Fed up of cyclists not wearing hi viz clothing and no lights on bikes

[Jdot]

Yesterday about this time I saw about this time 10 cyclists including food couriers on bikes with no lights and no hi viz clothing. Black clothing

This really makes me cross. If car drivers hit cyclists that are not visible, drivers should not be punished for this

I'm a cyclist and am finding the cycle lanes (which are packed now with e-bikes, santander bikes, food delivery bikes and those musical carriages things) really dangerous now it's dark. I agree far too many have no lights, are wearing black clothing and/or are driving erratically. The part of the commute on dedicated cycle lanes is in both directions and I can't always see the cyclists coming towards me (often overtaking other cyclists). It just feels really perilous.

Part of my commute is on roads too and those same cyclists are presumably being as invisible and dangerous to cars as they are to me.

I nearly walked in front of such a cyclist last night, crossing the road on my way home from work in the dark. If I had, we'd both have been injured.

Sometimes I need to remind myself that not all MN live in the country side.

The nearest street lamp is 8 miles away.

Lest winter i was coming round a completely blind cirner and there was a cyclist, in black. No lights in front or back.

I'm always very wary of that corner anyway, so luckily going slowly.

It was just so silly of him.

Those stupid flashing bike lights need to be banned too. They make cyclists so much harder to spot.

I like it when they have helmets with additional lights and the arrows pointing to their side. Those plus decent bike lights make them much easier to spot.

Mostly I'm a pedestrian and I see so many cyclists dressed all in dark colours with no lights. Yes, it makes me angry because I don't want them to get hurt, but I also don't want drivers who do happen to hit them having to live with that.

Absolutely it's your job as a driver to be paying attention but it's not fair to expect them to work miracles. It is your responsibility as a cyclist to take certain measures to be seen. And it's for your own good!

Yes, I occasionally shout 'Please buy some lights' to a cyclist. So many are delivery cyclists too, so a clearly spending a lot of time on the road, which increases their risk. I think the companies like Deliveroo should have a legal obligation to ensure they have lights etc, it's basic workplace health and safety. I don't care if they aren't employees.

Yes I had this problem a few times last year. Live in the countryside and a few occasions of cyclists without any lights, reflective gear, or even helmets riding on twisty country lanes in the darkness that I was close to hitting despite me driving carefully. So extremely dangerous and there should definitely be more laws on what cyclists need to wear during dark hours.

A cyclist was knocked down and killed by a car in my area a year or two ago. It was night, no lights, black clothing, no helmet, poorly-lit 60 mph road. The driver was not charged with anything as the police judged that in the circumstances he could not have reasonably avoided the cyclist.

I drive and cycle (with lights, helmet and reflective jacket. Still get nervous at intersections though)

We do also have a lot of teenage lads desperately trying to be hard who deliberately wear all black, no lights etc so its harder for "the Feds" (well, PCSOs) to spot them.

It's absolutely 💯 not a drivers fault if they hit a cyclist. Not sure where you got that idea from.

Could you point me to the relevant legislation that says a driver is automatically at fault if they are in collision with a cyclist.

Last time I checked, the UK does not have a system of presumed liability.

I’m glad the driver wasn’t charged for this. If the cyclist wore reflective clothing and/or lights, they would have been alive today.

I'm sorry, but this is just such a common moan from drivers - complaining about other road users not being lit up by a Christmas tree, and yet they do see them. Do you not see the irony?
My concern is that it's a kind of victim blaming in advance. They're saying that if they hit a cyclist it'll be the cyclists fault, not theirs. But no amount of hi-viz will make up for drivers who don't pay full attention. I know so many cyclists who've been hit by a driver in broad daylight, or had near misses, and the driver has said "Sorry mate, I just didn't see you". Other obstructions can appear in the road at any time, it's a drivers duty to watch out for this, and drive accrding to conditions.
By the way, it is a legal requirement for a cyclist to use front and rear lights between sunset and sunrise, so I'm not condoning non-compliance with this, but rather I'm suggesting that drivers like the OP are trying to shift the onus from them seeing other road users, to these road users ensuring they are seen.

