Page 22 | Don't have kids you can't afford!

user793847984375948 · 2025-10-25T09:57:15+00:00

Hi all, this is meant to be an interesting discussion. I keep seeing people say, “Don’t have kids if you can’t afford them.” But in the UK, if someone works full-time on minimum wage, the state ends up paying thousands for childcare so that parent can work. If that same parent stayed home, they would receive less support overall, yet they would be raising their own child hands-on. A single mum can work part-time and get rent and living costs for kids, around 500 a month in support if she works. Nursery is about 1K a month usually. Then there's the wraparound care before and after school that could also be funded by UC. So why is one scenario seen as responsible and the other as “sponging”? Further, do people who say “don’t have kids you can’t afford” actually think only those earning £60k or more should have children, since that is roughly what it takes to cover childcare or a single income? That eradicates the above two scenarios and it's just those with independent wealth If so, what would that mean for society long-term, both economically and socially? There would be fewer poor people over all and I think this would have an impact on our monetary system and menial jobs getting done. And if you believe that only the wealthy should reproduce, you are effectively asking rich, white, powerful men to police women’s reproduction. That is exactly what is happening in parts of America right now. Genuinely curious how people justify this way of thinking.

Ubertomusic · 25/10/2025 21:22

Neetra30 · 25/10/2025 21:05

Uc is a saftey net not a backup for those who cant even afford their existing kids the basics to have more kids.
Bloody hell

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Yeah, a safety net for employers that don't pay living wages.

HRchatter · 25/10/2025 21:23

Neetra30 · 25/10/2025 21:05

Uc is a saftey net not a backup for those who cant even afford their existing kids the basics to have more kids.
Bloody hell

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No it absolutely isn’t. It’s a subsidy paid by the government to organisations and corporations to bribe them to employ people and ensure that their shareholders aren’t out of pocket and the profits go where they should do, to the millionaires soon to be billionaires.

Neetra30 · 25/10/2025 21:25

YorkshireGoldDrinker · 25/10/2025 18:13

Since women became a good chunk of the working population, that's more money being raised in taxation, therefore more money is passing through more hands, then consumer confidence increases and prices rise. This in turn boosts GDP which then fuels confidence in the economy. Everything is great! Brilliant, even! But is it?

There are now two incomes (assuming both parents work), prices have risen, but that's fine because we now have dual income households, it's all perfectly well affordable. Confidence grows and because of the propensity for governments to borrow, inflation then also takes hold, so prices rise even further, more specifically, your money is no longer worth the value the BoE maintains the illusion of. They print the money, it's also their job to tell you a fiver is still worth a fiver. So then being able to service (let alone pay off) a mortgage on a single income before retirement is now impossible. What you end up with is a smaller house, probably even rented accommodation, a decent but expensive car (often leased) and fewer foreign holidays. Children barely factor in anymore once you add up the cost of the aforementioned. Remember, rampant inflation + taxation eats up dual income in no time.

I've always thought it a bit strange that a woman can work 5 days a week and 2 of those days will be enough to pay for 2 days of childcare (is it? I've heard it costs a fortune in some areas), then that's 3 days where she can't afford childcare. So big daddy government steps in to force more taxation to pay for wraparound care, means tested of course. Can't have people abusing taxpayer money, can we? Government does it all the time, but you're not allowed.

Anyway, my point is women were better off working in hospitals, restaurants and generally any job that doesn't involve a high power career being subservient to a big and powerful, wealthy man (or woman, there are plenty of female bosses out there) who can and most certainly will get rid of you for someone younger, fitter and with more energy and vitality than you. But none of that is affordable now, so women have no choice but to go to work. Unless their husband has a juicy and bullet proof income, they're more or less sentenced to a full time job hoping to be able to retire. Yes, 'sentenced', because after years of getting up at the arsecrack of dawn, barely eating breakfast, getting your kids to school, dealing with the congestion on the roads, and merely surviving, it does really feel like a punishment. It's not meant to be like this, but this is how things are now.

The most heartbreaking aspect of all of this in my humble opinion is abortion. People can't afford to raise children, their contraception fails and a pregnancy occurs. A new life is conceived! Praise God! But that little life is going to be ended before they're born because their parents can't afford to raise them. About a third of Gen Z don't exist because of elective abortion. 1/3 of a generation aborted.

