MIL wants DD to sleep over - AIBU?

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Next weekend my DH’s step mum has organised a family get together for her partner (my DH’s DF). It’s a big birthday and they’ve only invited a handful of close family, but we will be driving 2.5 hours there with 3 children and 2 of those are under 2. They’ve very kindly paid for us to stay in a hotel for the night with the 2 youngest but here is where the problem is - my MIL is obsessed with my DD sleeping over. The gathering is being held at MIL’s brothers house so him and his wife will be in the house (so no family relation of ours whatsoever, but still lovely people although I can’t say I really KNOW them) and then my DH’s brother is going and he’s taking his son so my DD’s cousin (similar ages and they do really get on)

So I’ve had some issues recently with sleepovers, mainly because of some things that happened to me when I was my DD’s age but also just from becoming more aware and this idea that you can just never be sure about anyone. My DD is 8 and her cousin is nearly 10 and recently if my DH has taken her to stay with his actual mum (so not stepmum) her cousin will want to sleep over and he let them share a double bed knowing that I wasn’t comfortable with it. But basically I’ve said I don’t want them sharing a bed anymore or having sleepovers unless they sleep in their own bedroom. I don’t know if I’m weird for not being comfortable with it but i think it honestly stems from a few things that happened to me when I was a child and I never felt able to tell an adult because I thought I’d get into trouble. I don’t actually think her cousin is doing anything inappropriate but he is very grown up for his age whereas my DD acts a lot younger and I suppose I just worry about children’s games etc. Also, it’s not just the bed sharing with the cousin thing , I just don’t know who exactly is in that house adults wise and I would just rather take her back to the hotel with us! But after I text her saying I would prefer DD to stay at the hotel with us , she rang my DH and basically didn’t accept me saying I didn’t want my DD to have a sleepover at her brothers house - she just kept pushing him to let our DD decide and I could hear her on the phone saying it would be a shame if I didn’t let her sleep over etc and it’s because im worried not because my DD doesn’t want to.

Not to drip feed but there is a bit of a backstory with step MIL basically not appreciating any of my wishes. DD also has severe allergies and there have been a few near misses where she has done silly things like scrape the almond chocolate off a magnum for my daughter and then rinse the ice cream under the tap so it was “no longer nut contaminated” and just generally always wanting things her way and being really weird about my parenting style as she thinks I’m really over protective (she doesn’t have any kids of her own but she always seems to have loads of advice on how to raise my kids so dunno if this feeds into it)
. She has always made me feel really small and kind of backed me into a corner and made me agree to do things her way because I was only 19 when I met her and 20 when I had my DD so I was very young. I’m nearly 30 now so I feel more confident at speaking out when I’m not comfortable with something.. she has never had a sleepover at this set of grandparents house mainly because I never used to trust them with the allergies and they really didn’t take them seriously but now she’s a bit older I do trust them to take her on days out etc but I’m just still not comfortable with a sleepover in a house I’m unfamiliar with and possibly bed sharing with cousin again …so I guess really I just want to know if I’m being unreasonable in not letting her sleep over?

Just say no. No one told me what to do with my children when they were little, and if my wishes offended them, tough. I was always reasonable though, and would discuss with my husband if I needed a second opinion.

She's a risk to your daughter by exposing her to allergens.

She's a risk to your daughter by thinking it's ok for her to share a bed with an older boy. Your husband shares this thinking.

There's a set of people who for whatever reasons don't believe in allergies and try to expose allergic kids to their allergens to prove some kind of stupid point and it doesn't end well for the kid. They're dangerous for the children to be around.

I wouldn't allow her to stay over even with your husband there.

I wouldn't ask your DH to stay with your DD, he clearly can't be trusted to say no to his DSM and will allow your DD to share a bed with the cousin.

