My GP has told me that 80% of their appointments don't need a GP appointment.

[Hiptothisjive]

So I get that there are always people that need reassurance but this number shocked me. Basically a lot of people are visiting their GP for reasons they don't need to and taking up a lot of GP time.

It's great some of the prescriptions that can be given via a pharmacy now, but surely there needs to be a re-addressing of when to visit a doctor?

YABU - to expect people to know better than go to their GP when they don't need to
YANBU - people should go to the doctor whenever they want to no matter what the issue

Totally agree. Time management and organisational skills are few and far between.

I suppose it depends on what defines need. I live in a country where a GP is a reassuring presence for minor ailments, if I had tonsillitis I would see an ENT etc which I can do in any polyclinic in most malls. I have looked at my last 3 GP visits, cuticle infection in finger got Flucloxacillin oral and Bactoban cream, referral and bloods for cosmetic surgery (not covered by insurance cost £50) and Sciatica, had MRI and painkillers, referred to neurologist for surgery opinion. None of those things would have happened in the UK. If I was dying, I wouldnt have to wait for a GP appointment and they wouldnt think it was their job anyway. I have lost a couple of family members to the GP issue, both from ovarian cancer, only diagnosed at stage 4 after literally years of begging to see a GP and the rare times they did, being fobbed off. I have a parent here with me at the moment who came because of a chronic UTI which the GP said you will have to live with. So no. I dont feel sorry for GPs and despise the whole dont bother the doctor brigade. In other countries you send your child to medical school if they aren't clever enough to be an engineer. You lot treat them like gods and they aren't even very good at what they do, on the occasions they do.

My DH was diagnosed over the phone with gastritis by the GP. He ended up in hospital in a very serious condition with pneumonia, pleurisy and empyema. He needed i/v antibiotics and had a chest drain and narrowly avoided surgery for removal of infected material from the chest cavity around the lungs. He's been left with internal scar tissue that still causes pain and discomfort a year later. He should have been seen by the GP but they are still doing more phone appointments than face to face. I don't believe that 80% of appointments are unnecessary.

So true.

The last time I went to see the GP was a severe ear infection. I went through triage and it was decreed that I had to attend for a face to face for an ear examination. All good and sensible so far.

But, at the consultation, the GP couldn't find an otoscope. She checked all the drawers/cupboards in the consulting room, but nothing. Then she disappeared, presumably checking the other empty consulting rooms, and re-appeared maybe 20 minutes later proudly presenting it saying "finally found one". Then she started looking through the drawers and cupboards again, this time looking for a plastic hygiene cover for it, and then disappeared again for another 10-15 minutes, but came back crest fallen as she couldn't find one!

All she could do was suggest I phone for another appointment in a couple of days' time as she said she'd asked for some to be ordered which would take a couple of days.

Complete waste of half an hour of her and my time!

If they can't get such simple basics right, there's no hope for them.

Econsult isnt a thing here. Id actually say telephone isn't a thing; to make an appointment you have to be at the surgery in person at 8.30. God knows how anyone who isnt mobile or has caring responsibilities or a job ever manages.

Exactly. I've often thought that the few occasions we've needed any kind of medical attention whilst on holiday abroad, their system of clinics etc has been far more useful/superior to the UK's outdated GP system. In literally every instance, we've been in and out of the clinic pretty quickly, had wounds dressed, blood tests, once an x-ray, and walked away with the prescribed drugs, all quickly and stress free, no referrals, no having to return the following week for something simple like a blood test, etc. We're really behind the curve in the UK with having GPs as gatekeepers, even more so now that most GP surgeries don't actually do much anymore, i.e. ours doesn't even do blood tests in house, don't do innoculations, don't do minor injuries, etc - they're basically just desk jockeys doing admin.

No but everyone I know who goes constantly has health anxiety or sees it as a ‘day out’.

I know a few people for whom their health has become their hobby, they go online and convince themselves they have ASD/ADHD/fibronyalgia/ME/CPTSD, and then sort of ‘live’ in their condition talking about it endlessly and joining support groups. When the diagnosis doesn’t happen they pursue another, or if it does, they pursue another anyway. It’s like they can’t cope if they don’t have a series of appointments to attend and somebody they feel is heavily invested in looking after them and exploring their mental state.

Without GP's as gatekeepers there would be thousands of people who DON'T need to see consultants clogging the hospital waiting lists.

That's true.
It's a bit 50/50 as to which would work best.

Health anxiety also needs treatment, a GP should be the one to assess need for that.

So why does it work for other aspects, such as opticians and dentists? People can make their own arrangements for such things and such places aren't inundated - they manage their new patients, either provide NHS services or not, or refer to specialists/other services as needed.

My OH has been told by his oncologist that he needs physiotherapy for a prolonged leg pain. To get that, he has to go through his GP. Just why? Why can't he self refer direct to physiotherapy? Or why can't the oncology refer him directly. That's just one instance of a complete waste of a GP appointment. DH has literally dozens of other instances where one GP specialist/consultant has referred him back to the GP for onward referral to other NHS departments. It's all insane.

