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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

But is Berlin is the best capital?

95 replies

fourhundredandten · 29/10/2025 18:38

I have been blown away by the laid back artistic vibe, the efficiency and good value of the public transport (does anyone know - do if most travellers have tickets as have yet to see any inspections/control measures), the great food and the excellent coffee. There are lots of little affordable independent shops and the kind of cute or ethical or creative spaces that have long been priced out of our (country?) cities.

I was in a random city centre cafe and the man left to me left his bag and laptop and went to the toilet. I could see his wallet! He sauntered back eventually and I couldn’t remember when I would have been able to do that. I bought a good bottle of whisky from a supermarket and couldn’t find the tag - because there wasn’t one. My city centre is the Wild West compared to here and while I have seen some homelessness there have been very few and compared to the people by me they look either much better supported or far less advanced in addiction.

Bikes everywhere and cars super observant of the wheels and pedestrians. I would move here tomorrow if I could. AIBU to think this is the best city or this holiday vision?

OP posts:
AliTheMinx · 30/10/2025 10:47

I spent a month living in Berlin in my early 20s and loved it. I didn't really feel scared about my safety and travelled around freely on the U-Bahn day and night. Yes - it's not as pretty as Rome, for example ' but I find it fascinating and steeped in history. I agree that it's very well priced and the hotels are both good and excellent value. I rsally want to take my son.

Fffdaa · 30/10/2025 10:56

Going to the EU makes me feel like an idiot for voting for Brexit. It's so nice there.

Kendodd · 30/10/2025 11:01

I love Berlin!
It's not the prettiest city in the world (although I think, hands down, cities in Europe win that global race as well) I think its very livable.

BlazesBoylansHat · 30/10/2025 11:11

We love Berlin & have lots of friends living there & i can see how you could build a very good life there

It's not my favourite city though. I would choose Paris if i had a choice

GarlicHound · 30/10/2025 11:17

I really dislike Berlin. It's never done anything bad to me, and I can see why it's popular. I just don't like it - the general atmosphere or something, I'm not sure.

ohdrearydrearyme · 30/10/2025 12:23

I live in Berlin, and have been here over 20 years now. Before that, I lived in 5 other different countries, though the only other capital I lived in was Delhi.
Well, the fact that I still live here does tell you that I like it here. :-)
It has various aspects that are wonderful and definitely unique to Berlin. The difference between former East and West is still very apparent when you know what to look out for. War damage still apparent in older buildings in the former East, for example. Even in shops selling second-hand stuff their is a range of things that span former East and West.
The amount of really close-by forests and lakes is particularly something I love (and the forests are legally protected and will not give way to housing, because having them is what guarantees Berlin's water supply).
I also travel pretty much everywhere by bike, so I appreciate the flatness!
Addressing the specific things you raised:

  • people traveling without tickets is actually a big issue. Ticket checkers dressed in plain clothes roam the public transport network. Usually two get on at the same time from different doors, and work towards each other, checking everyone's tickets. It is rare that they DON'T catch someone traveling without a ticket.
  • department stores such as KaDeWe and Karstadt tend to sell high cost items such as whiskey without tags. However, shoplifting is an issue, and supermarkets usually have the more expensive items either tagged or in a locked glass section of shelving that you have to ask an employee to open. Other small and expensive items, like razor blades, are either kept near the cashier, are on the shelf in large plastic boxes that have to be opened by the cashier, or you have to take a cardboard tag to the cashier, and they'll fetch the item for you.
  • homelessness is a problem. There are homeless shelters and charities near certain major railway stations, soup kitchens, and so on. A lot of the homeless are men from Poland (as one can hear them chatting in Polish when one goes past) and are clearly alcoholic. Many live in small one-man tents that are pitched in places a bit out of the public eye, such as alongside some of the railway lines and canals. In winter, certain U-Bahn stations are kept open all night long rather than being locked for a few hours, as they usually are, so that there is a warmer place for homeless people to spend the night.

