To realise very few people care about road rules or the Highway Code any more

[JacquesHarlow]

AIBU here - is anyone on Mumsnet like me, and thinks about the Highway Code or bothers to follow its guidance? Please join me if so!

For my job I have to drive a LOT. I drive pretty much all over the UK.

Yes, the standard of driving is far better than many countries around the world. But something I have noticed increasingly (and especially since the pandemic) is this:

1. Very few people indicate right on a roundabout. You get this bizarre situation where someone approaches a roundabout in a right hand lane, doesn't indicate, careers around the roundabout for 270 degrees, then once at their junction, they indicate off left to show they're taking the exit!!
2. Middle lane hogging is now third lane hogging On any four lane motorway in the UK, I find the vast majority of drivers have moved to the third lane and sit there at 60 or 65mph. The first and second lane have been re-designated as a lorry lane, and as a lorry overtaking lane. Again, this is not the Highway Code.
3. Phone driving is an absolute epidemic. On the school run people drive off holding their phones and checking messages... next to a SCHOOL where children are still walking and crossing the road.
4. Merge in turn is completely ignored - instead you see bizarre behaviour like road captains who sit straddling two lanes, a mile before the merge, to stop "queue jumpers". This goes completely against the road rules and the Code but once again, British drivers know best and no one can tell them otherwise
5. Give way if parked cars are on your left again seems to be ignored. I've seen plenty of fellow women do this one, where they barrel through hoping the other person will concede, and then when asked to reverse their car, go into a complete blind panic and start swearing and shouting for the other person to reverse instead.
6. Give way to traffic already on the motorway when joining Again, forget it. When I'm in lane 1, and I see a slip road ahead, I try and move over. I can't straightway because middle lane hoggers, however I wait for a gap and then move in time. Only to find the car that is joining isn't happy I've made a space...because they want to slalom across two lanes and barrel their way into lane 2 or 3 in one quick glide! WTF.

Yeah I've shared too many examples, but I could share dozens more.

It's like the Highway Code is irrelevant to most drivers. They decide "what is fair". So if they feel they don't want to wait and there's an obstruction on their left? Barrel on through!

The only way around this is either

• increased traffic policing of road offences, which we all know won't happen because we have fewer police
• mandatory driving retraining, which everyone would hate

Is this just me? Does anyone else care about this or notice this, or am I a lone female voice in this space and actually it's fine to just make up the rules as we go along?

Thanks in advance

Passing on the left can be a much less dangerous option than allowing frustration to build among a number of drivers stacked up behind a middle lane hogger who has no intention of ever moving over. Middle lane hogging is a de facto offence under the careless driving laws; overtaking on the left is not. There's nothing illegal about passing on the left if the manoeuvre is carried out in a controlled, careful and observant manner.

Deciding to try and unilaterally decide what the rules should be based on being fair to people who don't know the rules or choose not to follow the rules in a way that makes traffic worse, increases the likelihood of accidents and blocks exits and expecting others to follow the arbitray rules you've made up in your head is objectively fucking stupid.

Passing on the left can be a much less dangerous option than allowing frustration to build among a number of drivers stacked up behind a middle lane hogger who has no intention of ever moving over
Then the same principle applies to merging lanes. Passing a line of queuing people can result in frustration to build amongst those who are queueing and create accidents.

Just as passing on the right can cause the lane hogger to suddenly move to the left and miss the passing car invisible in their blind spot.

Two wrongs don't make it right as the saying goes.

You are not wrong.

I think it’s largely that a lot (the majority?) of people have no interest in being skilled / courteous drivers - they just get in their car, turn on their choice of music, and want to get from A to B with the least possible mental effort they can expend.

That certainly accounts for the MLM’s who see it as everybody else’s job to drive round them.

I would be happy for everyone to have to have a mandatory day of advanced driver training every five years or so - with the tutor having the ability to refer people for mandatory remedial training if their driving fell below a minimum acceptable safe standard.

