My dad and the cleaner

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Odd one.

DF is a bit of a fantasist, mainly imagining how he might move to this country or that. He does practically travel around a lot with work and refuses to retire, but he has done things like fly out to Spain (from the Middle East) to look at a new housing development, or in the past has wasted months of my time trying to find a London property to invest in, to the point that I instructed a solicitor at his request. In the end these things either don't go anywhere or my mum freaks out and emotionally blackmails my father, and then a little while passes and then it's on to the next. They've also moved house (in the same city) 2-3 times in the past 10 years, which feels a bit odd but whatever. I think he likes feeling important/listened to by the various property developers/salespeople. He's never been very settled. I've slightly tuned it out at this point.

Anyway - my father was here a few months ago, on his way home, and was here while our Polish cleaner was working. He told her he has a Polish passport (true) and was looking at moving to Poland - first I've heard of it but there you go. It now transpires that they exchanged phone numbers and she has offered to help him with looking at different areas of Poland, translating bureaucracy, the logistics of buying Polish property and so on.

He speaks no Polish, and I think there is next to no chance of this actually happening. I think this is just another bit of mental gymnastics for him. But of course she doesn't know him and is taking it extremely seriously. He does not read social cues; she's incredibly generous and giving. It's not a great combination.

My cleaner is absolutely lovely but a) this is so not her job and b) she has a lot on - work, a terminally ill partner, a busy life with church and an allotment and so on. She brought it up again today and I tried to explain that it was very unlikely he was actually moving and to please not spend her time on this, but I don't think I conveyed this well enough.

What do I say, to either of them? "Dad, stop wasting Wera's time" is about the best I've come up with.

"Dad, stop wasting Wera's time..." AND add how much she has to deal with already in her life is the right approach, I think.

Does your mum know this is happening?

Tell Wera, thank her for her kindness, but make sure she knows to take this with a pinch of salt.
Tell Dad to pack it in… “you don’t speak Polish Dad, Mum knows nothing about this latest fantasy, please get a grip. I tell you what Dad, how about we book you a holiday to Poland for two weeks right this second, I’ll get my laptop out. Give us all a break. Bring Wera back some vodka please”.

Just say 'Wera, I hate you see you taking my father seriously and putting yourself out to help. He gets these ideas into his head every couple of years, but never actually does anything about them, so I guarantee that all the time and effort you are putting into this will be completely wasted, he will never move to Poland. I'd suggest you gently fade him out.'

Pincer movement - you and your mum. You tell your cleaner to stop and your mum tells your dad to stop.

And then step away!

Thanks all. @VickyEadieofThigh the relationship between my parents could be a psychiatric weekend conference, to misquote Basil Fawlty.

I hear you!

Hmm, interesting. So your dad is a fantasist and Wera probably loves talking about Poland with someone who's genuinely interested and even has a connection with the country. Which he obviously does as he has a Polish passport!
So how is this harmful? I'm not sure I think there's anything wrong with it, unless you think it's going to unravel in some way, like your dad is going to start to actually make plans to move and your mum's going to freak out or something, or Wera's going to get cross about it.
How old are your parents? I think the older people get the more you can just indulge the harmless fantasies really. (I speak as a relatively new 70 year old with a penchant for a bit of self-indulgent fantasising myself, but also as a retired psychotherapist!) 😂

Interesting perspective!

He’s 74. His connection with Poland is via his mum, who fled there as a child in 193-something. No language, no especial interest in Poland that he has ever expressed to me.

I suppose I am worried that he will abuse Wera’s time. She is forever offering to, for example, mind my children while she cleans because she sees that I’m busy.

My grandparents were polish and i really don’t think it’s a country you can realistically comfortably live in without speaking polish, I wouldn’t attempt it.

I can totally see why you feel responsible and like you should shut this down but I think tell her he’s a fantasist once and then step away, they are both adults and have agency. As long as she knows being blunt with him won’t jeopardise her employment with you then you have done your bit.

i do sympathise , the feeling responsibly and embarrassment for your parents actions is really hard, after a lot of work and some therapy I’ve realised I am not, if they want to do something stupid it’s up to them, likewise I wish I’d realised earlier it wasn’t up to me to save my mum from her poor marriage- she got something out of being in it.

My mother is very similar - she likes the mental 'busyness' of the planning and chatting about it. She also liked to suck people in and take time and attention.

She also moved every few years - revelling in the planning, getting to know the neighbours (then getting so in their business they would get upset with her), finishing the redecoration............. get bored and boom - time to move again.

It got so she garnered a reputation as a 'timewaster' with all the local estate agents and property developers. Leading to her being essentially politely blacklisted, they would promise to call back, but never did.

While they did get a sale every few years out of her - it was never balanced by the drain on their time or resources to go a tour houses because she just 'wanted to see the potential (realistically, it was a way to fill her day and to be nosy). She then would spend the next several days chatting to all and sundry, planning which houses would suit, what renovations would work, with no actual intention to ever buy, while leading the estate agent on.

She also has grand fantasies about moving abroad, learning bricklaying of all things and regularly gets herself tangled up with local charities promising to do X, Y, and Z for them because she likes them saying that they appreciate her taking the time and effort.