There are also quite a lot of Roma families here, who beg, mostly from Romania but also from Spain. They tend to live in larger tents, pitched not that far from where they beg. Their life, particularly in winter, looks fairly brutal, and there is a lot of ongoing work (the process is quite slow, but usually ultimately successful) to get them housing and the kids into education.

  • the little affordable, independent shops, artistic spaces etc. do exist. However, when you are here for longer, it becomes pretty apparent that they don't usually survive for all that long. The turn-over is huge.
  • bike lanes have been massively improved over the last few years. There are far more of them, and they are safer than they were as well. There used to be some places with no bike path, and so narrow and dangerous to cycle that I would take a much longer route to avoid it. Pretty much all those places have been improved, which is great.
  • racism: I live in a very ethnically mixed, very central area, where the vast majority are Turkish, Syrian, Palestinian and Ukrainian. German hostility/racism/structural issues are a concern. My son went to kindergarten close by, and the last two years before the kids were due to start primary school, many of the German families moved away to more 'white' suburbs to ensure that their kids would go to a 'better' school.

Immigrant kids tend to do worse at school because most schools STILL finish around midday. Then the kids are expected to go home and do a huge amount of homework - with parental input. Immigrant families are more likely to have both parents working, have parents who may even be illiterate, or have a poor command of German or poor understanding of what is wanted in the school work, or be unable to afford tuition for the kids (which a vast number of German parents pay for routinely for their kids starting from about fourth grade onwards).

  • Attitude: Berliners pride themselves on something called 'Berliner Schnauze'. Basically - although I'm sure they would characterize it differently - it's a way of interacting that is brutally direct and often veering into downright rude. Although it can be funny at times, it can get you down when you face it all the time, sort of like when you have to interact with arrogant, rude teenagers, if you know what I mean. I find myself working hard to maintain relationships with people who I know are friendly to try to get a counter-balance.
  • on living here all the time. Really, things are NOT efficient. Road work and repairs to infrastructure are started, then the workers all disappear and it drags on for YEARS. Bureaucracy and paper work is incredible, though when you FINALLY get an appointment with a bureaucrat, they tend to be capable and helpful.

Last year, for example, if one needed a visa renewal, there was essentially no way to get one. To renew, one needed an appointment. Appointments could only be made online, but the system was not working at all, and therefore no appointments were available. When you followed a link from their web page, they gave information about what your legal status was if you had overstayed your visa (legal to remain, but not to travel internationally), because so many people were forced into that position...

PaddlingSwan · 30/10/2025 12:37

I am in Heidelberg this week and was near Cologne last week. Next week I will be in Frankfurt. All great places to visit, easy to get to and easy to get around.
I thought Cologne was a bit of a dump, but then I had only ever visited the Christmas market before.
Heidelberg is very pretty with lots of independent shops, old castle, scenic walks by the river, the Philosophers' Way etc. etc. but quite full of tourists.
Mannheim used to be very good for independent shops.
Haven't been to Berlin for years, though.
I also like Munich, but don't get down that way much these days.
Generally things work, people are polite and helpful and public spaces are clean. Transport is efficient and affordable. I paid €9 for a day ticket to and from Cologne, journey time about 25 minutes each way, which I thought was very good value (ticket also covered the whole Cologne/Bonn area for 24 hours). In Frankfurt you pay about €6 for a city centre day ticket.
What I particularly like is the regional variations in food and produce - great pleasure to walk round the various open air markets and see what is on offer.

Noodledog · 30/10/2025 12:44

I'm finding this thread interesting. I've always liked Berlin, but it wouldn't make my top 10 of cities in Europe to live in. For me it has a weirdly...old fashioned feel to it? (apologies if my post's are a bit rambling, I currently have flu and my brain isn't working very well 😁). I first visited in the 90s and when I go back it doesn't seem to have changed much since then- the same alternative culture, Kreuzberg, Spatis, the same big techno clubs, same graffiti. Feels like I'm going in back in time (but without any desire to get into Berghain!)

snurtifier · 30/10/2025 12:56

I've liked every German city I've visited except Frankfurt, which is awful.

