Grandparents

[PinkPonyClubb]

Am I being entitled?

One set of grandparents “We’ve raised children don’t expect our help.” Fair enough. We know where we stand.

The other set, prior to birth, wanted to be very hands on.

We now have two children.

”The hands on” grandparents are well, not hands on. Haven’t been since DD1.

We pay for all childcare as we wanted hands on grandparents to enjoy special time with their grandchildren and help when necessary. However, if we ask for help it all seems too much. An example - picking up from after school club once a week. PIL won’t, they don’t like the hassle of picking up but are happy to spend time with DC if hubby drops them off. We don’t get time together as a couple as we can’t always guarantee PIL will have the children. I get envious of friends who PIL will help with childcare so they can go the gym.

I know they are our children, I wouldn’t expect anyone else to have them. I just wish it was made clear that it’s always a no rather than saying they would love to help, make out to family and friends they are helping when they don’t. Am I entitled for feeling envious of others and expecting a little help? I feel the grandparents want childcare on their terms and never want to help? Is the normal? Am I just spoilt?

Perhaps @senua's generation didn't "create" the mental health crisis. Perhaps they were just more resilient?

You're sounding ridiculous.

I don't think it's entitled to want help, and to feel disappointed or hurt if your parents/PIL can't or don't want to. I think what crosses the line into entitled is when those feelings tip over into crossing boundaries, guilt tripping, etc.

I also think sometimes we are so busy with our own lives and families, we can miss signs that DPs/PIL may be slowing down a bit, or not as capable of helping. Having DC later can be a factor too. My grandparents were only early 50s when I was born. My parents were late 50s when we had our first. Many of my friends have had DC later, meaning DGP are well into their late 60s or even early 70s. My DM, now in her 70s, could not manage the level of help she gave us 10-15 years ago if we had wee ones now.

I don’t know, you may be right about age, but my parents and mother in law are in their late 70s and absolutely insist on keeping their childcare days. I have to work quite hard to make it work for us too, but they all have an amazing bond with my kids (who are still small) and you can see it’s exhausting but also keeping them young.

This. It's hard.

Some can still manage it, and want to, especially if they're in good health. DM would probably want to, but would also get exhausted and stressed out, which would then stress us out too!

I enjoy picking my kids up, what an odd thing to not enjoy.

My mother in almost pathologically enjoys doing pick ups. She would fight me for a pick up frankly! She does 1 school and 1 nursery pick up per week on different days. That's her at capacity which is fair enough, she takes them to a class which is great for everyone. Yes they could do after school or a full nursery day instead and they'd get less sweets that way but they all love it.

I think it depends on what was promised.
It would be disappointing to find that GPs had made promises that they didn’t live up to.
I guess in some way that makes me feel grateful - we have no help at all, our DCs don’t even know their GPs, but it was always made clear to us that they wanted no involvement with us or our children. So we never got our hopes up. We are a very close knit, self sufficient family unit.

My MIL is in her 80s, FIL is not longer with us. My mother is a narc nut case and my dad is in Canada. We have no help. And i get very jealous of people with support and help with childcare.

The whole 'it takes a village to raise a child' is not the norm anymore. Families are often spread across the country now too.

I did vote YANBU though as I think it's understandable to feel a bit sad that your in-laws/parents turn out to not be very interested.

In our case, my DM is AMAZING even though we live an hour from her. She lives alone and goes above and beyond for all her GC.

Ive been NC with my dad for over 15 years.

My MIL was interested when they were cute babies but then didn't know how (bother) to maintain a relationship with them as they grew and then fucked off abroad with whatever bloke she's with now.

FIL is micromanaged by Cruella de Ville his wife. He can't give any time to his bio GC because he's only allowed to spend time with her bio GC. I'm not kidding. She is utterly vile and he has no balls.

So yes, we're not all blessed with a full compliment of doting grandparents. Their loss I'd say.

ETA I think remarrying and further children in the grandparents generation often makes for worse relations all round. I.e. the evil stepmother not accepting/interested in her husband's bio GC in our case. Certainly is true across the board within my close and extended family.

You really do need to elaborate on this, but I expect you are not coming back.
I did feel a little sympathetic until this.
For what it is worth, we have been doing childcare for all our grandchildren for many years. Now that they are all at school, it is school pick ups, days if they are unwell and holiday stays. We thoroughly enjoy it and love the relationship we have we our grandchildren. Yes we get tired but so what!

I am the mythical grandparent that does loads of childcare. On average, DGC is with me about 45 hours a week.

Do I love DGC to bits?
Of course.

Is it on my knees level exhausting (I still work a lot of hours)?
Yes it is.

Am I completely taken for granted?
Definitely.

Grandparents are like mums. Always in the wrong however much and whatever we do. No one ever stops to think that by the time we become grandparents we are getting on in age. Childcare is hard at any age. When you're elderly it's ten times more tiring.

If GPs have said they want to be hands on, and are claiming to be so, and are very much not, then YANBU to be a bit pissed off. ‘Hands on’ to me is a regular part of their GCs lives, like a regular pick up, having them after school regularly, frequent babysitting.
My DPs and PILs live 200 and 400 miles away respectively. I would love regular help. I might even be able to work more than freelance if someone could pick DC up from school occasionally. We might get more than one night every three years away together.