I continue to recommend the YouTube channel of ‘RegLocal’ - a former police advanced driving instructor - who has a very sensible (and useful) series of videos on ‘Advanced and Performance Driving’ that will likely make anyone who hasn’t done an advanced driving qualification (AIM/RoSPA/Police/etc.) a better driver.

Really appreciate everyone being so open about experiences on this thread.

The key for me listening to some of this, is how much things are left to "interpretation" on our roads.

People see a situation and bring emotion or judgement to bear - the actual rules go out of the window at this point.

If you are actively ignoring an open lane / checkout / ticket line (take your pick, any scenario works) next to you out of some misplaced sense of "fairness" and then get annoyed when someone else uses it correctly, it is a symptom of your own poor road use and judgement
I don't ignore it when there are 3 or 4 cars queuing on the other lane and indeed hope that it encourages others to do it. When there are over 20 cars, I don't anymore. I am annoyed but in the scale of things, a slight delay of a few minutes doesn't trump rudeness.

You can tell the entitled ones anyway. They don't pass going at a slow pace and then wait their turn to merge. They drive by at a too high speed for the circumstances and then push in front when they can't go any further expected to be let through as soone as the car in front moves.

As pointed out, the same people who do exactly the same passing through on turning lanes to aggressively push in front at the last second.

dd has just passed her test.

I took her out a lot and I was surprised when she told me that her instructor says that at a junction and a roundabout if a lane is marked as left turn only or right turn only then you don't indicate.
(this is what she told me, so I have no verification of it)

So that may be where your first one is coming from.

Sorry but I’m what you would call a ‘middle lane hogger.’ Lane 1 is full of trucks going at 60 - why would I constantly want to weave in and out of them, going back and forth from Lane 1 to Lane 2, when I can comfortably sit in Lane 2 at 70mph? It doesn’t make sense. Lane 1 = trucks/slow drivers, Lane 2 = normal drivers at 70mph, Lane 3 = dickheads in Audis/BMWs going more than 70. Always the way and always will be.
You can use your own brain, and don’t have to follow rules blindly just because ‘they’re the rules.’ Agree with pp that in some cases it also does make sense to undertake - shock, that’s not in the rule book either!

I passed my test 15 years ago and this is how I was taught. If a lane is left/right hand turn only then it is a dedicated lane and there is no obligation to indicate - I usually do, the same as if I'm driving on an empty road with no cars/pedestrians, makes sure it stays habitual.

Depends on how far the lorries are apart though. If you aren't passing one for a minute or longer... you are hogging and aren't paying attention to the road.

You can be fined for it incidentally.. they are starting to monitor it.

You are a mid lane hogger!!! It’s you!!!

On the ‘Don’t indicate if there’s no one to indicate to’ point, why not? It’s costs nothing. It stops you getting into bad habits

No weaving required, don’t be ridiculous. The inside lane is the driving lane, all the other lanes are overtaking lanes. If you’re not overtaking, drive on the left. If you’ve just overtaken one vehicle and another vehicle is coming up you will need to overtake, of course you don’t swerve back into the left lane then swerve out again immediately.

I think many people these days simply drive to their own set of rules and say fuck it to the highway code.

I've been teaching my DD to drive since May, you really notice this when you have L plates on, people don't give a shit there's a young person just starting out on the roads- after 35 years of driving I've come to the conclusion most drivers are knobheads.

On the ‘don’t indicate…’ point, it does the opposite of getting into bad habits, it makes you do proper observations. Bad habits include indicating then changing lane without having checked if anyone is going to be impacted by your manoeuvre. “But I indicated, why didn’t you move out of my way?” Whereas if you’d looked, you would have seen that the road wasn’t clear for you to just pull out. It costs nothing to look properly and can save lives.

You may not want to @Ace56 but it is the law. As well as being fined you can actually be given penalty points on your licence too for this offence. Whether that ever happens, I have my doubts, but it could.

As a new driver I don’t proclaim to be perfect and have definitely made mistakes, but I’ve been astounded by just how dangerous other drivers can be. Have had people nearly cause a collision to overtake me when I’m doing 20 on a 20 road by a busy high street/school area only to end up sat next to me at the same red light 🤨

The lack of indicators on roundabouts is another one that drives me barmy. Equally when the car behind you beeps because a car you’re giving way to at a roundabout hasn’t got their indicators on so you hold back and it turns out to be unnecessary because they take the first exit. Why are you beeping me?!

