Emeshment in Teenage Relationships

[GinSang]

I've changed my name for this as I'm sure my DC know my usual username!

Maybe emeshment (in the title) isn't the right word but I'm not sure what is.

I have two DDs - 20 and 18 - and the level involvement/emeshment that seems to occur in teenage relationships really concerns me.

Dd2 has been with her boyfriend about 9 months. He has her bank card on his googlepay, and she has his. They both use them and see their money as "our money". They both have access to all of each others social media accounts (and check them regularly and often take screenshots) and have each others phone PIN. She often gives him her key to our house to let himself in. I've objected and she says I'm weird - she also often has his key to his (parents) house and apparently they don't mind (though maybe they don't know).

My older DD was the same in her relationships (she's currently single) and all their friends are exactly the same. When I voice concerns about giving a boyfriend of a couple of months access to your bank account/social media and having access to theirs, they all (their friends included) tell me I'm strange and old-fashioned and that if a boyfriend didn't want this kind of access or give them this kind of access then they would question his commitment and leave him. They see this as some sort of feminist standpoint.

It also seems to be commonplace to not "allow" opposite sex friendships. My DD has a "good" male friend who every time he gets a new girlfriend blocks my DD on all social media. My dd gets slightly upset each time but it seems to be accepted. It happens to all their friends as well, and when the girls get a new boyfriend they all go through his social media - which of course they have access to - and block all female friends. When they split up, female friends get added back. When I've spoken to my DDs and their friends about my concerns about this they just say times have changed and its a matter of respect (ie not allowing a girlfriend to block female friends is seen as disrespectful)

My best lives at the opposite side of the country and has DDs the same age. Its the same there too so not an odd local thing (though she didn't know it was until I talked to her about it and she asked probing questions - when we first spoke about it she believed nothing like this happened with her DDs and their friends).

Am I being unreasonable to find this level of involvement/emeshment scary?

I'm Team OP rather than Team DD but I'm in my 40s and I don't really know anyone in DDs age range to ask if this is now 'normal'.

The problem is that MN is going to be a majority of users in the older category and the minority that are DD age so even if you got 1000 replies all stating this is controlling behaviour I'm not sure it would have any effect on DDs as they are already of the opinion that Team OP is old fashioned and Team DD this is just how things are now.

I think all you can do is keep communicating, show evidence of controlling and abusive relationships and draw comparisons where you find them along with showing healthy relationships and hopefully drawing comparisons there also. Whether they think you are old fashioned or not, pick your main sticking points and hold your boundaries firm on those and gently chip away at the lesser but still not healthy behaviours.

Yanbu, does these people ever have any fun or are they too busy being controlling and jealous.

Ds is 17 almost 18, been with gf about 18 months, I too was shocked to hear they have each others social media log ins and phone codes. The money thing doesn’t happen tho, son is quite thrifty so doubt he’d be willing to let her have access!
I maybe get why they’d have shared funds for dates/holidays etc but everyday living no way.

Your old fashioned, out of touch.. this sounds like something from the past, it’s something I did stupidly when I was young but I was never taught any better, I’m not sure it would have helped anyway in an abusive relationship.

Sadly I can belive all this though. My 11yo DD has a male friend, he got a girl friend before the summer holidays and she went mad at him having female girl friends, he was constantly having to justify where he was. Thankfully his parents put a stop to it. But fuck these are 11 yos already having controlling relationships.

My DDs aren’t at an age where money is an issue thankfully, but I do know that sharing locations is a big thing with teens.

I don’t even have access to my DHs logins for anything. I know he’s got a list for me in case anything ever happens but I’d never dream of looking for it. Mine I’m lazy and use the family password for everything, I also over share with him so knows exactly where I am, but if I didn’t want want him to know my logins or anything he’d respect that.

I thought I was having the right conversations with my DD in preparation for relationships, but now I’m definitely going to ramping it up.