This has caused bad feelings in the past. Charities work hard enough as it is, they don't need people turning up, taking up time and energy, and then not delivering on their promises. Recently, she made promises of time, money and effort to a well-respected local person who became very vocal locally about her repeatedly letting them down and ended up with her being shunned to a degree.

I think it's an unusual form of attention-seeking behaviour where she's looking for a particular type of interaction from someone - I've noticed it involves having the upper hand of being either the customer (so she's pandered toto some degree, maybe), or she's promising to provide a service/time or money that a business needs or it involves attention from somebody who needs to curry favour with her and therefore within the interaction she has the upper hand.

If your dad is anything like my mum, even good-natured people get irritated at the amount of time and energy they've expended to basically play in someone else's fantasy sandpit - so I can completely understand why you want to step in as I've had to do so on several occasions.

I would tell him to stop wasting her time. I'd also take her aside and gently say that 'Im so sorry about my dad. He's a bit of a fantasist and don't take what he says too seriously. And please don't feel obliged to do anything to help him. In fact I can tell him to leave you alone if you like?'

He sounds bloody insufferable! I'd have said in front of her as soon as he mentioned the Polish passport, 'how can that be when you're not Polish and have never been there?'

@DiscoBob but OP's dad has a Polish passport and she confirms his Polish connection in the post at 11.28?

This may be no help but maybe you could kind of redirect him?? He doesn’t speak polish, she does - you could say how about you try and lean some polish dad before you “move” there. She could give him lessons and earn a bit of extra cash, he’s distracted?? My dad is a bit eccentric and sometimes he sets his sights on something crazy, this is generally what we do with him.

Argh, sorry I missed that! I thought he was fantasising about the passport. She said he doesn't speak Polish.

Yeh my DH can talk endlessly, about things he’s fascinated or, vaguely interested in. I gave up listening yrs ago (ha, but i’ve got ADD so easily daydream!)& forget to inform new folk to stay out of it.
I think it maybe an OCD thing in Dh’s case & it doesn’t help that he runs up huge phone bills with total strangers chatting about which motorbike to (not) buy 🙄.
Just tell Wera, he’s got a slight MH prob?

Warn your cleaner. Tell about the history and advise her not to waste her time on it. Perhaps she could source some properties or new developments for him t9 look at, just to keep him happy.

She brought it up again today and I tried to explain that it was very unlikely he was actually moving and to please not spend her time on this, but I don't think I conveyed this well enough.

Text her clearly. 'Hi Wera, I want to warn you again that my dad is a time waster about property and moving abroad. I love him but he has wasted lots of my time, don't let him waste your time. He will never move to Poland. All the best, OP.'

This post describes these types exactly. I have a couple of these in my family, my brother and my sister. My bro takes it further than my sister as sister's DH reigns her in really early. My bro's wife buckled under and then gets stressed over the inevitable terrible outcomes. He has bought cars he can't drive and bought shares in stuff that has turned out to be massive scams and everything in between. He loves to feel like 'somebody'. It has ruined their finances and they are struggling in old age as a result though.

At one point my sister was going to sell their house and finance the salvage operation on a sunken ship and it's cargo, all from chatting to some bloke in a pub. I'm sure it's a diagnosable condition.

It doesn't actually address the way your dad is behaving but could you distract him with another project, which he could then get carried away with. You can then say to the cleaner "oh he's changed his mind he's buying a holiday home in Portugal definitely not moving to Poland"?
The other option is head on, with both of them "dad, you're being a bit selfish with Weras time, she loves helping you but please understand she has a terminally ill partner and a job plus normal life going on"
"Wera dad does tend to get over excited and he cant speak Polish plus my mum has vetoed the whole idea so maybe just don't try too hars"
I suspect telling your dad "it won't happen because you're a fantasist" might not work as he will double down and drag it out longer. Ideally distract or guilt trip him into leaving her alone, whilst also heading her off....

It’s harmful because he is using this woman’s time when it sounds like she already has an incredibly busy and stressful life. This woman sounds very kind and she won’t say no because she thinks she is genuinely helping OPs dad, but she’s not, it’s all completely made up and will come to nothing. I can understand the OP feeling responsible when she knows her dad is a time wasting fantasist.

I don’t know how you put up with him OP. You’re right to look out for your cleaner. I would tell her, with examples, what he is like and advise her not to waste her time.

On occasion I can redirect it - he is very mechanically minded so I almost look forward to our car breaking down or needing to buy a new one, because he will spend days weighing up the Honda X v the Volkswagen Y or whatever. That’s not (luckily!) very often though.

Yes, I think this is it. He has been doing this for at least my entire adult life. In theory he could move to Poland/Spain/wherever, but I’ve been through this with him enough times now that I can see the pattern and I know it’s not going to go anywhere. Other people won’t be able to because they don’t know him.

I apologise if this has been mentoned by others ut has your DF ever been diagnosed for Bipolar Disorder?

My BIL is Bipolar and demostrates quite similar behaviour - grand plans, usually involving spending/risking lots of money, often flying somewhere on an absulute whim.

It's exhausting tbh.

Your Dad sounds like something of a barmpot, to be truthful!