I’m NW …..unlike you, I don’t know any ( and I mean any) young family that doesn’t have childcare on tap…..im 60 , and most of my friends around the same age. I’ve been a Granny 10 years….I work partime….I do school run twice a week…..take to swimming every week and the GC ( 3 of them) sleep over most weeks …..sometimes 1 , sometimes all 3 ….I take them away a few times a week ( long weekends)…..and I’m no different to any of my friends….some are far more hands on than me…..it’s a very tight knit family culture where I live

Lost all my sympathy. You need to grow up.

People should manage other people’s expectations better. Neither set sounds “hands on” but at least one side were honest with you

My in-laws are quite supportive. My family are not -my children most of the time can’t identify them in a line up. Its safe to say when my mother starts making requests of care and support, l will be directing her to either paying for it, muddling through it or accepting it’s not going to happen! It’s what l have been doing since l have children! Realistically l work and my children will still be fairly small. Plus l have my own health issues which my family ignore and never acknowledge

I kept my expectations low, and I wasn't disappointed.
We live too far for regular childminding, but even on long holiday visits, dc was tucked up in bed before we left the house. Now he's a teenager, i just get up and go and I just leave him, and them, to it.

DB and SIL live 10mins away and have been dropping their dc off for years. DM does it all, DF not so involved although he loves all DGC dearly.

We have paid for all babysitting and childcare.

I am very glad I managed my expectations. I am a bit disappointed, but hey ho...

As is oft said on this site and never more appropriate now -
‘Are you on glue??’

Whereabouts are you? I don’t know a single family that operate anything like how you describe.

Nearly all families I know are self sufficient and didn’t have children until they were well established in professional careers and could fund childcare themselves.

None have sleepovers or holidays with DGP. Most rely on flexibility at work and decent salaries to make it work.

fair play but I think this is bat-shit mad martyrdom
You are bonkers doing that level of childcare if still working yourself, resulting in exhaustion.

mental

Meh. My experience of GP’s is they can be helpful (usually it’s one GP/set of GP’s). I don’t know anyone who gets proper help from both sets of GPs. We know many friends who had GP help formally withdrawn when a second child came into play. For all the boomer chatter of stiff upper lips and fortitude, it’s obviously too much like hard work.

Thr bar is just low on here, OP. Mumsnet seems to think families shouldn't help each other or etc and that no one should have feelings about it. In reality, most people would be pretty hurt if a healthy retired parent they get along with couldn't babysit for them once in a while. In the same way, I'd expect my parents to feel hurt if I said I didn't want to help with shopping when they're older because I don't owe them anything. In the real world, families provide practical support for each other. The UK has become very individualised and has lost any sense of having a village, when we're actually social animals whose survival relies on support from our communities 🤷

Never had GP childcare. Never had a night away with DH (kids are 10&12). My parents live 8 mins away. Can get emergency school pick up but not regular nor willingly. I needed a cancer scan once and it was made known to me that it had messed up their day. We’ve never been invited to dinner at my mums s as a family so not surprised they don’t want my kids. Last time we had a night out was well before Covid, it was a one off for my birthday. I had to be home by 9pm, food was served late and I texted to explain. Got back at920pm and they were sat with their coats on ready to go. In the dark. Didn’t call me for many weeks after that! And I wasn’t bothered. Sad for the kids. And my marriage. Dh and me go out separately. Meanwhile friends GPs take kids on holidays, have the kids whilst mum and dad have adult nights out or weekends away. You are not alone OP!

Please take off the rose coloured glasses about life in the 80s . My parents had no regular help from their parents in the 1950s and 60s as they didn’t live close enough although my mum started working as soon as children were in school. I had no help in the 1980s for the same reasons but I and my children had loving relationships with grandparents. Now I am near one family and help out but not regular pick ups more holiday care and mini adventures. But realistically if my other children have children I will be too old and not near enough to be able to help. There was no golden age.

Market town in NW England….,I picked up 2 GC today from school…..there were as many GPs picking up as parents …..and it’s always like that…..people tend to have their families on the younger side so first time grannies are mid 40s to mid 50s …..I work with a lot of people from Liverpool and it’s the same with them…..see our GC 4/5 times a week…..i couldn’t imagine it any other way

I was a first time parent at 42 and DH was nearer 50. We are not the oldest parents at school!

I think in my DS’s Reception class there are no parents under 30 and the majority are well into their 40’s with a few dads in their 50’s. When I look back at baby/toddler groups and nursery as well I don’t think I’ve come across a single parent who had a child in their 20’s.

At school pick up time I’d guess maybe 1 in 10 and most are picked up by a GP. That’s not surprising though as many GP will be well into their 70’s or older, or in some cases already deceased.

Another big factor is location. A lot of people have moved for career reasons so don’t live anywhere near GP or extended families now. I think once that happens people wait until they are financially secure before having children as they know they’ll have to be pretty much an independent self sufficient family unit.

It’s a very different lifestyle but you tend to find that other families in a similar situation tend to gravitate together and support each other. Half term next week is full of activities we’re doing together. I can think of only 1 child who has declined and that’s because they’re visiting their GP who is in their 80’s and in palliative care.