To think friendship groups kinda suck, you can never have say 8 or more people that equally like each other

[Lipglosser]

There's always groups within groups and duos and trios and then they all switch around with various allengences and alliances
And various mini fall outs

There's always at least a couple of people at that dont like each other, there's snidy comments, talking about others in the group when they are not there, one upmanship, competition even when we'll hidden you can see it

There is usually a queen bee/leader
A couple of main bootlickers to the main leader, a,psmknow as the leaders bitches
The odd one that doesn't really seem to wanna be there
A couple that are a bit lonely and are willing to do anything just so they have some friends
Even if these friends are shitty

Whoever wrote motherland fot it so spot on

Far far prefer one to one's or small groups say 4

Large groups There's so much falseness

Hmmm I can recognise some of what you saw but definitely not all of it no queen bee, suck up or bitching etc.

Yes to some are closer then others and this sometimes changes but that's normal as well depending on share experiences, stage of life etc.

As kids yeah I agree, it’s tricky. By adulthood most people have learned to rub along together, even if they’re not ‘best friends’ within a group.

I agree in a group there’s often some people who are closer to each other than others and that can change over time. I don’t see that as a problem and I don’t agree with any of the other stuff about queen B and falling out etc.

I have a larger friendship group who I do really enjoy spending time with but I feel that conversations are always quite snatched and its hard to be in-depth. You either end of having to "present" your conversation to the whole group (which feels a bit like public speaking to me) or you are able to grab short bursts of conversations with group members when you're all together and its hard to get into a deep discussion about much. When we're together as a big group it always feels more like a party or a big jovial celebration (which is lovely) but its a bit surface-level - we will end up doing some big game or something like playing poker, which I love, but its more activity based rather than conversation based. I
like the smaller one to one chats I have with individuals in the group, hence I'm going on holiday with just two of the members later this week. Others in the group do similar things, and its fine. We're all adults.

A friend is part of a “gang” of 8 and husbands. I know all of the members. She often shares with me the group dynamics, falling out etc. no thanks

I'm lucky enough to have 3 large friendship groups one of which has been in existence for nearly 40 years and another for about 25, the last one is more recent because we only met 16 years ago.

Of course within those there are people who aren't that keen on other members, there are subgroups and spinoff groups and individuals/families who are particularly close to each other. That's normal. In 2 groups there are people I really don't like and would never spend one on one time with but I'm polite and inclusive for the sake of the group. They probably feel the same way about me.

Groups like that are dynamic, we develop and change together. People within them grow apart or grow closer over time . The person I was closest to 25 years ago is no longer as close to me but I have developed tighter relationships with other people. Sometime a group fractures temporarily or in one sad instance, permanently. That's normal.

In any group, whether it's 2 people or 20 there will be occasional disagreements or rows or misunderstanding. That's inevitable but for better and for worse we have become communities with history and that's valuable.

if what you want in a friendship is complete equality and reciprocity and eternal harmony you are probably better off restricting your circle to just a few people. But even within smaller units dynamics and feelings will change over time and you run the risk of becoming isolated.

Yes I agree with the majority of these comments, esp in the fact when the group are all together, the talk tends to be more surface level, also you notice that when talking in a group some people will be listened to more, some will even be spoken over more, some will get alot of eye contact, and even on group chats there will be some that everyone fawns over and If they say something there will be loads of replies, or reactons and others make comments its tumbleweed
It's so obvious
I just don't get why people want to spend time with others that they don't like or don't like them just to be part of the group

Recently was invited to join a group of school mum friends in renting a cottage, and having a few nights away, what's been suggested, is a cottage in the middle if nowhere, doing a food shop and booze shop, and taking a load of books

Fucking hell, sounds dreadful, I can picture it now, too many people stopping off on the way to tescos or somewhere, people having to compromise on what food to buy, then even people getting the hump that others having done as much as in the cooking and cleaning,there will be some that want to stay up really late chatting, and maybe disturb others, and as for paying to sit around reading in company, sounds totally shit, waste of time and waste of money
A thousand other things I'd rather do

Of course ive said no to this,
There's people in that group that actively dislike each other
And will make digs at each other and even though its not directed at me, makes me really uncomfortable.
I suspect I might well be a
Adhd, or slightly on the spectrum, and people being authentic and real is a must need for me

Lol at this shit still happening in care homes tho!

I have several friend groups of more than 8 and there's no queen bee whatsoever, just normal people, sometimes we do stuff all together, sometimes in smaller groups, sometimes just one to one.

I'm absolutely NOT suggesting this applies in your case, clarrylove, but I do wonder if people sometimes think 'Our group isn't bitchy - we're all great friends', when in fact, if they look back there might have been those who've left in the past because they didn't feel the love. It might be great for most members, or a core group, but sometimes people on the margins can feel ignored or that they don't fit in and just quietly leave.

Not my experience either.

The whole idea of friendship "groups" seems to be a new thing for me. It was always just "friends" when I was growing up. You had some that knew each other, some that didn't, some that often did things together, or occasionally, or whatever, but it never seemed to be as defined into actual groups as it is these days, especially at school. I know children/teens who talk about deciding whether someone will or won't be part of their group, or if they leave their group and find a new group, like it's a permanent and fixed thing for that period of time, and you have to belong or not to a certain group. Wasn't like that at school - obviously groups of friends etc, but nothing as defined as it seems to be now, and certainly not for adults.