We're killing our own families off before they're born because we can't afford to raise them. We can't go on like this. Oh but yes we can, it's called immigration. Right, so you're admitting population replacement. No, you ignorant racist. We need more people. We can't afford to have babies and don't like our bodies going through hell, so we import people who can.

Sigh. I need to go and have a pick-me-up....

With all due respect people have abortions and "kill" members of their families- as you put it because of all kinds of reasons.
Some can't cope with the ones they have.
Others for health reasons as pregnancy is very taxing on the body, the more you have the worse off your body is. Not everyone has the pelvic floor of steel.
And yes women do have abortions for financial reasons but that's because they dony want to reduce their level of lifestyle and or income. That's all we want dont we? A decent life.
What's the point if having more than 4 or 5 kids means you end up struggling and suffering and dragging members of your family along with it

Ubertomusic · 25/10/2025 21:30

HRchatter · 25/10/2025 21:23

No it absolutely isn’t. It’s a subsidy paid by the government to organisations and corporations to bribe them to employ people and ensure that their shareholders aren’t out of pocket and the profits go where they should do, to the millionaires soon to be billionaires.

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Nailed it! 😁

vivainsomnia · 25/10/2025 21:39

No it absolutely isn’t. It’s a subsidy paid by the government to organisations and corporations to bribe them to employ people and ensure that their shareholders aren’t out of pocket and the profits go where they should do, to the millionaires soon to be billionaires
Sure, let's blame the rich again. It has nothing to do with parents who want to work as few hours as they can whilst still getting a reasonable income.

Before UC, how many worked the magical nu.ber of 16 hours, oh wait, the minimum required to claim tax credits. UC had to bring in rules about increasing hours for kids starting school...because the reality is that our society is full of people who will calculate how little they can work whilst maximising what they can get from the government. It's nothing to do with coorporations but with a growing self-centered and entitled sector of our society who care much more about what they can get from others than what they should earn for themselves.

Theunamedcat · 25/10/2025 21:45

KimberleyClark · 25/10/2025 15:30

Did she ever try combining the pill or coil with condoms? Or did she only ever use one method of contraception?

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Actually dont know I know she was young when she had the first two (11 months apart) the third was a couple of years later and so on its like contraception hates her and the Dr's wouldn't sterilise her because she was too young

Her neighbour has two babies post (her husbands) vasectomy (both definitely his) so maybe its something in the water over there

Theunamedcat · 25/10/2025 21:50

vivainsomnia · 25/10/2025 21:39

No it absolutely isn’t. It’s a subsidy paid by the government to organisations and corporations to bribe them to employ people and ensure that their shareholders aren’t out of pocket and the profits go where they should do, to the millionaires soon to be billionaires
Sure, let's blame the rich again. It has nothing to do with parents who want to work as few hours as they can whilst still getting a reasonable income.

Before UC, how many worked the magical nu.ber of 16 hours, oh wait, the minimum required to claim tax credits. UC had to bring in rules about increasing hours for kids starting school...because the reality is that our society is full of people who will calculate how little they can work whilst maximising what they can get from the government. It's nothing to do with coorporations but with a growing self-centered and entitled sector of our society who care much more about what they can get from others than what they should earn for themselves.

Actually the magic number was 30 hours a week you got more money that way and you could have both parents working 15 hours each to make the number and that meant you didn't need to use childcare (Actually making it cheaper for the tax payers because they didn't need to pay childcare)

There has always been a limit to the time you can spend with your child on benefits it used to be by secondary school they wanted you in work then it was lowered to 7 then they cut it to three