That would concern me greatly. My DD (18) has been on a relationship with her boyfriend for three years. They do not share money or bank cards, they have eachother on snap chat so can see locations but they don't check up on eachother. I've asked, she tells me that neither of them know the others passwords or check social media accounts. They both have friends of the opposite sex and my dd will go out with her friends without her boyfriend.

I've asked her if what you describe is the norm amongst her friends. She says not and she would be worried if they were.

Edited: I've asked my eldest child and they said no way.

I have 4 teenagers and 2 of them have boy/girlfriends and when I read this post to them, they thought it was crazy. They do share their location but that's about it.
They have healthy relationships with the opposite sex and I know my son often buys his girlfriend lunch but would never share his bank card!
I don't recognise any of this behaviour. I would be worried about this if this was my child.

It certainly doesn't happen with my daughter's and their friends, I guess it becomes a culture in some areas. Very odd though, I wouldn't like it at all.

Next time he's in your home take the key off him.

DD does not get a key until she is responsible enough not to give it away.

The rest frightens me. I'll have to speak to my own DC to ensure they are not sharing bank details/pins or social media.

Agree with you, OP. This is horrible behaviour. It’s not feminist or enlightened to insist on this degree of enmeshment from your partners - it’s abusive and desperately unhealthy. We don’t own our partners; we don’t get to control them in this way. This kind of behaviour should be a massive turn-off, not something to be praised. Where are they getting their ideas from? You’re right to be concerned.

This isn’t normal
my 16 year old is aghast at what you’ve said.

Is the location thing Snapchat?

It all sounds very intense. I get the feeling teenage relationships are much more puritanical than they used to be/should be. I was talking with my teen the other day and she said the general consensus among many was that you shouldn’t ‘be talking to’ a guy unless you wanted to date him, and you shouldn’t date someone unless you thought you might marry them one day. I was aghast!

OMG, that's really sad! I hope it's just a passing trend. Even so, it's likely to leave an aftermath in the shape of young people locked into awful relationships 😭

I've just read a bunch of vox-pops from Gen Z on dating. Obviously, these will have been selected by various authors, but the overall impression is of 'intentionality'. They conveyed little to no sense of simply enjoying other people, letting things happen (or not). There were some poignant quotes from 20-somethings, saying they regret that talking to a new person at a bar is seen as sleazy or dangerous 😳

Fuck is this quite common? Are toxic relationships going to become a pandemic?
Thanks for the heads up, going to coach my three girls on what normal relationships are and red flags.

I find it absolutely terrifying that location sharing has now been normalised and seems to be expected in romantic relationships. I wouldn't dream of doing it with DH - my partner of 14 years. I really, really hope I can resist any temptation to ask it of my children, but I realise that's easy to say while they're still too young to leave the house without me...

Sounds totally bizarre. I wouldn’t be happy at all, sounds boundaryless and also risk of controlling. It’s your house so no key!!

I’ve come across this no friends of the opposite sex a few times. It’s bizarre and concerning and also baffling to see them re add friends, like nothing has happened, once the relationship is over. There’s lots of checking up as well, it’s exhausting. This from both girls and boys 15/16/17

Screams unhealthy.. neither one of my sons or girlfriends do this.
My sons wouldn't give that behaviour the time of day.

My dd is year 13. The location sharing is totally normal for them. But it can have a sinister twist. Her friend is in a coercively controlling relationship and dd said if the girl manages to go out with dd this weekend (dd is trying to get her to come out but his 20 yo sister apparently wants to come too - think chaperone), she’s going to get her friend to turn her tracking off. He tracks her constantly and doesn’t have a job, isn’t in college etc.

As for the opposite sex friend thing, dd was recently seeing a guy, who gave me Andrew Tate vibes. I could see what he was about, that he was spending money on her and expected sex in return. I wouldn’t let dd go to his house and after just over a month of seeing dd, he went off and had sex with another girl. He then told dd’s (male) friend that although he still liked dd, she was too immature and he didn’t like that when he was out in our local town (he’s from 30 mins down the road), 3 guys came up to him on a night out and asked him if he was with my dd. That apparently meant she speaks to too many guys.