So no big deal then! If a driver can't see beyond the scope of their headlights, they should be driving at a speed whereby they can stop in that distance. Other things can appear in the road besides a cyclist you know! 🙄

I have lights, and a helmet, and high vis stripes.

none of this makes one bit of difference w about 10% of drivers who are either vile, and/or on their phones, or just crap.

yesterday someone passed within 6 inches of me - not fast-fast (too congested) but he was accelerating hard to get to the next bit of congestion, 50m away, and drinking his coffee. That sort of action could have led to a catastrophe for me - it’s selfish and so common.

Drivers don’t hold themselves to the standards they expect of cyclists - no distractions (music, radio); nothing in their hands ever (no drinks); no dim
colours (why are so many cars grey or black).

And when it comes to moving on quiet roads, yes of course pedestrians and cyclists MUST take evasive action to make sure that a driver doesn’t kill them - as otherwise they run the real risk that they will be. BUT THIS IS WRONG. It is not our god-given right as drivers to barrel down rural roads in a way that could cause death or serious injury to another person who is just having a day. And no, lights and a helmet don’t help here. They aren’t magical.

Have cyclist accident stats risen? Would be useful to know the breakdown between commercial food delivery cyclists and others but I suspect we don't collect any such info. It's like dog bites, people don't log them.

We need the police to be on the roads dealing with this! We get apologists for cyclists on here but it’s unsafe behaviour that can have a real impact on car drivers and the cyclists. It’s brinkmanship to not wear appropriate clothing and have no lights. It’s rife in London.

I've seen many teens wearing black head to toe and no lights on their bike - fortunately, they're mainly on lit roads so I see them in time, but I shiver to think of what may happen to them on the unlit winding country roads around here. Yes, drivers should see them in time if they are being vigilant and driving at a speed which will give an appropriate stopping time to respond to unexpected hazards, but it is still idiotic behaviour to make yourself practically invisible on the road.

This

A couple of years ago I was given a load of abuse by a car driver who got out his car to shout at me and my kids in the dark. We had helmets, lights and hi vis jackets on. He told me we should have been riding on the pavement. Yet when I rode on the pavement as a teenager I obviously got told off by pedestrians! Can’t win.

Ignoring the studies that have shown that flashing cycling lights actually are more visible than static, of course.

Ideally cyclists should have both, but flashing lights are not stupid.

Lovely.

It is daft not to have lights on your bike when riding at night.

Drivers however must also drive to the conditions of the road and at night when it's dark you need to slow down.

Animals in the road won't have high vis on. Neither will fallen branches or debris.

If you find yourself continually shocked by hazards in the road at night, you need to slow down.

That's not necessarily true. I was hit by a taxi driver doing 60mph in a 30 zone. The police man who dealt with it looked at my hi vis and lights and said "you were done up like a blooming Christmas tree".

And many cyclists are killed in broad daylight by drivers who are just not paying attention. My teenage son was knocked off his bike by a driver overtaking and turning right in front of him. There are some atrocious drivers out there.

Most serious cyclists use lights. The people on bikes with no lights probably don't think of themselves as cyclists - they are just using a bike to get around. They are crazy, in my opinion, but as a driver you have to be realistic and expect them to be on the roads and look out for them.

I think a lot of drivers - and pedestrians - expect to be able to move about on auto pilot. They are only half paying attention and they are furious if someone else breaks the rules and inconveniences them. As a serious cyclist, I know I have to be 100% aware of all road users at all times, because drivers, pedestrians and yes, other cyclists, can do crazy things at any point. if all drivers drove with that level of care, we'd have a lot fewer collisions.

You should be more cross that people in our society are so desperate for work they are willing to take these kind if risks and bike lights get nicked alot.

You are spectacularly missing the point. If for whatever reason the driver can’t see you, you will end up just as dead. It makes no difference whose side the law is on.

Just drive better

I'm on the cyclists side here, I'm a cyclist myself. I think bikes should come with lights already fitted, particularly ebikes.