to be annoyed that yet again eastenders used the expresion"epi"

[2shoes]

bianca was telling her dd of and used the expresion and roxy used it the other week.
can't the scrip writers think of a better word to use??
dd has epilepsy and so does dh. and I can assure you it is no laughing matter.

Pre. 7:30 or 8 during the week and the omnibus is Sunday afternoon.

eppi is not a word. It is short for epilepsy. it is not part of the english language. it does not mean temper tantrum it means epileptic fit.
it has nothing to do with a temper tantrum.

thebod personaly I haven't a clue about the words you mention I can't fight all the battles. so I stick to the ones that affect me and mine.

I

I always thought the word 'epi' in that context came from 'epicentre', ie the epicentre of earthquake/volcano..... summing up images of someone so raving furious that they are exploding/shaking dramatically.

't seems I was wrong, and naive.

YANBU. I have epilepsy and it irritates me. I don't know of anyone who uses that expression in real life in this day and age. If I heard it in the street it would make me turn around with a face on, as would many other expressions which are no longer considered acceptable for various reasons. It's not the 1970s any more!

Yes Eastenders and other programmes want to reflect real life and real people, but if they can do it without being rascist, or swearing, then they can do it without using expressions like that.

There are several issues here that seem to be getting a bit mixed up.

On the one hand, I am with Riven- why use language that offends people?

On the other hand, how do you as a writer portray offensive characters on the screen if they are not allowed to say anything offensive? This would mean you cannot write scripts about misogynist people, nor about racist people, nor about sadists, nor about any other people with offensive views. Or do you have a speaker voice in the background who says 'this person is secretly thinking offensive thoughts', without elaborating? Or just restrict your script writing to nice, intelligent clued-up people (well, it would make a change in Eastenders ).

Letting a baddie use bad language or a stupid person use stupid language does not indicate that the writer, or his television company, finds the language acceptable. It's about language being in character- and if the character is not very admirable, that will be reflected in the language.

The problem with the thesaurus provided by an earlier poster is that none of those terms would be right for the person portrayed; a writer's job involves more than looking up synonyms in a dictionary.

The other question is, where do you draw the line. 'epi' seems clearly offensive and I think we can all agree on that. But what indeed about 'mental'? Nothing funny about mental illness. I had a friend who died from the consequences of mental illness- certainly not amusing at all. So should Ron Weasley be banned from calling Hermione Granger mental in that amused kind of voice?

I have certainly seen the term 'lunatic' (or its more colloquial spellings) cropping up on MN more than once. Should we self-censure? Or be censured?

What about the light-hearted references to drunkards and drunkenness on MN. They presumably can't amuse those families who have really suffered from the consequences of alcoholism?

What about 'addict' used lightly of less serious addictions? Not funny if your life has been wrecked by a genuine addict.

I haven't got any answers and I am not really taking either side. Just feel that there is a big difference between a writer's own persona (where he does indeed want to watch his language) and characters with whom he may not necessarily identify.

You make a good case, Cory, but the 'paki' test stands for me - have the writers EVER used the word 'paki' in an EastEnders script? And would they do it without having another character challenge the use of that word?

If not, why is 'epi' OK, especially as it seems to be reinforcing the idea that it is an acceptable word to use, given some posts on this thread?

SO VERY WELL PUT FIO! "Having an epi" used to describe a temper tantrum is NOT appropriate.. but maybe I only think that because I too have stood screaming in terror waiting for the paramedics and watching my blue child try to breathe whilst in the throes of "status epilipticus" (a seizure that WON'T STOP!)and with a collapsed lung.

That first experience remains the most scary awful moment of my life and also that of my 9 year old DD who pales visibly at sound of the word "epilepsy". I really hope she doesn't have to hear it used in the flippant and insulting way.

It's NOT ok to lump the behaviour of a naughty tantrumming child/person into the same one as a epilepsy sufferer having a seizure. I wouldn't have thought a person really NEEDED to have had their child experience this personally to understand this concept, surely everyone had some level of empathy.. but still that's just me...!