On the other hand, I was indicating right to go the whole way round a roundabout the other day. Roundabout was clear when I got there, however a speeding motorbike appeared once I was already on it and flew down the hill through the give way of the exit I was passing and thankfully I was able to slam my brakes on. He did put his hand up and mouth “sorry”, but for the love of god, when people ARE signalling at roundabouts… check them before you go 🤦‍♀️

The rules are the law @Ace56 - they are there to be followed! Imagine if we took your advice in other areas of life?!

my issues with merge in turn are that obnoxious people seem to miss the IN TURN part! I have no issue at all letting one person at the front in. I do however take issue with letting five people in who are all trying to shove to the front and not wait their turn. It should be one in, then the car from the original queue proceeds, then another in etc. but this rarely happens! I agree it is silly to queue for 3 miles back, but there is also no need to be pushing!

I am however embarrassed to admit I was actually taught by my driving instructor to only indicate right on a roundabout if using the very last exit. If not using the last exit I was taught to not indicate til I have passed the exit prior to leaving and then to indicate left. I am honestly shocked to learn this is not accurate guidance!

I attempt to be a good driver & rider

However, I agree that I have seen lots of poor driving, in particular
speeding
usage of mobile phones
Over taking on bends
Poor diving in bad weather conditions

I believe that AI cameras will in the future? generate lots of automatic driving fines

a slight delay of a few minutes doesn't trump rudeness

Correct road use and safety trumps everything. Use the road correctly. Forget what is nice / fair - you may think you're doing a good thing but what you're doing in reality is creating a hazard. This is why you're not supposed to flash others out of side roads, for example.

push in front when they can't go any further expected to be let through as soone as the car in front moves.

This is what merge in turn IS. You take turns. The car in front goes, then it's the turn of the person in the other lane. Then your turn.

You are interpreting correct road use as rudeness. Emotion has no place behind the wheel of a car. You need to refresh yourself on the highway code and perhaps take a few refresher driving lessons.

You've missed the one about people using fog lights as normal headlightswhen there's absolutely no sign of any fog!

When waiting to join a dual carriageway where there's no slip road most drivers don't think to move over into the empty second lane so I can join, it's pretty much only lorry drivers who will move over.

Also annoys me when drivers don't say thank you if you let them out of a junction or give way if there are parked cars both sides of the road and it's only middle section free.

But I silently cheered when a pick up truck did number 4 on your list when a lane was closed on the motorway the other day and most people got over before the count down signs finished and lane closed that yes does involve a bit of queuing but if you have a performance type car-audit, bmw etc you are exempt from queuing and will go aloneg the lane that's been closed at 60mph until right at the last minute and expect the driver, whose been in stationery queuing traffic for a while to just let you in front of them them.

People out there own interpretation on it

like undertaking
the reality is if your CREEPING along you can undertake the slower moving traffic
but people’s take on that is if someone is doing 69mph in the middle lane and your doing 70 in the slow lane you can undertake

This is a big issue to us locally. I commented to dh the other day it's a good job we know where we're going!

my big bug bears are:

lane hoggers
people who drive up the slip road slowly
people who break before the slip road (someone in front of me today slowed to 50 before they even got on the slip road)
people who go left on a roundabout but don't indicate so I'm sat there like an idiot when I could have gone.

Oh and I've seen a lot of people oblivious to emergency vehicles with twos and blues going recently. I even watched someone dawdle across a crossing the day whilst ambulance sat waiting for them!

I agree with you 100%, OP.
Driving standards are appalling. It’s as if people think they are indestructible.

The car on the inside is the one in the right here though. The one in the outside lane is overtaking no one so needs to move in.

I don’t deliberately overtake but drive on the inside as you are supposed to and go 70 there if the road is clear. If someone is in lane 3 going slower than me I hardly think I’m ‘undertaking’.