Dd s boyfriend wants a pre nup .

[Velveteenrabbitt]

dd had been with her bf since uni - he has several investments and earns 85 k plus massive bonuses and his earnings will increase. She earns 32k

They are buying a house together and she is investing 30% of deposit , he 70% . Has he has more money.
They told me y day that he wants a pre nup when they get married.
I must admit I was very shocked as I assumed marriage to be a ‘ we situation’ and everything is shared as in the good and the bad - and why would money be the only thing not shared ?

I spoke to him about it as he told me that his mates just dont get it . He says that its because he has seen some married men lose their home And end up in rented if the couple split up and the man ends up worse off mostly, he wants to make sure that If anything happened its not like that .
The mortgage but also it will be not what i assumed in that it will be - joint ownership - but that he gives 70% contributions to deposit and mortgage payments, and she gives 30 % and that will be reflected too .

We are giving dd part of her deposit. The solicitor says that this is classed as a gift and is paid when the mortgage commences.

dd says that initially she was upset and insulted , but now she understands what he means she is ok with it .

I understand that she will need a solicitor for her part of the pre nup.?
I remain anxious about this - it does not feel normal ?

How can i address this with sensitivity with dd without isolating her from us ?

Ive said to him it needs to be fair and in the marriage would be uneasy if dd had to buy cheap clothes for eg and him with more income had much more spending money.. he said that - what people don't see is he does treat her - and he is generous- but again thats in his control .

He comes from quite a deprived background and I think part of this may be anxiety as he has worked very very hard .

I don't want to interfere , dd adult, but also our dd.I am aware we may need to tread carefully here am looking for balanced support and i want to stay measured about this and calm etc.

one of the bigwigs in my dh's office bought his dd a flat outright when she was in her 20s (quite expensive I think as flat was in london)

she got married, then she got divorced. the husband managed to take half the flat, so it was sold and she lost her home that her father had bought her

so, I can see prenups seem to have a place

me and dh both had nothing when we got married so it wasn't relevant. we were very very young. but times have changed I think.

@GreenFrogYellow That is not correct. There’s now a fairly wide understanding in the courts that these document do give a clear steer on what was intended. Therefore such things as ring fencing deposits given by one set of parents is often included. As is considerable wealth of one party and a pre nup goes some way to protecting that. In a longer marriage when dc are involved, it’s less important.

A case recently has changed what money is considered at divorce too. Money and wealth accrued before marriage can now be off the table. Standish v Standish is the case.

It’s not necessarily the most loving thing to do and he’s not accrued great wealth so I’d be looking at him merely protecting his deposit. Whether that’s his share of the property is another matter.

Anyone saying they are not upheld in the UK should do a little Google.

Will prenups stand up in court in the UK? | Westgate Chambers

It's not an overly bad idea as long as they have the correct clauses written into it and any material changes that would affect the terms, ie children, sunset clause etc.

My best friend is currently going through a divorce. He earns a fraction of her wage, has contributed very little to their home or life over the course of their marriage... and yet she has to pay him an absolute fortune in the settlement.

Go for the pre nup.

If it's a happy marriage that lasts forever, it doesn't matter.

After seeing multiple men fleece over women I know including my mum I’ll be protecting my assets too, I’m 35 and bought my house with my 60% deposit, when me and my partner get married I have made sure it’s been protected via solicitors and he won’t be able to get a penny from it should we split. I don’t mind blending our life with future inheritance etc but this money came from my hard working so why should I get ripped off. Luckily my partner agrees but I know some wouldn’t .

To be honest, I see no issue with this. If the roles were reversed, posters would be saying to advise your DD to protect her assets. There is a huge income disparity between them.

Pre-nups are not automatically used in English courts during a divorce.

If a pre-up is drawn up fairly with legal representation on both sides and is a short marriage, the judge might be inclined to use the pre-nup as a plan for the divorce. Still looking at the law and if the settlement is fair.

If it has been a long marriage, children, sickness, lost jobs etc The judge may be less likely to stick with it.

Eitherway your dd needs legal advice and to be honest, seriously thinking about committing herself to someone who sees the financial assets as being his and in need of protection from her.

I think your DD needs to get some good legal advice - having a prenup is fine, especially to protect assets accumulated before the marriage, but there are lots of scenarios to be considered - children (it's women who take the hit career-wise generally, especially if they have several children) what happens if one partner or children become ill and/or disabled and are unable to work?

I think if you're DD is fine with it, you have to be as supportive as you can while encouraging her to get legal advice before signing anything.

Glad me and DH were both totally skint when we got married.
“all my worldly goods I thee endow” Is that not a thing anymore?
If your dd is ok with it then leave her to it. Personally it would upset me but I’m a hopeless romantic dreamer.

