The autumn budget should cut benefits before increasing tax

[Leett]

There is talk of Labour breaking their election pledge and increasing income tax by 2p. I doubt they'd do that because voters will revolt. However they need to do something with the state pension due to increase by 4.7% next year.
I really hope they cut benefits / pensions before the deciding to increase taxes.

This is a proposal by the resolution foundation:

"In a report that will be closely scrutinised in the Treasury, it said an additional £6bn a year could be raised through a policy to cut employee national insurance by 2p, with a corresponding increase for all income tax bands.

This is because income tax applies to a wider group of taxpayers than employee national insurance – including pensioners, landlords and self-employed people."

It actually seems quite sensible and will mean the overall level of tax paid by most employees unchanged but I'll leave you to carry on as you are.

@IKnowAristotle I think that's a good idea casually

actually

Amazon pay huge amount of operational taxes in the UK (NI etc) due to their operating set up here. You’re talking about corporation tax. They’re not incorporated here so they can’t be made to pay corporation tax here.

Yup and that's on them for working minimum wage jobs. If they want to make ends meet either get a better job or work more hours

🙄

Young people have options that pensioners don't. Young people can work more, get better jobs, emigrate, they can do something to improve their circumstances. Pensioners can't do any of that. And outside of Mumsnet, where everyone over 60 lives in a five bed "just outside london." With a platinum plated private pension from their job in the city, where their biggest worry is Waiteose running out of "that naice brie", there are millions of pensioners who can't afford to turn the heating on.

What do you expect those people to do?

This country is fucked. Too much money has been borrowed/wasted and the tax revenue isn't enough to repay the debt and fund services. If the UK were a private business, the Government's own rules would force it to declare bankruptcy and be shut down. That's how bad things are. Go into any supermarket in the UK and you will see empty shelves, my local ones regularly run out of bread and milk.

We are truly fucked as a country. Squabbling about taking money from pensioners and looking for somebody to blame is irrelevant. There is no money.

Child benefit is basically means tested. I know that technically it doesn’t count as a “means tested benefit” but with how it’s paid back over a certain threshold, it essentially is.
Which I think is correct btw.

I think the government are very good at distracting people about where all our taxes are actually going I think benefits are a drop in the ocean. But keep the general public arguing over benefits.

Yes, agreed - as a teacher, when there were strikes over pay, there were lots of graphs circulating, showing how our pay had been eroded in real terms since the early 2010s - I am sure lots of other jobs are the same or in an even worse situation. We are lucky to be getting 4% this year but that doesn't really compensate for years when we've had below inflation pay rises and pay freezes.

Increasing taxes obviously also erodes any pay rise people might get.

I do think everything should be shared evenly across society - I wouldn't want to cut support for the poorest, but realistically there are a lot of well off pensioners who don't really need the triple lock in order to survive.

I have to say the pensioners I know seem pretty comfortable, whilst the people I know who are finding things very tight/difficult tend to be working age with young children who need childcare.

But then we'd have very unwell people needing expensive healthcare, surely, if we ensured they weren't able to afford the medication they need? Not to mention that it isn't actually ok, ethically, to let people die like that.

Young people have options that pensioners don't. Young people can work more, get better jobs, emigrate, they can do something to improve their circumstances.

What can young people do about wage stagnation? the cost of housing? fiscal drag? genuine question? emigrate? how does that help the tax base?

They wont cut benefits because they already tried! How did that turn out? Loads of comments here about pensioners I certainly hope your not the same people who were horrified at the suggestion of winter fuel being cut but happy to see their pensions getting cut?? They floated the idea of PIP the amount of posts on here where they got slated and people were worried about theirs getting cut. Long and short you can’t win and you can’t please everyone, we want good services ambut absolutely do not want to pay for it! I think a raise of 1p raise would be easier to take than a 2p not sure if my calcs are right but around £55 a month? So would prefer 1p if any but would that raise what we need?

Exactly this! Benefits is a drop in the ocean.

As if the Government would dare touch the triple lock after the response to means testing WFA. Pensioners have demonstrated they are untouchable. So the rest of us have to find a way to afford it.

Child benefit is means tested.

Need to stop free prescriptions, elderly care and university fees in Scotland and Wales. It comes out of one pot and is discriminatory,

Interesting one. And good to raise all tax bands, less open to criticism of favouritism.

Pensioners have demonstrated they are untouchable. So the rest of us have to find a way to afford it.

yep, people can't afford their own retirement or to have dc but they need to pay for others.

100% Labour neee to cut public spending
benefits
not remove cap on child benefit
stop spending on illegals
stop spending on foreign aid
stop cow towing to unions
cut business taxes rather than burden them
wurh a raft of even
more costs destroying economy even further !

they won’t though as they’re spineless and will go after middle as always !

we cannot afford state pensions and the NHS model because the majority don't pay enough tax for this.

I wish they'd increase income tax. An extra 1p or 2p really wouldn't make much difference to most people and if the government used that money to make obvious improvements, people would soon stop moaning about it. If we want good services and a civilized society, we need to pay for it.

But it’s not just pensions/income tax/benefits that should be on the table. What about taxing gambling winnings? Taxing multinational companies which take the absolute piss with their tax set ups? Taxing the very wealthy?

Yup - let's try a few of these.

I've worked pretty much full time as a staff nurse until I was 60 - despite having rheumatoid arthritis. So having free prescriptions from age 60 has made a big difference for me. I don't get a free bus pass etc now 🙄anyways.

I've never been on benefits (apart from child benefit which I don't think counts ) and yes - it's hard waiting until 67 to receive State Pension, as NHS one is not enough to live off. I've taken a small part time job in the meantime...We are so fortunate that we have been able to pay off mortgage etc but not everyone is in that same boat.

But yeah, whatever, raise the pension age to 70, and there's a lot more folk who will fall into poverty.

I wish they'd increase income tax. An extra 1p or 2p really wouldn't make much difference to most people and if the government used that money to make obvious improvements, people would soon stop moaning about it. If we want good services and a civilized society, we need to pay for it.

everyone needs to pay for it though.

But yeah, whatever, raise the pension age to 70, and there's a lot more folk who will fall into poverty.

@crunchylamp but that is what will happen for younger generations and far more of them will be renting

I’m aware of how it’s means tested! It should be only available for the very poorest, you can’t cut every other benefit and leave people claiming CB who don’t need it. If they cut child benefit for everyone but the poorest and left pensions alone I’d be perfectly behind it!