People say that Berlin isn't as cool and edgy as it was, because it's not super cheap to live in any more. Apparently you need to go to Leipzig to experience that now.

Personally I think it's hard to top Vienna.

furrysocks · 30/10/2025 14:06

Yep I love Berlin, awesome public transport and such a cool vibe to it. Not sure if I could cope with the winters though…

Iliketulips · 30/10/2025 16:04

Whilst I agree Berlin is a lovely city and am not against going back to it, if I could only return to one European city I've visited, I'd go back to Krakow. It's a lovely city, feels very safe, local people very helpful/friendly.

sciaticafanatica · 30/10/2025 16:07

Love Berlin but Bilbao is my joint favourite with Naples

PurpleEmerald · 30/10/2025 16:15

fourhundredandten · 30/10/2025 07:30

@TheChosenTwo that is unpleasant and no wonder it’s not on your return list. I did visit a concentration camp near by and in their audio guide they mentioned the lack of support from the local police in relation to right wing attacks on their memorial. It didn’t elaborate but did make me wonder how right wing/racist the police might be.

@PurpleEmerald ha Germany is famous for admin isn’t it - I did read that getting an apartment was a logistical challenge. I am glad your brother has settled - I can imagine the nationalism you describe although I have been surprised to the extent that English is used - in a way that it never would be accepted in a capital like France. I speak no German beyond thanks and goodbye type words and very one has been really friendly.

I have enjoyed the architecture - still found it diverse and interesting and I like the art and the graffiti- and the delight of the yellow trams.

@Plump82 yeah I think I would regret that too. Is it too late? Any Irish grandparents? Someone was talking about Brexit here and they were just embarrassed for us.

Thanks for the recommendations of the other cities - am coming back in a camper van when I retire. I need to study their junction rules first:)

As a tourist/visitor English is used everywhere! My German isn’t bad but if I speak in German the waiter, shop assistant, whoever will always answer in English. It seems to be once people get wind that you plan to stay that their expectations/attitude change, not that I entirely disagree with that. As a young person moving from one European country to another you should make a good effort to learn the language.

Crikeyalmighty · 30/10/2025 16:23

I find it one of the least liveable German city’s - and I’ve been tons of times with work for weeks at a time - problem for me is its full of hipsters doing a bit of something, so lots of it is quite scruffy and grubby, lots of the architecture is grim and austere and personally I find the food choices ( with some higher end exceptions) limited and not great and not to my taste. I work in music too so it’s not that I don’t appreciate culture etc - and it’s bloody freezing in winter but not to me in a good way like say Stockholm. Give me Copenhagen, Amsterdam, Stockholm etc any day over Berlin -

madaboutpurple · 30/10/2025 16:38

My DH and myself loved it so much we went twice in 2003 and 2004. There was a big C&A store and Ullapopken place to go to and he loved all the museums. Apparently a man was livid as the tram had the audacity to be two minutes late. We had a fantastic time.

singthing · 30/10/2025 16:45

I lived there in the 1990s and it was even better then. A real undiscovered little place. Having been back since it feels like it's got a bit pretentious, although there is still the slightly grubby, workaday vibe if you look for it.

Crikeyalmighty · 30/10/2025 17:49

@madaboutpurple I agree , but I think it’s gone drastically downhill in last 10 years and I went as recently as 2023

Abhannmor · 30/10/2025 17:58

FunnyOrca · 29/10/2025 19:00

If you live Berlin, please get yourself to some other German cities! They are even more liveable!
Munich
Bonn
Münster
Dusseldorf
Essen
Mannheim
Darmstadt
Kassel
Germany is just great and so easy to travel around! I would move there tomorrow if I had a job!

