To think I should work less and claim Universal Credit?

[Tiredandgrumpymum]

After a difficult divorce I find myself supporting my 2 children on my own. Ex-husband pays the bare minimum.

I work full time on about minimum wage, all my shopping is done at Asda usually yellow-stickered where ever possible. This year managed to take my 2 kids away for a weeks break by the seaside in a caravan. We had a lovely time but did it as cheaply as possible. Bought ice cream and put in the freezer in the caravan so when kids asked for an ice cream out I said wait till we get home.

No eating out except for takeaway chips etc. No expensive days out.

Just bought all the school uniforms as cheaply as possible from the supermarket and the school shoes which I've had to put on my credit card.

My SIL popped round for a coffee earlier on her way back from the hairdressers having treated herself to a new cut and colour at a posh salon and she was just on the way to get her nails done. She's just returned from a 2 week all inclusive in Turkey with her 4 kids. Her kids get the best school uniforms and school shoes and she pays for them to do various activities I can only dream about. All this and she works 3 mornings a week and gets topped up on UC. She goes to the gym everyday as she can afford it and has the time to so looks fabulous.
I'm sorry I sound so bitter but I really am.

Who says it’s made-up?

Evidence please.

How is it wrong to advise people as to what may qualify for a higher rate claim and why would you infer from that, that parents are being encouraged to lie ? Could it be that they are simply being reminded that one of the most important things to consider is reporting each and every aspect of disability because it may be the difference between a higher or lower award - or no award at all ?

If what you’re saying is that the parents are being encouraged to lie, the only thing l can tell you is that it’s one thing trying to make a fraudulent claim and quite another to get away with it. Awards are not based on the balance of probability that something impossible to verify is true. They are based on medical evidence and physical assessment of disability. The assessor is medically qualified, so will largely know whether something reported as fact by the parent is likely to be an effect of the childs’ disability or not, and will use their judgement accordingly.

MN is a very strange place. In over twenty years of working with the disabled l have never come across the attitude that prevails here. Which is largely that claimants are lying through their teeth on claim forms and that assessors are too stupid to recognise fraud and are letting everyone through. Having worked within the system and sat in on more assessments and appeals than l care to remember, l can assure you that that is very far from the case.

Some do put in claims for very tenuous reasons, i see it daily on the DLA Facebook group I'm on
But largely they don't get anywhere with their " Claims "

The fact you're even asking the question, is everything that's wrong with the benefits system.

If you’re talking about the OP, of course it’s made up. The notion that you can work three mornings a week and be able to afford all of the things OP so envies her SiL for, just through UC top ups is utter nonsense. It’s designed to get MN frothing about benefits and how disabled people are all scroungers and cheats. And it worked didn’t it ?

I think you're very naive if you can't see the potential for fraudulent claims based upon self-reported impact.

For example, claiming that your mental health means you can't leave the house on your own. That's an automatic 12 points on a pip claim.

You'd obviously start with telephone appointments with the doctor and go from there. How can a doctor tell if you're bullshitting? None of it could ever be verified and, if you're ever spotted outside on your own, you can give the Mumsnet favourite 'You're allowed to have good days, don't you know'.

I'm not anti-disability payments. My brother is brain damaged and receives lower rate mobility and no UC due to an inheritance that he's saved.

It does, however, piss me off when people try to gaslight everybody into thinking there's zero scope for fraud in the system, when it's actually wide open to abuse.

And that’s the difference. But the problem is that although these claims won’t get anywhere in the main, people will try to use the fact that they are being made to justify their narrative that disabled people and their families are all feckless scroungers. A fact very much in evidence here.

Me too, the Irish site, though a huge amount of claims are allowed after an appeal.
There is a lot of tips to note.
It really is down to the assessor.
Two people can have the issues, only one will be accepted.
Some people get it easier than others.
@x2boys I saw your post about your eldest DS, type 1 diabetes, shocking that he isn't entitled to the payment, I'd reapply.

Googled) I see the appeal success rate is very high in the UK too.

If you have pip for two people in the family for adhd, UC top up, with part-time work, you could easily save and afford SIL lifestyle.