A friend of mine was in a very similar situation to you (with very similar personal experience, it sounds like - im so sorry that happened to you) and she ended up exploding at her mother in law (with husband, siblings etc present) 'what would you do if I came to you and told you that [daughter] had told me that [cousin] had been inappropriate with her?'. MIL just went 'but [cousin] would never, how could you say such a thing' and my friend went 'okay, so what about [another cousin] and [husbands] sibling]' or (many other combinations of family members/friends) and MIL just cried and told her she was being horrible.
One of the siblings actually spoke up and said 'so basically if any of our kids got hurt by someone you liked you just wouldn't believe them??' And there was apparently just an awkward silence and it's never been mentioned again... and no more talk of sleepovers either. As you might be able to guess, the sibling that spoke up is the parent of the Golden Grandchild who can do no wrong...

If you’re not happy or feel uneasy about your DD staying with MIL, then you do not have to justify why. The answer is no and unfortunately your MIL will just have to accept it, you’re still attending the meal and your DD will be able to spend time with her cousins but under your supervision.

Also op I think there's a separate conversation to have with your dh here about ensuring he's properly backing you up by him making it clear to his mother that your decisions are made as a team and her asking him will only get her the same answers as asking you.

And I'd also be highlighting that that's a very clear attempt on her part to not only undermine you in general, but to undermine your marriage by trying to create division between you both. That is dangerous and inappropriate behaviour and to be totally honest I'd not have my kids around someone who's willing to do that unsupervised. Especially given the history of her putting your dd at direct risk of a health emergency in order to undermine you.

I wouldn't be comfortable with this either. But probably rather than saying that I'd say "Oh! but as we're staying in a hotel I want us all together as the children will be so excited". Then stick to that with "No, DC are with us, I'm really looking forward to it!" Surely they can't argue with you wanting your own children with you... it's a way round it so you aren't saying you're uncomfortable with them and MILs plans, and no one can argue with a Mum wanting their own kids with them.

NO. God, why do women get like this with other people's children? Controlling behaviour is controlling behaviour, regardless who does it.

Assertiveness techniques:

The three part sentence - I understand that ... However ... Therefore.

"I understand that you want our daughter to sleepover. However, we don't want that. Therefore the answer is no."

She may try to grind you down - going on and on and on, prodding you into coming up with reasons why, knocking them down, criticising you until you cave through exhaustion, so:

Broken record - "As I say, the answer is no. As I say, the answer is no". And keep repeating that, in the same language, no variation that she could seize on and shake. Let her be the one to try to wrangle and twist words.

And go grey rock - saying your no in a dull calm unemotional tone of voice and expression. Upsetting you seems to be her little game. Let her be the one to have the tantrums.

Beware flying monkeys - her sending others to try to wheedle you into it.

And beware undermining tactics - her saying things about you to others behind your back.

Same techniques.

Have your statement to them ready, such as "Sadly MIL has developed something of an obsession with trying to force us into allowing a sleepover. We have told her repeatedly the answer is no but she has chosen to disrespect our wishes. It's a shame but people can become difficult as they get older, can't they!"

Get used to all these techniques and being prepared to deploy them.

Just say "I am teaching my dd about body autonomy, and so the answer is no, thank you." And then firmly move on to another topic.

And if she tries asking your dd if she wants to have a sleepover when you’ve said no, stop her with a very firm ‘I have told you my decision, it’s no, don’t undermine me’, turn away, end of conversation. You need to ensure your Dh is on board before it turns into a tug of war.

Unfortunately the statistics back you up. I wouldn’t explain or give reasons. I would just say no. If you want her to sleepover you should let all 5 of us sleepover. Also is it likely the adults will all be drinking and so less able to provide appropriate supervision. Is the mother of the cousin comfortable with the bed sharing?

Just say no. You don't need to give reasons or justify yourself. It doesn't work for you at the moment.

Oh I love this. Is this part of a particular assertiveness training approach?