Isn't the easy a bit cheaper though , Leipzig etc. What about Hamburg?

fourhundredandten · 30/10/2025 22:02

thanks for the interesting replies and for those of you who have visited or lived here sharing your experience and @ohdrearydrearyme thanks so much for sharing your knowledge. Really interesting.

I have certainly seen more homeless today although they are still out performing the the ones from back home. Today I saw two having an argument in English while another had three big bags of plastic bottles and was putting a couple of glass ones in the bottle bank. I mean just before I came away I saw three local ones, pants down and needle sharing around the back doorway of a Chinese restaurant. Different recycling principles.

I am still loving it. I think it helps that I love the history element. I was in my element at the Stasi museum today - loved it. Feel like I have had a good walk around very different areas - the posh shopping streets nearer to brandenburg gate, the East German areas around where the museum was, Kreuzburg and have really enjoyed them all. Have travelled further in public transport in a few days than in the past few years of living in the uk.

I am quite an effusive chatty sort and have met the ‘Berliner Schnauze’ when getting some drugs in the chemist but a lot of the abrupt service has mellowed quite quickly. Went to a bar where it moved quickly from why are you here to have some samples and a chat. I can see it could be draining though - where I live is much chattier. There was a mass lorry splash incident today and everyone dealt with it separately - I did think at home we would all be sharing our outrage!

The schools I do is interesting - had no idea that they do such short days.

OP posts:
ZenNudist · 30/10/2025 22:15

I am currently in Berlin. I went to Potsdam today. Really unimpressedwith Berlin. I have a lovely hotel in a great area of the city. I enjoyed a pre booked tour of the Reichstag..

I'm honestly really unimpressed. It's easy enough to get about but just so blah and unimpressive.

I liked the zoo. But its just a zoo.

Food is so-so.

Shops at Ku'damm very impressive but I'm not arsed. I'd have shopped in Potsdam but kids pissed me off

The DDR museum was rammed.

There's not enough good sights to see together.

Pretty enough around museum island and unter der linden.

Food boring and expensive.

fourhundredandten · 30/10/2025 22:53

Hmmm I confess I gave the DDR museum a miss as I can’t do overly busy which was why I went for the Stasi one instead. Also not been to Ku’damm as am no great shopper. Might do the zoo but - yeah it’s a zoo and have been to some before so haven’t put it up the top of things to do. I have found food cheap and good - eaten an excellent tofu pad Thai today with inventive sides and the street wrap I bought was a vegan delight full of herbs and flavour. Have had some exceptional cocktails and probably more chips than I should but hey ho.

I hope you have another holiday booked @ZenNudist to make up for your disappointment!

OP posts:
Noodledog · 30/10/2025 23:31

@fourhundredandten I thoroughly recommend the Topography of Terror museum. I know it has a weirdly tacky name, but it is actually fascinating and very informative about Berlin in the years between the end of WW1 and end of WW2 and beyond into the Cold War.

If you like Vietnamese food btw, there are a lot of incredible restaurants, I've had my best meals outside Vietnam.

I find the homeless people one of the most disconcerting things- I see people my age on the s-bahn begging for money who have clearly taken far too many drugs over the years, and it is a bit too close to home- a bit more bad luck in my life and I could be them. Berlin in the 90s was a lot of fun, but I'm very glad I made it out in one piece.

I will stop my random brain farts at this point and leave you to enjoy your holiday!

fourhundredandten · 31/10/2025 00:03

Loving the contributions @Noodledog - I am going there tomorrow:) Very much liked the sound of it. I suppose I like the historical so probably that is why I like the old fashioned elements. Probably describes me these days!

it is a funny feeling that other lives sense - Berlin does give a lot of that in different ways

OP posts:
XWKD · 31/10/2025 00:16

I love Berlin. It's a wonderful place. I prefer its haphazard mix of styles to the overt prettiness of many European cities.

CoffeeCantata · 31/10/2025 06:42

Isn’t the graffiti awful? I hate graffiti.