hadenough2025 · 25/10/2025 21:52

MY SITUATION

I have 4 children, I wanted children and unfortunately for me my marriage didn’t work out, I didn’t plan on being a single mother on my own no, I didn’t plan to be on benefits either, I had a full time job, i was with their dad for over 8 years and we got married, he cheated on me 6 months later and then boom had to quit my job with the nhs and go on to benefits because I couldn’t work nights anymore. I don’t have friends or family who can help me out and have done it all on my own, never had any support if honest. I’ve been trying to find a job that’s fits round my children’s schools/nursery. It’s extremely hard, I also have a child who has additional needs, I do get offended when people say they shouldn’t have children if they can’t afford them, or implies that towards single mums who are on their own with the kids on benefits and assume and judge the outcome of why that is so. Life is full of obstacles sometimes it cannot be helped how things turn out. Would I have thought I’d end up on my own with 4 kids? No. Did I think my husband was going to cheat on me 6 months after we got married? No. Hindsight is a wonderful thing and if I had foreseen the future before hand I wouldn’t of had my children with him. Some things cannot be helped 🤷🏼‍♀️

Algen · 25/10/2025 21:55

hadenough2025 · 25/10/2025 21:52

MY SITUATION

I have 4 children, I wanted children and unfortunately for me my marriage didn’t work out, I didn’t plan on being a single mother on my own no, I didn’t plan to be on benefits either, I had a full time job, i was with their dad for over 8 years and we got married, he cheated on me 6 months later and then boom had to quit my job with the nhs and go on to benefits because I couldn’t work nights anymore. I don’t have friends or family who can help me out and have done it all on my own, never had any support if honest. I’ve been trying to find a job that’s fits round my children’s schools/nursery. It’s extremely hard, I also have a child who has additional needs, I do get offended when people say they shouldn’t have children if they can’t afford them, or implies that towards single mums who are on their own with the kids on benefits and assume and judge the outcome of why that is so. Life is full of obstacles sometimes it cannot be helped how things turn out. Would I have thought I’d end up on my own with 4 kids? No. Did I think my husband was going to cheat on me 6 months after we got married? No. Hindsight is a wonderful thing and if I had foreseen the future before hand I wouldn’t of had my children with him. Some things cannot be helped 🤷🏼‍♀️

I don’t judge you at all, but I’m really judging the father of your children. The taxpayer shouldn’t be picking up the slack for parents who bugger off.

Ubertomusic · 25/10/2025 21:58

vivainsomnia · 25/10/2025 21:39

No it absolutely isn’t. It’s a subsidy paid by the government to organisations and corporations to bribe them to employ people and ensure that their shareholders aren’t out of pocket and the profits go where they should do, to the millionaires soon to be billionaires
Sure, let's blame the rich again. It has nothing to do with parents who want to work as few hours as they can whilst still getting a reasonable income.

Before UC, how many worked the magical nu.ber of 16 hours, oh wait, the minimum required to claim tax credits. UC had to bring in rules about increasing hours for kids starting school...because the reality is that our society is full of people who will calculate how little they can work whilst maximising what they can get from the government. It's nothing to do with coorporations but with a growing self-centered and entitled sector of our society who care much more about what they can get from others than what they should earn for themselves.

Sure. When I was eligible for pre-UC income support benefit many moons ago, I was commuting from London to Reading 5 days a week, that's before Elizabeth Line so roughly three hours one way (neither my home nor the office was near any stations) and worked full days so roughly 14 hours per day spent commuting and working.

And before you tell me I should have found another job, that was in 2008 so I was lucky to find that one. The company was doing marketing in IT and paid bare legal minimum, just because they could! Nothing to do with corporations, my ass.

And before you tell me I should have moved to Reading, my child has ASD and changing schools was out of the question.

I didn't claim your bloody pennies either. It's just maddening how self-centric and greedy people are.

BatchCookBabe · 25/10/2025 22:00

@No5ChalksRoad

There are nearly 9 billion (billion with a B) human beings on this earth.

Off topic slightly, but no there aren't. There are just over 8.1 billion. Nowhere near 9 billion, and not likely to be for about a decade or more, as the birth rate is lower than ever, and people are living longer.

Zavettimexico · 25/10/2025 22:33

SlobbinBlob · 25/10/2025 18:03

I’m not making things up, I experienced multiple of these and I know others who have, too. What a nasty response.

I’m amazed at some of the attitude here, because MN is usually a very feminist space until teen pregnancy comes up then it’s a big fuck you to underage girls whose only crime was being pregnant.