I think you’re very naive if you think this is how a benefit award is decided. To get 12 points for being unable to leave the house you would need to produce incontrovertible evidence of an overwhelming mental health condition from a second line, consultant led mental health team. And even then the PIP assessor has the last word and can use how you present at interview - anything from the fact that you appear calm, are washed and dressed appropriately, and even the fact that you managed to get to the interview at all, as evidence to the contrary. The fact that you think these points are awarded in the absence of any medical or physical signs of disability indicates that you know absolutely nothing about the assessment process.

And no-one is saying that there is zero scope for fraud. The potential is there in every system that has ever existed and all you can do is build in as many checks and balances as possible. The problem here is that people have been sucked in to the governments’ narrative that fraud is widespread, when in fact the opposite is true.

That narrative is being used as the justification for cutting benefit, when in actual fact it isn’t fraud that has ballooned the benefits bill. In 2013 PIP was introduced to replace working age DLA. And for the first time ever, those with mental health conditions were allowed to claim. Before l get flamed, l’m not against that as such. I’m simply saying that this is the main reason for the increase and the fact that government though they could introduce this change without it having a very significant impact on the cost of the benefit is naive at best and at worst negligent.

That’s because the DWP decision making is based on a flawed and unfair system and appeal is the only way many claimants can get a fair decision because the expertise on appeal panels is far superior to that used for award decisions. If there was a better assessment system, there would be less need for expensive appeal tribunals.

If school aged children are waking up multiple times in the night, it will be noticed at school and the school report would state that the child is struggling with tiredness due to lack of sleep. Evidence to back up what the parent is saying on the forms.

It's also perfectly normal for children to wet the bed at night up until a certain point and then they are referred to the incontinence team. At that point, the child is going to be mortified because they aren't going to be super young and will be able to talk to the incontinence team about bed wetting themselves. A child is very unlikely going to lie saying that they are bed wetting. They will then have evidence from the incontinence team.

Even then, waking up at night and bed wetting are highly unlikely to be accepted alone for a high rate claim.

For the purpose of disability benefit, it’s not the condition itself that is taken into account, it’s the effect on daily life, so no, some people don’t get it easier than others because no disability affects any two people in exactly the same way. It depends on the individual - all assessors work to the same system and are audited and checked regularly to make sure they are consistent.

And assessors don’t make the actual award decision. A DWP decision maker does that, based on all the evidence provided by the claimant, of which the assessors’ report is a part. Many claimants present enough evidence and information in their claims to be awarded benefit without an assessment.

This. The notion that parent reporting of this without evidence to back it up would be accepted without question is ridiculous.

If you can manage to save from a PIP claim then you’re not using it for it’s intended purpose.

"And even then the PIP assessor has the last word and can use how you present at interview - anything from the fact that you appear calm, are washed and dressed appropriately, and even the fact that you managed to get to the interview at all, as evidence to the contrary."

And I've read people on Mumsnet that have insisted upon a remote telephone assessment because 'the thought of appearing on camera makes them too anxious'.

Please stop gaslighting. Anybody with a brain can see the loopholes that can be exploited.

But we are often told on here that PIP can be spent on anything at all?

I completely understand why the appeal process is necessary, as most first claims are turned down.
I also know that it can be exploited.
What is written on reports is usually relayed through the patient.
There is sm videos detailing how to maximise points, what to say to the doctor.
It's minium, but it happens.

People can choose to use it whatever way they please.
My friend saves her sons every month in the credit union.

I’ve just spent the entire weekend working on my son’s form for the UC limited capacity to work assessment. We were sent it automatically when I took him to his initial UC interview at the job centre and the (lovely and incredibly understanding) assessor was expected by my son to shake paws with his ever-present teddy bear. I’ve been filling in forms for him, attending assessments and gathering evidence of his multiple disabilities since he was born. He’s nearly 20 now and it’s bloody exhausting.

This pisses me right off! Why am I paying for your SIL to go to the gym or get her nails done!

I work full time and have not had my hair cut in a salon for years.

I pay so much tax. I hate it.

You csn save it ( although technically it should be used foe everyday expenditure nobody checks though)
But your friend needs to be aware if her son has significant savings due to her saving his PIP it might affect any other non means tested benefits he's eligible for.

Your not it's made up nonsense HTH.

Why get angry about something that might possibly be made up, just to rile you