It was also clear he didn’t like her having male friends. Dd and I spoke about this and she ignored any protests, which I can imagine irked him. Idk if she would have continued to do so had they become boyfriend/ girlfriend. I suspect there would have been a cull of guys she is loosely friends with. Dd has a ex and they both hold a candle for one another but dd is too scared to go back to him stm. He adds unblocks dd on Instagram when he’s single then blocks her again when he’s not. She finds all this adding and removing normal but doesn’t do it herself. She’s only had one boyfriend thus far for a couple of months and he didn’t ask her to remove / block people. Dd has a lot of male friends.

As for 3 guys coming up to the Andrew Tate vibes guy, I this is normal stuff really seeing how many people dd knows and doesn’t indicate her talking to other guys. In fact she had the exclusive discussion with this guy and she was abiding by it. He otoh was going out all the time (year above so just completed A levels) and talking to girls a lot whilst future faking her that she’d be his girlfriend soon (as the guy has to ask 🙄)… and ended up having sex with one of them. So he was definitely not exclusive with her.

I agree things seem so much more intense these days because there’s constant access. Dd thought she knew this guy so well and at the time, I said she doesn’t really know him very well at all. Because of that, these kids are talking on the phone then meeting up a couple of times and in many instances then having sex and forming a relationship. And they really don’t know one another, hence why it can so easily become toxic. I have been talking to dd a lot recently including about not knowing someone until you are comfortable enough to be emotional vulnerable. It’s been a bit of a baptism of fire as a parent tbh. And the same for dd as well.

The sharing keys, social media and bank cards is really inappropriate. There’s a lot of enmeshment by the sound of it and I think all this stems from them thinking they know one another really well after having met up only a couple of times due to being constantly on the phone whether that’s calls, messages or voice notes etc.

I mean I ended up marrying my boyfriend from age 18 but the ‘our money’ stuff is quite concerning.

Phone pin and socials have been open since we got together so that’s normal.

Again the opposite sex friends thing is weird bullshit that’s been spread on TikTok by Alpha men and women ‘in their true feminine era’.

Its conservatism dressed in Gen Z fashion and you should tell her that. It’s incredibly unfeminist to imagine people can’t be friends.

Not common with my teenage dc, they still have friends of the opposite sex thwy they socialise with by themselves, don't give out their bank details. They did give the key to the house though without me knowing one time but they'd been together 6 months then.

@GarlicPint I just had to Google ‘what are box pops’ 😂

I really am old.

That's a very unhealthy relationship and giving your bank details to another person is stupid and they'll have no recourse if the worst happens.

This is awful. No way access to bank accounts or social media. I have 20 and 26 DD the younger group is more like that. Locations yes and there is an element of not talking to other boys/girls or liking too many photos but not really blocking though that’s happened. Amongst the youngers group there have been plenty that have been that extreme though not sure on bank accounts. Of course some of these relationships have gone very wrong and abusive and they not learning.
the 26 year group are not like that at all except perhaps the very rare one that they comment on.
keys to my house absolutely not. After 4 years and living here for a spell in pandemic yes to that bf but no others. It feels like bloody Airbnb as it. Pay rent and maybe I think about it .
this is the love island affect I’m thinking and I don’t think it’s healthy

I'm glad I've read this as my boys are teenagers and not had girlfriends yet. I'll have a chat about not sharing everything to this level. This is just wild to me!

I just asked my 17 y/o about this. We have a v honest relationship, and I asked in as non judgemental way as I could. She said "no that's weird, could be financially abusive, no f**ING way!" I also asked if any of her friends did it and she said not unless they were in a controlling relationship. I believe her - not sure if we're just in a minority?
But thanks for flagging OP, it gave us a really good chance to talk about control in relationships so I'm really grateful for your post!