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I don’t understand what their problem is. There’s enough threads about people’s 20 year old “children” doing crazy shit and excuses being “they’re young” but apparently a 15 year old girl should know all about how taxes work and if she doesn’t and has a baby she deserves to be terminally hated forever 🤔

It feels like teenagers who assault people/sell drugs/ rob are given more grace than a girl who’s only crime is getting pregnant

LadyGreyjoy · 25/10/2025 22:55

user793847984375948 · 25/10/2025 18:09

So, in the week how much quality time did you have with your children?

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You just seem to be here to be goady. Your posts are all so childish and petulant.

It's clear that you think you should be able to work a part time, minimum wage job and have the as many children as you like while the state pays for them and you and you're looking to shame people who find that problematic.

vivainsomnia · 25/10/2025 22:58

@Ubertomusic, I'm not sure why you quoted me. Sounds like you are the opposite of who I was describing.

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 25/10/2025 23:15

ClarissR · 25/10/2025 12:38

School trips aren’t an essential. Plenty of schools with accept reduced amounts if you can’t afford them, for the educational trips at least.

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What if their Dad earns too much for any funded nursery hours?

Not really my point anyway.

Ubertomusic · 25/10/2025 23:55

vivainsomnia · 25/10/2025 22:58

@Ubertomusic, I'm not sure why you quoted me. Sounds like you are the opposite of who I was describing.

Because you said it has nothing to do with corporations. Well, it absolutely has a lot to do with them, it's been going on for decades as my example shows, and the "working poverty" is now widespread. Why do you think two people with postgraduate degrees in full employment go hungry and never have the heating on? Who are their employers? How is that even possible? And who would want to study and work at all, seeing this happening around them? It's demoralising and depressing.

No5ChalksRoad · 26/10/2025 00:23

hadenough2025 · 25/10/2025 21:52

MY SITUATION

I have 4 children, I wanted children and unfortunately for me my marriage didn’t work out, I didn’t plan on being a single mother on my own no, I didn’t plan to be on benefits either, I had a full time job, i was with their dad for over 8 years and we got married, he cheated on me 6 months later and then boom had to quit my job with the nhs and go on to benefits because I couldn’t work nights anymore. I don’t have friends or family who can help me out and have done it all on my own, never had any support if honest. I’ve been trying to find a job that’s fits round my children’s schools/nursery. It’s extremely hard, I also have a child who has additional needs, I do get offended when people say they shouldn’t have children if they can’t afford them, or implies that towards single mums who are on their own with the kids on benefits and assume and judge the outcome of why that is so. Life is full of obstacles sometimes it cannot be helped how things turn out. Would I have thought I’d end up on my own with 4 kids? No. Did I think my husband was going to cheat on me 6 months after we got married? No. Hindsight is a wonderful thing and if I had foreseen the future before hand I wouldn’t of had my children with him. Some things cannot be helped 🤷🏼‍♀️

So you had four kids out of wedlock with a loser in an uncommitted relationship, without viable job options, and you say it’s somehow unpredictable that it would all go to shit?!?

Why didn’t you marry and establish a career that would support your family, before deciding to produce four human beings for everyone else to support?

please don’t play the victim here. It can “be helped how things turn out. That is exactly the point of this entire thread.

Ubertomusic · 26/10/2025 00:26

No5ChalksRoad · 26/10/2025 00:23

So you had four kids out of wedlock with a loser in an uncommitted relationship, without viable job options, and you say it’s somehow unpredictable that it would all go to shit?!?

Why didn’t you marry and establish a career that would support your family, before deciding to produce four human beings for everyone else to support?

please don’t play the victim here. It can “be helped how things turn out. That is exactly the point of this entire thread.