I think you're right, Edam, you would expect it to be challenged; that is probably the crucial point. A sensible author bringing in characters who use offensive language would make sure to have some balance in the shape of a more likeable/attractive character who challenges it.

Still leaves us with 'mental' though. This is heard much more frequently, even in the Harry Potter films and other family productions. Can anyone explain why the Paki test does not apply here?

My dad was diagnosed as epileptic earlier this year. He went straight into status epilepticus with no build up or warning. He ended up on a life support machine and was on the critical list. At 59 he has to deal with a sudden and life changing condition. I think using words like 'epi' are offensive to describe a temper tantrum. Actually I felt this before it affected my family.

I am probably a little too p.c sometimes for this site as I actually don't like the term 'going mental' to describe a tantrum either. I think that mostly you can use other terms that cannot be offensive with a little more imagination.

It is a tricky one though I'm sure.

I totally agree with you, Riven. I have lots of issues with HP from a moral standpoint.

However, what about our own beloved MN? I seem to remember seeing quite a few instances where terminology originally describing people with mental illnesses being used in a derogatory way of people whose views we do not agree with; probably on average half a dozen times a day.

Or do we judge that words like 'lunatic' and 'mad' have now come so far from their original meaning that nobody now associates them with mental illness? I suppose that could be a reasonable argument.

But isn't that part of the issue here? I can understand why 2shoes was upset about the Eastenders reference, as it was coupled with the term fit, so clearly the writers did understand the association. But other people posting here thought the term had a different derivation (epicentre, episode), and did not feel that they were insulting people with epilepsy. Personally it's a word I'll be more careful with, but language does change.

If the origins of the term 'to have an epi' do NOT come from epilepsy, then where DO they come from???

Expressions don't spring from thin air. They evolve, logically, and have a source.

I don't think they should say it. I mean, in rl, people that the character Roxy is based on may well use it, but Eastenders should be responsible and not use it.

Nooka, anyone who thought the word was nothing to do with epilepsy was wrong, plain and simple.

I am a little confused, all language comes from somewhere surely, it evolves all the time, and slang is brought into the modern day norm all of the time.

Wheter this comes from a medical condition or a totally made up word, the majority of language is a mismash of other languages and localisms.

Not saying you cant find it offensive, but if its been adopted by the masses, its now property of everyone, I think you will find, if I am making myself clear!!

So 'spazz' is OK, is it, Colacubes? It's fine for teenagers to use 'gay' as an insult - because they mean 'crap'?

You are defending the indefensible. Or do you demand that no-one ever challenges discriminatory language because the poor innocent who uses it may not be aware of the derivation?

"Expressions don't spring from thin air. They evolve, logically, and have a source"

but surely this is a point in itself. the term epi may well have evolvced to the point that most who use it do so wh no conotation of belittling those with epiliepsy.much in the same way that people who use the term "rule of thumb" are not advocating domestic violence.

Let me just make myself clear Edam, I am of Irish descent, my ma and pa are irish as are all the other relatives, but paddy is slung around our house hold all the time, my grandmother was schizophrenic but folks still say some one went schizo, and my aunt is downs and people still call her mongel!! Do i find offence, no, why because it is a word, and yes some are not aware that there are other words you could use, or the fact that they come from another word that has emotions for others.

My point is, words are used, misused, changed shortend made-up,I do not know the origins of all the words I use, but I still use them, as I am sure the majority of us do, unless we are master linguists, language evolves, whether you find it offensive or not, it will be used by the masses and become part of their language, and so the meanings however derived will be lost in time.

colacubes would you like me to get ds to speak to you.
he can tell you about how over the years he has had to put up with people taking the piss out of his sister and calling her a spaz. it got so bad in the end he ended up having counselling(ok now he is 16 and decks them)
it is not hard to think about the words you use you know. up until the other day I didn't get why people on here were anti the word "stupid" it was explained to me. I now get it.
how hard can it be.