Angry at house seller?

[perfectpotato]

Had our offer accepted, in the middle of the legal process and we’ve had got the fixtures and fittings form from the vendors.

They are taking with them all the column radiators (will be replacing with basic ones), all light fixtures - they had these beautiful sconce marble light fixtures that they will be taking and they are have a fixed mirror in the bathroom, has Bluetooth and different lighting and they are taking that too.

My partner doesn’t seem bothered but I’m really upset, Aibu?

A friend bought a house with a beautiful garden - a key selling point of the property - the seller decided to dig up and take most of the plants .. very weird behaviour! The radiators going with them is also weird behaviour...

This thread has just prompted me to get up and look at my radiators. I don't have central heating with a boiler, but stand-alone plug in electric radiators of some fancy design that are programmable. My seller could easily have just unplugged them and taken them out - of course they didn't because they were normal sensible people, but it would have been perfectly possible and I might not even have noticed for quite a while that they were gone!

Some things such as fitted kitchens are obviously included, but others such as appliances and light fittings are not and do need to be listed in the official paperwork before exchange if the buyer wants them. But I agree that it's irritating, they can make a big difference to the look of a property and be expensive to replace.
Personally I'd expect fitted mirrors to be left, but we had a buyer who took fixed bathroom mirrors, fitted bathroom towel rails (not radiators) and toilet roll holders.

Taking garden plants is actually not allowed as they are normally included in the sale contract unless the buyer was advised before exchange that this would happen. Plants in containers can be taken though.

It used to be common to take carpets because they weren’t fitted. Until the 70s/80s carpets were basically big rugs and there’d be a foot or so of bare floorboards (which is why, in older houses, if you take the carpets up you may find the floor has a painted border).

This thread is a good reminder that the house selling and buying process in the UK needs to be reformed. So many ways it could be improved to stop misunderstandings, gazumping and the kind of fuckwittery that generally abounds.

If I'd made an offer based on the house in that condition, I'd be reducing it by the amount to get it to the standard it was when I made my offer. I'd never expect they'd leave mirrors but who the hell takes the radiators? That is absolutely ridiculous.

Imo these things may have recently been added to the persons’ selling of the house to make it look nicer??

Yes, they may well have added the items to make the house more saleable or at a higher price. But it's more saleable and/or at the higher price purely and simply BECAUSE those items are there, once they are gone then the higher price is no longer justified.

When you sell a property you have to list everything that is staying or you are taking with you. It is part and parcel of the Conveyancing Contract. If the seller takes things that are stated on the form to be left behind then they are in breach of the contract and you can take action. Before Exchange you can negotiate all the items that COULD be removed: kitchen appliances, light fittings etc.

You will have made an offer on the usual understanding that fixtures and fittings will be left with the house. You are fully justified in reducing your offer in proportion.

The seller here included in that form that they're taking the current radiators.

Yes! Cheeky !
You are buying their house not their house and contents
If you like their fixtures and fittings so much make a note and buy them yourself for the house

lol when my ex and I bought in 2017 the guy took everything, even the toilet seats 🤣

I too would pull out of the sale unless offered a reduction reflecting the loss of value and the inconvenience of making good the alterations. I know some buyers like to redecorate to their own tastes. Your vendors evidently do, and to be charitable may assume you will be of a similar mind. For my part, if a house looks good enough to move straight into, that's what I want to do, and dicking around with the fixtures throws that out of the window.
Actually, unless I was very keen on a particular house that it would be hard to substitute for another in the right area, I would probably walk regardless. I would expect that sort of thing to be made crystal clear before I made an offer. I don't give a shit about fancy radiators, but that would make me feel they wouldn't hesitate to try and con me in another department.

Why were you thinking they would leave them?
It's obvious you were told at the viewing they would be swopping out the radiators- under those circumstances how could it be reasonable for you to expect them to be left? A mirror would never be left unless it was built in- so that is not reasonable either.

A mirror would never be left unless it was built in- so that is not reasonable either.

A light up wired in bathroom mirror is different from a regular mirror and should not be treated as the same thing. And as a PP said, using the bathroom before another mirror is installed is potentially a safety issue.

Why is that obvious? I can't see that from OP's posts.

Slightly suprised at the radiators but we have the column ones and they are really expensive so probably cheaper for them to pay a plumber to put standard ones in and take the others with them but I can’t believe you thought they’d leave everything else which sounds quite high end . That’s what the fixtures n fittings list is for or ask when you view

Re the radiators I would insist that they are replaced prior to exchange and that you be given the opportunity to see the new ones in situ because otherwise I’d say the chances of you arriving to a pile of uninstalled radiators and “oh sorry they don’t quite fit but you can get the parts really easily” are v high.

Surely you asked if particularly nice things would be left? But I agree I would have assumed a fixed bathroom mirror would be left... but if it's a really nice place is it worth giving it up because your upset at the moment??

If they’ve bought special radiators and want to take them with them, as long as it’s specified on the forms then it’s fine. Anything that can be removed and changed isn’t a permanent fixture.

How much under the asking price was your offer? And have you also subsequently lowered your offer (for example
following a survey?) It sounds like they are annoyed about the offer they’ve accepted!

I once bought a house and lowered my offer following a survey that raised a few issues (less than the cost of fixing it though…) The sellers had bought the house and refurbed it pretty cheaply purely to sell on at a profit via an offshore entity (and they were still making a substantial profit so please don’t feel sorry for them!)

On completion, they’d taken a few things that they said would remain in the fixtures and fittings list (some white goods, light fittings, they even scraped up the stone chippings from the front garden!)

I didn’t make a fuss over what was probably a few hundred pounds worth of items. However, when they later contacted me asking about some urgent post that had come to the property as they had forgot to change the address, I said it hadn’t turned up and threw it in the bin. Yes, it was petty but what goes around comes around!

Were that out as a selling point when viewing? light fittings and mirror is annoying but I could deal- radiators absolutely no I would have to protest about that

That’s not correct. The fixtures and fittings form comes after the offer has been made and accepted. Unless OP specifically agreed the price conditionally on leaving these things intact, she’s got no case. All she can do is make sure that suitable replacements are properly installed and any damage made good. I think the item that really needs examination is the bathroom mirror. If it’s powered then it needs to be made safe so that the bathroom is usable.

You have grounds for a dispute if the original column radiators were considered permanent fixtures and not explicitly excluded in your contract or on the TA10 form
. You should first check your contract and the TA10 form to see what was agreed upon, then contact your solicitor to ensure the agreement about repairs from the removal is followed, and that you're getting what you paid for.
Before you act

• Review your contract: Check the "fixtures and fittings" section of your contract. These are items that are typically considered part of the property and should remain unless explicitly stated otherwise.
• Check the TA10 form: The TA10 form is a legally binding document detailing what items the seller is taking with them. Ensure the radiators are either listed as being taken, or that the document correctly states they are staying.
• Examine the offer: If you have already made an offer, your solicitor should have clarified the status of the radiators in the sales contract. If there is no mention, it's best to get this clarified now.
• Confirm damage repair: The vendor is responsible for repairing any damage caused by removing the radiators. Get this documented and checked before you complete the sale.