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🤦‍♀️

Crikeyalmighty · 26/10/2025 00:35

@vivainsomnia - you are correct - I employed someone who calculated constantly that she didn’t want to do more than xyz hours as it made her worse off - this is really relevant fir those who rent particularly - it used to annoy me, so I went onto ‘entitled to’ tonight and worked out if I was on my own and earning xyz for doing 15 hours a week ( I’m 63). I would literally be £221 better off a month for doing 60 hours a month than if I did jack shit and had a private rental - now given that I’m kind of past the point where careers really matter ( as it is we have a business) - if I’m being honest I can see why some people who are on their own and just want ‘a bit of a job’ struggle to feel it’s really worth the effort

Firefly1987 · 26/10/2025 00:46

hadenough2025 · 25/10/2025 21:52

MY SITUATION

I have 4 children, I wanted children and unfortunately for me my marriage didn’t work out, I didn’t plan on being a single mother on my own no, I didn’t plan to be on benefits either, I had a full time job, i was with their dad for over 8 years and we got married, he cheated on me 6 months later and then boom had to quit my job with the nhs and go on to benefits because I couldn’t work nights anymore. I don’t have friends or family who can help me out and have done it all on my own, never had any support if honest. I’ve been trying to find a job that’s fits round my children’s schools/nursery. It’s extremely hard, I also have a child who has additional needs, I do get offended when people say they shouldn’t have children if they can’t afford them, or implies that towards single mums who are on their own with the kids on benefits and assume and judge the outcome of why that is so. Life is full of obstacles sometimes it cannot be helped how things turn out. Would I have thought I’d end up on my own with 4 kids? No. Did I think my husband was going to cheat on me 6 months after we got married? No. Hindsight is a wonderful thing and if I had foreseen the future before hand I wouldn’t of had my children with him. Some things cannot be helped 🤷🏼‍♀️

Yes they can be helped you just went ahead and had a bunch of kids anyway. I can't count the number of posts on here alone of mothers with 4+ kids (always at least one with additional needs) and the bloke has fucked off. It's always the same. I said it earlier but having four kids is a massive risk. Yet it's always "how was I to know if I had 4 kids my husband wouldn't be able to cope and would leave?" errr??? How is this not obvious that it might happen? You didn't even mention if your ex wanted kids, let alone four of them.

And you STILL think you could've had the perfect ending with another bloke? So you've learnt nothing?

NotEnoughKnittingTime · 26/10/2025 00:50

Firefly1987 · 26/10/2025 00:46

Yes they can be helped you just went ahead and had a bunch of kids anyway. I can't count the number of posts on here alone of mothers with 4+ kids (always at least one with additional needs) and the bloke has fucked off. It's always the same. I said it earlier but having four kids is a massive risk. Yet it's always "how was I to know if I had 4 kids my husband wouldn't be able to cope and would leave?" errr??? How is this not obvious that it might happen? You didn't even mention if your ex wanted kids, let alone four of them.

And you STILL think you could've had the perfect ending with another bloke? So you've learnt nothing?

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What is with the comment about additional needs? You think we make that up for shits and giggles?

Firefly1987 · 26/10/2025 00:55

NotEnoughKnittingTime · 26/10/2025 00:50

What is with the comment about additional needs? You think we make that up for shits and giggles?

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How did you get that from my comment? I'm saying having more kids increases the chances of one or more having additional needs (it's always said when someone is considering another child-could you cope if you have another child and they have SEN?) so it's a legitimate thing to think about/plan for. Secondly, it increases the pressure and strain on a relationship.

Ubertomusic · 26/10/2025 00:57

Firefly1987 · 26/10/2025 00:55

How did you get that from my comment? I'm saying having more kids increases the chances of one or more having additional needs (it's always said when someone is considering another child-could you cope if you have another child and they have SEN?) so it's a legitimate thing to think about/plan for. Secondly, it increases the pressure and strain on a relationship.

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What a bizarre statement 🤯

No5ChalksRoad · 26/10/2025 01:15

Firefly1987 · 26/10/2025 00:55

How did you get that from my comment? I'm saying having more kids increases the chances of one or more having additional needs (it's always said when someone is considering another child-could you cope if you have another child and they have SEN?) so it's a legitimate thing to think about/plan for. Secondly, it increases the pressure and strain on a relationship.

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Spot on.

But most people never consider what they will do in that scenario. Just assume the taxpayers will take care of tgem.

Firefly1987 · 26/10/2025 01:18

Ubertomusic · 26/10/2025 00:57

What a bizarre statement 🤯

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Seems like common sense to me. End of the day people are just going to have as many kids as they want even if they looked at all eventualities-they'd just ignore them. They should just stop with the "how was I supposed to know..." I wouldn't even advise a millionaire to have four kids because life is so unpredictable.