I agree with prenuptial tbh. They dictate what people have prior to marriage. My OH and I were together 6 years before we got married. He has massive investments. I was willing to do a prenuptial and actually mentioned it a few times and he was also mentioning it. Cause you can't guarantee anything. We never got around to it but have been together nearly 2 decades now. I don't see them as a bad thing at all. I think people get way too emotional about it. At the end of the day when you are getting married at that point in time you believe you will be together forever and work through anything. However in life the only thing that is constant is change and people do change, relationships change. You can't guarantee it will last. So why should anyone not want to protect their Investments? If it was the other way around I'd be encouraging your daughter to get a prenup. However the prenuptial should only protect prior wealth not what continues to grow after being married.

This is not the case. Judges on the whole do reflect on the parties intentions upon entering the marriage, but once children come along less so.

I can see why he wants to protect his money. In case they split up.

Are they splitting everything proportionately. Ie searches, stamp duty, conveyancing fees, even down to future maintenance or redoing the bathroom.

I think it’s fair enough that if in the future they split acrimoniously the one on the lower wages shouldn’t be financially better off just because the other party earnt substantially more where there are no dependencies. Obviously that changes when children come into play.

they need to be able to talk about it like adults without emotions. It’s just money…it doesn’t mean he’s planning on ending the relationship

Are they planning to have children? If so they need to discuss how your daughter will be compensated and put on an equal footing to deal with loss of earnings pension contributions etc pre and post pregnancy; also build in room for financial adjustment to take account of short term or long term disability and injury resulting from pregnancy and childbirth, pain, incontinence etc resulting from childbirth.

Only fair to do so.

This.

Are they buying in London? Is your DD able to secure her own financial future by investing in a property herself using the gifted deposit?. 60/40 on a rental is not very fair considering the differences in salaries. If he’s come from a poor background and he’s not exactly a millionaire wonder where he’s got a prenup idea from. It just feels all wrong especially with how he is discussing all this with family and friends.

It is very sensible for him to protect his share, and they should own it and pay the mortgage in the same ratio.

They can look at the situation again if they get married, and again when they have children, so that your DD is protected if she is not earning for a period. You see all the posts on here from women with no money because their H sees it all as his because he earns it. So DD needs to be sure that he is sensible, and wont withhold funds when they have DC.

They need to have these talks now, so that DD doesn't walk into a marriage where she ends up with no money.

The law definitely needs to be changed so that people can protect what they have where one party has investments etc and the other one doesn't.

It is not fair that one party could have £100K and the other party nothing, but walk away with half of it if they marry and divorce.

I don’t see what’s so bad about her wearing cheaper clothes than him? Surely it’s not the higher earners responsibility to clothe their partner in expensive stuff.

also most women are not SAHMs until the kids are 18 anymore, those days are long gone.

were you a SAHM OP?

What about if they have children, should one of them wear cheap clothes and have cheap holidays and the other expensive versions of the same?
Or should they both be rich like daddy while mummy walks 10 paces behind them all?

I’m sensing a problem in the future. A man who asks for 40% of the living costs but is only willing to give 30% of the house in the event of a divorce does not have her best interests or even fairness in mind. Especially when she only earns 25% of the house income.

oh how odd.
Yes sounds like he is overcompensating from poor background- carrying that with him.sounds poor in some other qualities if you ask me.

Honestly I would dump him. But then I am not girlfriend.
I think any talk / negotiation re money when marrying at this point in this way is odd.

I can understand to some extent his hesitation in potentially having to ‘lose’ half of everything he’s worked hard for in the event of a divorce, even though personally I do see marriage as a partnership where everything is shared.

A couple of points though

• they’re currently splitting everything 60/40 even though he earns more than double - doesn’t seem fair

• she should get it written into the pre-nup that if she gives up work or goes part time to look after their JOINT children, he must compensate her financially for loss of earnings, pension and damage to career progression.

Everybody going on here about pre-marital assets, seem to have not read the OP. He has no assets, just a higher than average salary.

He needs the OP's daughter to help him purchase a property, both with regards to deposit and mortgage repayment.

New money trying to appropriate old-money 'wealth' protecting tactics to their income have a grave lack of understanding about how money (and therefore marriage law) really work.

A Declaration of Trust is not the same as a prenup, and nor does it consider future earnings ffs.

Is the money in his bank account an asset?

I'm not sure what he is trying to protect here as he has no assets. I'm not sure a pre-nup would help him much but I would advise your daughter to be very cautious about signing anything or marrying a man with this sort of attitude, particularly if she wants to have kids. It does not bode well for a marriage that he's already thinking about this when his main asset is his earning capacity which he will continue to have in the event of divorce. I think it reeks of selfishness and is not the right mindset for marriage.