When my son had a severely infected toe nail, he was in and out of the GP's for several months before they finally referred him to child podiatry, who sorted him out within 3 weeks (toe nail removal) after several months of pain with the GP surgery farting around with creams and salt baths that did nothing and resulting infections. He then had an "open" file with child podiatry and they told us we could go back at any time in the future if he had any more problems with his feet, no need for GP referral. Why can't other departments do the same?

DH once used 4 different GP appointments over almost a year just to get a referral for a NHS hearing aid. At first appointment, the GP found an ear infection so that had to be cleared before a referral to audiology. A few weeks later, another appointment to check it was healed, which it was. Then told to wait a few months for an audiology appointment. After six months, he chased audiology to ask where he was in the queue and they said they had no record of the referral. So he phoned GP surgery who admitted they'd forgotten to send the referral but couldn't do it as he needed an ear inspection again as it was several months since the last one. Of course, the other ear had a minor infection, so antibiotics again, and finally another GP appointment a few weeks later, found to be clear, so the GP actually sent the referral and he was seen by audiology within a few weeks. Now, a few years later, he can go straight to audiology for reviews/new hearing aids every few years, no need for the GP to check ears are clear, at the inspection, if there's any wax, they just clear it there and then, if any infection, they issue antibiotics, but most times, they just do the inspection and hearing test. So no need for GP once you're in the system, but nonsensically, a need for GP inspection before you get referred. Make it make sense!

So why does it work for other aspects, such as opticians and dentists? People can make their own arrangements for such things and such places aren't inundated - they manage their new patients, either provide NHS services or not, or refer to specialists/other services as needed.

I think NHS dentists are inundated, but I always think that the system for eyes works pretty well and could be replicated.

I think pharmacists should be trusted to provide more medication over the counter. And for people to be trusted more as well. As an example why on earth does a woman over 60 need to see a GP for thrush? Do they really think that a woman who's suffered from recurrent thrush all her life (or has had a recent course of antibiotics) doesn't know what she needs? For goodness sake give her Canesten. If it doesn't work she'll be back. But it probably will work and she won't be.

Literally the same thing happened to me, too. Two weeks in hospital, almost died, and still don't feel totally back to normal several years later! I hope your husband is doing okay now.

Why not? I always saw the GP for my annual review until 6 or 7 years ago

I don't have toothache but I still go to the dentist every 6 months. I still go to have my eyes checked regularly.

What's so fucking special and precious about GPs that they can't stand seeing their own patients for a regular check up?

I think the one issue per consult leads to repeat visits and leads to some health issues needing more interventions further down the line. There is a lack of looking at a patient holistically.

Patients with more complex needs are increasing and there is a lack of looking at a patient holistically - this is further exacerbated in recent years as millions of people now have long covid, with more obviously falling into that bracket every covid wave. Some viruses make you more prone to other ones, as well as increasing likelihood of secondary infections that will need antibiotics. With things like whooping cough, meds should be given quickly, yet even if someone visited doctor, how likely is it that they would be tested?

If a choice is made as a society that presenteeism matters more than health and lower productivity, or that infection control even in places like GP surgeries and hospitals is too costly/inconvenient, or that there is a high threshold to access healthcare if it’s not an emergency, a high threshold to access treatment upon diagnosis, a reluctance to learn about (or in some cases even believe) complex conditions etc…we can’t also stamp our feet or act surprised when overall health of a population deteriorates.

Opticians sell you glasses. They are not health professionals.

I'm so sorry that happened to you too! It's terrifying isn't it! He is doing better but it's been a long old road to recovery 🫤 hope you're doing ok too 💐

Have you noticed that you have to pay your dentist and your optician for their services, whereas your GP is free at the point of service? If you would like to organise a private GP, they'll see you as often as you like.

Having lived abroad in a country where you call a GP in the morning to get a choice of appointments that day I am horrified by the uk system as are my GPs there. They would not believe me that GP receptionists triage when they are not even medically trained.
Similarly they would say we would rather 1000 people went to a&e who didn’t need to than we missed one person who needed help and didn’t get it.
I find the way that the people in the UK defend the terrible system and blame the patients rather than the crappy bureaucracy that needs to be fixed amazing. I can only think these people have never lived abroad and believe everything they’ve been told about how amazing the NHS is. Yes it’s better than the US system if you are not wealthy but that is an extreme. There are many many countries with better systems - the two options are not the US style or the UK.

Never paid an optician - their salary comes out of the profit on the products they sell, same as any other salesperson,

Free at the point of service but definitely not free. We still pay albeit not on the day.

Our new online triage form is brilliant had a phone call with appointment 10 minutes after I submitted it.

That's right. What products does your GP sell?

Posts like this don't help people who have had a mental health crisis and then passed around departments who don't want to know and they get misdiagnosed along the way and just generally don't get any help and support because they haven't ticked all the right boxes. It is a fight for people in this situation to get any kind of support that they legitimately need.

The lack of services means that those who really need help are tarred with the bullshit 'timewaster' brush. Honestly, I find it bizarre that anyone would 'fake it' given just how difficult it is to get any kind of support for these conditions even with a diagnosis and a long, credible medical history.

It's paid for by taxes- we don't pay more or less dependent on how often we go. GPs don't get paid more or less dependent on how many patients they see.

It's also massively underfunded. There's only so many 10 minute appointments that can be fitted into one day and GPs do have to do other things in between appointments.