Also I want to share that two of my older male cousins tried to get me to take my knickers off When I was little, I was very lucky it didn’t happen on both occasions. I don’t hold with an idea that boys are by nature predatory, but older kids are often more curious/ interested in playing drs and nurses and the consequences of something going wrong are so very severe. Fuck that. Your step mil is being a total shitbag, stand your ground and as others have said, the less you say the better. You don’t have to argue about it.

Stick with what has already been said

"I admit to be slightly confused as to why we are having this conversation, as I said to you before, DD will not be sleeping over. No I dont have to give any reasons why, the answer is no. Please do not bring it up at the party or DD, the other children and I will be leaving straight away."

You’ve said no and the fact your MIL is trying to get around that and get DH to change your mind would bother me. The lack of care around her allergies would be enough reason alone for me to be uncomfortable let alone the bed sharing no matter how innocent. You are her mum and responsible for her and your said no - end of.

No need to justify yourself just say you’re more comfortable with you all staying together and repeat. She can’t make you leave DD with them so don’t let her back you into a corner.

Absolutely not a chance in hell my daughter would be going there, and definitely not to sleep over. Tell your mil it’s creepy how much she’s going on about it and then say nothing. She can whine all she likes.

Your husband should absolutely be the one to say no, not you, it’s his family! Moreover you do not have to give a reason, she is your child. Actually not giving a reason is much better because then they cannot criticize.

Do not let her sleep over.

Your daughter will be grateful when she is older for this.

I'm confused about the wanting to combine a sleepover for the kids with an adult birthday party (might have misread)

Because the obvious thing is to remove an 8 year old from a space where adults are drinking so the conversation can become child-inappropriate and nobody needs to watch how much they're drinking. Would also be obvious to remove the 10 year old for the same reason. Is your daughter wanted basically as entertainment for the 10 year old to facilitate the adult party? If there's enough space in your hotel room you could offer to take him back to the hotel with you and have a similar sort of sleepover (but in separate beds under your supervision).

Otherwise I think you could do with a plan that involves leaving early from the hotel the next day meaning you want all of you to be in one place.

I agree with PP that you shouldn’t start going into a long explanation about your childhood experience and why you feel the way you do. That just starts an argument about not trusting the other grandchild which gets very personal and isn’t fair on him either and may make things awkward in the future. As PP have said, just say “no thank you, we prefer to all be together”.

Your DH is a good person so probably doesn't realise how risky or real the threat can be. Ask him how he'd feel if the cousin did touch DD? Some things are just not worth tempting fate over. I also think that DD is possibly getting to an age where she won't feel comfortable being in nightwear around a boy. That's when kids in school start asking to change for PE separately.

And the allergy thing... You have my total sympathy. My MIL gave peanuts to my 2y/o DC when babysitting for a few hours. Luckily DC isn't allergic! However, I'm convinced that she's given DC what they are allergic to on several occasions or taken risks like your MIL which has resulted in the allergies getting worse or involving acute pain and hospital visits over the years. I'd be wanting to watch her like a hawk.

So what if they think you're over-protective, or unreasonable? Let them! You do not have to give a reason, she's not entitled to one, so don't tie yourself in knots trying to come up with an excuse or convoluted reason. Be pleasantly firm.

I do think it's sad to see a 10 year old boy cousin as a threat, however my neice (7) comes for sleepovers with my son (9) and I wouldn't put them in one bed. Niece gets her own bed on the floor in DS's room and we make sure she has privacy to get into pyjamas at night and then get dressed in the morning with DS out of the room.
If you don't trust mil's judgement then that's fair enough, but I would place the mistrust on mil and not on a 10 year old child.

You are absolutely right to say no to sleepovers, whoever they are with. And you don't need to explain. As a young child playing at a friend's home I witnessed her father in bed with a neighbour. I was six and very confused! It later transpired it was a wife swapping situation, carried on in full view of four young children. I hate to 🤔 what might have happened if I'd stayed the night. I was frightened and didn't say what was happening until years later - my mother was horrified as she'd had no idea.