Angry at house seller?

[perfectpotato]

Had our offer accepted, in the middle of the legal process and we’ve had got the fixtures and fittings form from the vendors.

They are taking with them all the column radiators (will be replacing with basic ones), all light fixtures - they had these beautiful sconce marble light fixtures that they will be taking and they are have a fixed mirror in the bathroom, has Bluetooth and different lighting and they are taking that too.

My partner doesn’t seem bothered but I’m really upset, Aibu?

Who the hell takes bloody radiators??? Of course they're a fixture

If they take the radiators, technically the house DOES NOT have central heating, so a big reduction in the price would be expected. Cheeky beggars!

But that "advice" is sadly lacking, a fitting is by its nature, fitted - in my trade we call lights exactly that, light fittings.

Similarly the solder and compression joints used on pipes are fittings - in the trades the two terms are somewhat interchangeable.

The legal profession seem to have concocted their own (incorrect) definitions along with daft sayings like if you turned a house upside down and shook it anything that didn't fall out is a fixture, it wouldn't bloody fall out, it would be on the ceiling, how's it getting out.

By the legal boys definition,Your billy bookcase fixed to the wall is a fixture, your lounge mirror over the hearth on two plates is a fixture, your little rack for keys is a fixture, but they are not.

Radiators seems weird but they are not really doing anything wrong as long as they leave you with some. Light fittings I understand, there are a few in my home I would take

Yes, that's what I thought the agreement to be. Stuff that's fixed in place- like radiators- should stay. I was a bit taken aback at all the people saying YABU.

OP said they are planning on replacing the radiators (presumably with cheap ones).

Just checked the law society form TA10, they are fittings, its writ in black and white on the form,

but personally I'd have said fixture for them.

I wonder if they mentioned this at the viewing. If not that's very sly.

This is mad!! Don’t know what’s the matter with some folk. Look back to the original house listing on EA website. Did it highlight the things you have mentioned? Sometimes they say things like period radiators/ subtle lighting/ illuminated bathroom mirror. If yes then they should be left, if no then they probably planned on taking them, however, swapping radiators is simply ridiculous. There will be a lot of holes in the walls for them to fill and make good and could be damaged tiles. Also they will probably be replaced with wider radiators which alters room flexibility. If they are taking the wall lights they will have to replace as they are classed as fixtures and part of property and again holes to fill. Are any areas of wallpaper likely to be damaged? I’d speak to your solicitor and tell them you are wanting to renegotiate the offer and take a good chunk off to get house back up to spec once they have moved out. Also get your solicitor to remind them that if they do remove the wall lights then they will have to replace with suitable alternatives. This is a lot to do at a very busy time so they may well decide it is not worth the faff particularly if you reduce your offer which I would definitely do.

Designer radiators can cost hundreds, if be taking mine and putting in standard ones too!

They are perfectly entitled to take them. As long as they make good with replacements.

Strangest was when my parents moved into their house the vendors took the pond pump with them. They were moving into a flat.They didn’t replace it.

Hopefully you'd point that out at viewings and not wait until just before concluding sale.

I agree it seems unreasonable to take what are actually fixtures and therefore could be deemed integral to the property. What does your solicitor say?
A lesson I learned when we purchased a property was our buying agent was very specific what our offer included - ie the house plus all curtains, carpets and fitted appliances. When owner said the curtains would be extra, they had to back down when our solicitor reminded them what offer they’d agreed to. So the lesson is to be very specific about what you require to be included as part of your offer.

Unless you expressly made your offer “with fixtures and fittings included” then you are being unreasonable. Just ensure there are no holes in the walls when you move in and check the new fittings work. But this is a faff having to go back to the vendor once they have moved on. Have your solicitor send a letter that you are “surprised” they are removing so many F&Fs and you made an offer on the house based on its current condition. Therefor any work done to replace the F&Fs will leave the walls in the original good condition on which your offer was based. This will make the vendors think twice about doing shoddy work and save you a headache when you move in.

It is highly unlikely the first the OP heard of the radiator swop was on the legal papers, and under no circumstances would something like the mirror be staying. When there is something like this at a viewing the agent always lets you know- I've been to 10 viewings in the last few months and several of them had features like this - the agent mentioned it up front.
Column radiators are highly unusual and expensive- it's not surprising they are not included.

Did the Estate Agents docs suggest they were included? If it mentions column radiator for example rather than space for radiator... If so, your price would have reflected this and I would be offering a lower price to incorporate the items they are taking. I would probably do this anyway.

Some Vendors do this in the hope you will then negotiate a price for the items. This used to be common when prices were near a Stamp Duty threshold and pretty much "money under the table". However it is still an upselling con. This happened to my brother and in the end he just refused to buy them items which were magically there when they moved in. They also tried to sell the bedroom furniture and again my brother refused. This was also left behind.

Dishwasher, lampshades etc etc I wouldn’t expect people to leave. Radiators though seems crazy. I would say the price you offered was on the assumption that radiators were included so they’ll need to leave those or reduce the price by the amount it will cost to get the same kind of radiators installed as it was one of the features that attracted you to the house.

Column radiators can be £1000 each and are definitely part of the "look" of the house...ie what makes a period house look attractive.

That’s not nice, I suppose you could offer something for them but that’s what these things are for so that you’re informed what they’re taking and can see what to do about it. I had a (asking price) offer accepted on a bungalow last year. It was on at £525, I asked them to leave bathroom cabinets, boys bedroom furniture, lights and a few other bits. They wrote a list out and how much they wanted for everything, we didn’t want the dishwasher so then they knocked £100 off for that despite originally listing it at £500?? Anyway I’d started having second thoughts about the bungalow and pulled out in the end, the fact that they were being so grabby made that decision a lot easier and they ended up selling for £30,000 less.

Please let us know how you get on OP !

It should have been made clear from early on (viewing, agent’s info) what was and wasn’t included- that’s what would have annoyed me.

Yes. At a very minimum I would not exchange contracts until radiator work had been completed and I had a chance to inspect with a gas engineer, paid for by them. Apart from anything else I think after exchange you can be held liable for insurance etc if stuff happens to the house…so really they should not be doing plumbing works after exchange - certainly not cosmetic stuff.

I’ve recently had one of my bathrooms refitted including a new radiator that is a completely different size and type to the original. The wall behind it took a fair bit of work to repair where the old pipes and fittings were. I’d hate that to be required for every radiator in every room.

I can’t believe people have voted for you as being unreasonable! Taking light fittings, yes someone people do that but they do have to put a basic rose ceiling flex light up.

however taking radiators??!!! I have never heard of that before, what an actual cheek. I’d be angry indeed. How are they going to make good on wall markings, patchy walls? Are they going has a professional do it, you could be left with low pressure or airlocks!!

Yes, when vendors remove light fittings, they must replace them with a standard, safe fitting such as a ceiling rose, flex, and bulb holder. It is illegal to leave exposed wires and is a standard requirement in contracts to ensure the property is left in a safe and usable condition.

This from google ai. There is more. Strange about the radiators though. You could square that with a professional heating engineer. I think they would have to make good the wall and shut off the water to do it, which might make things difficult for you when you move in.