that not only jumped a red light but turned right at a no right turn junction - they had to navigate around the yellow bollard thing too!

Don’t be obtuse.
Theres not a fixed amount of processing is there?
An unfamiliar road at dusk, roadworks, loads of signage is different from the same road done before, clear day and no hold ups.

They are brand new cycle paths here! The issue is that occasionally there’s a need to dismount. The Lycra clad cyclists simply won’t do it. £ millions spent because a few shouted loudly but it’s poor behaviour from the cyclists. I would suggest number plates and number plate recognition if using a busy road when there’s a cycle path adjacent. There needs to be safety first from cyclists.

And they fail to see a motorcyclist that is lit up like a xmas tree.

Think Bike! is a known road safety campaign.

I would use a road instead of a cycle lane if the cycle lane is blocked (by someone parking there) or if I believe that it's dangerous because of all the ebikes, chariot drivers or pedestrians stepping out. in the dark and rain, I'd rather take my chance (sometimes) on the road. The cycle lanes appear to be closed frequently for works. I don't like the two way cycle lanes because they are pretty narrow, and I feel unsafe with the bike lights blinding me, people overtaking and reckless lime bike riders. I feel that in rush hour particularly cycle lanes no longer work for the volume of cyclists that are now using them. I try to avoid rush hour for this reason.

I don't generally overtake cars unless they're parked on the red route. I try not to go on the underside of lorries or buses because I don't have a death wish.

I saw an awful accident a couple of years ago, where this happened exactly the other way around.
We were stationary at a red light at a busy four way junction, traffic coming towards us in the other direction had a green light, with a green light for right-turning traffic too.
A cyclist came up from behind us and sped past, running the red light into the junction and immediately got hit by a right turning car. He was thrown high up into the air and then landed on the road in the middle of the junction. The noise and the screaming was horrendous. I can still hear it.
I was driving, the lights turned green and DH told me to go and just get out of the way to clear the road for emergency vehicles. Several cars had already stopped.

As a motorist, you make decisions on the best route to take.
Why do motorists therefore feel the need to tell cyclists which route they should take?
We are all entitled to make our own decisions based on our knowledge, route and mode of transport.