Now it seems to be more about people who like to organise or host things the most being more likely to be the ones that are in the middle, as they are doing the work. But other people just see something they might like to go to or do, and ask people they know who might be interested. Sometimes I'm included, sometimes not, depends who it is and who's organising and what it is, whether I've run into them lately, whatever. Other times I might suggest a coffee or something to someone who's around in the day. Or completely different meet-ups with others. I don't think I could say who is in a friendship 'group', as it's all different people depending on circumstances.

yes when people are thrown together for reasons that might not be completely their choice - a social group made up of people from the same hobby or whatever, then there are often dynamics of people liking some or not better than others, others who have to be included whether you find them annoying or not, some who are good at organising and being lively and fun, even if you don't actually like them, etc . But that's not quite the same.

Oh it does. :) Some rivalry about sitting next to the lady with a title & George who preferred Marjorie, apparently, it must be her ‘brain’ as this lady more attractive. As a visitor lovely they were still full of life.

This is so true, it’s what puts me off joining a tennis group. I’ve seen them openly shout & quietly bitch at weaker members.

Also you’re spot on re: hobby groups like choirs IME. One woman was incredibly magnetic & attractive & blind eyes all round when she, fairly routinely, broke rules. Another less popular but kind woman - lesser rule breaks - & they had a sub meeting about whether to possibly suggest she wasn’t a good fit & should leave.

It’s definitely a thing! Hierarchies again.

The very slightly bullied woman in my choir mentioned to me that another woman always picked on her. I hadn’t particularly registered it until then but once she pointed it out - wow! The little snide put-downs, always with a smile, the undermining disguised as concern, the never failing to point out her little mistakes to the group etc. it was very subtle and tbh, I think the mean woman herself would probably have been surprised if a video had been played back to her - it was a cumulative thing.

It’s rather depressing!

Yes, true. Another thread perhaps but what can you do to avoid being the one singled out (?) Or your child. There must be a way to avoid.

Totally disagree.

Why does everyone in the group have to like each other equally?

Some MN posters’ views on friendships are really weird.

I guess if we knew the answer to that, there’d be no more bullying! How great that would be.

i think, in the case of the choir, the mean lady is very image and status-oriented and in any group, I can imagine she would want to be identified with the:in-crowd, the cool girls etc. Some people still have a high-school mentality. I think (although I think there’s no difference in competence between her and the woman she picks on) it’s somehow important to her to feel superior and to distance herself from the this person.

I’ve observed them and I really do think it’s just that - she has to feel she’s one of the top-dogs.

I don't think I've ever been in a group of about this size. I either have individual friends or I belong to really big "interest" groups of say 20-40 people, where there is no expectation that you will be equally close to everybody or even that you'll get on with everybody. I can certainly imagine the dynamics of a group of 8 could be tricky or unequal.

@Lipglosser

YANBU. I hate big friendship groups. Have been part of one a few times, and they always end up toxic and fractured, with people being pushed out/ghosted/blocked on WhatsApp groups etc.

Even my own DC were part of big friendship groups, they had maybe 10 or 11 friends each, (and around 4 or 5 mutual friends,) for about 6-7 years, I'm not kidding... loads! They regularly went out with them, between 8 and 12 at a time, and it was like a big hippy commune, all pals, all socialising together, and going on day trips and holidays etc.

Then for several different reasons, over a year or so, the friendships soured, cliques formed, and the big group was fractured, and the hate and vitriol between them all was savage. (It was around 10 female, and 5 or 6 male...) They now both have around 4 or 5 friends each. (Several mutual friends too.)

I think having friends is pretty overrated to be honest. I have found most to be toxic, clingy, bitchy, users, flirty around my DH (and my married brother,) fickle, flaky, intense, and just generally shite. Sometimes not straight away, but eventually. Usually within 3 to 8 months. Hence, I have only one close friend now, who I have known 40 years.

There are a few people in my village who I class as friendly acquaintances, who I chat to once or twice a week on the driveway, or over the front garden hedges, and will help in an emergency, and have a drink with at the pub once or twice a month, but most people, I have found turn out (eventually) to be not very good friends for various reasons that I have mentioned. And lots of big friendship groups end up with a bitch, a gobshite, and a bully, and the quieter, more placid people get pushed out/talked over/ignored.

You will get people saying that it NEVER happens to them though. 😆

Because they and their friends are 'better than that' and aren't 12! 😂

You have nailed it there! Couldn't agree with you more

Are you still at school?

Are you? Because that's sort of level of depth I would expect someone still at school to have

I’m in a friendship group of around 10. All known each other 30 years. Within that there is smaller duos/ trios that see each other more often due to shared hobbies/ interests. I never hear anyone talk badly about someone else. There’s never been a falling out. There is no queen bee.

Think you and your friends need to grow up a bit.

I am a one to one friendship person.

*I like to think of my friendship groups as a Ven diagram- core of 2 very close friends but we all have different wider circles which overlap.

@Manyplanetsfromthesun That’s my experience too, a handful of very close friends and then wider circles. For example, I regularly meet up with a group of friends whom I met years ago through DD’s school. I’m close to a couple of them and we keep in touch outside of the wider group. The others I’m friendly with and we’re always glad to see each other, but we wouldn’t text or meet up separately from the group. I know it’s the same for the others, different ppl are closer friends.