To think a lot of people earning 6 figures aren’t actually that smart, just lucky?

[SnarkyDenimFox]

I’ve met plenty of high earners and honestly, a lot of them don’t seem any sharper than the rest of us. Right place, right time, right connections. AIBU to think it’s often luck, not talent?

I agree to some extent. My ex had a six figure salary in finance. No GCSE in maths, no degree, no A Levels. Worked his way up from a YTS scheme (remember those) in a bank. Lied on his CV about Maths for next job. The manager liked him and kept taking him to different companies with him. He is retired now at 59.

the person I know who earns this is super intelligent but also lucky in that the company he works for are very pro active in promotions etc. I sometimes look at him and think surely I could have done this, I’m kinda of clever, but I’m just not the same kind of intelligent or driven (which is the big thing here too)

I think this is an old trope rolled out by people who haven't put the effort in. Everyone I know on 6 figures has come from a state school background and not had any privilege, but they have commuted for hours, worked all hours of the day, given up social life and family life, and now they earn the big bucks. Theres definitely some luck in there but you don't get to earn 6 figures without a lot more commitment than your average worker puts in. It lazy to put it down to being privileged. You could have got there if you had made the effort. Anyone can

@DashboardConfession did you buy many years ago out of interest - I’m in Bath admittedly which is expensive but it’s not that cheap 20 miles in any direction from here - my friend bought 5 years ago and her mortgage is well over£2k on quite an average house

This is the elephant in the room.

It’s a dead elephant because the facts about social mobility give it the lie. People born into poverty generally stay poor and fewer and fewer of them make it out. High five to those who do but you’re a tiny minority. The vast majority of people earning big bucks come from big bucks. End of. I’m affluent myself so not bitter or anything but facts is facts. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/sep/07/social-mobility-uk-worst-50-years-report-finds

There's a great deal to agree with here.

Back in my 20s, I was out of the house at 6.45 and in work at 7.30, I left at 7/7.30. DH had to work in London, his Bar remains London centric. He was always out if the himself at 6.45, sometimes earlier and rarely home before 9.30. DH went to the local comp, as did many of our friends. They are mostly RG uni educated.

When I had youngish DC and work sponsored my professional quals, for a couple of years I got up at 5am Mon-Thursday to get the studying done.

In my 20s contemporaries rolled their eyes and tutted. In my 40s school gate muns rolled their eyes and tutted. Both groups 10 years on told me I'd been sooooo lucky. Er no, when they were backpacking in the Antipodes or playing tennis, I was working.

@RosesAndHelleboresyes I think there is. I’m lowish six figures and broadly coasting now with a toddler and a baby. My contemporaries who have overtaken me from a similar starting point (mostly working class/normal backgrounds/state school) have done multiple extra qualifications like CFA, which involved long hours studying around long hours at work with a high failure rate. And they have set their own teams up in a more high risk high reward strategy. I haven’t, and can clearly see that’s why I’m just staying still. But I’m happy with that at this point and it’s my trade off for having more flexibility and less stress.

I have other friends who have selected jobs that are more interesting, less pressure, lower hours. They are happy and they enjoy their jobs, and that’s their trade off.

It’s dependent on lots of factors: hard work, right place right time, the sector, your colleagues, hiring managers, if you’re in corporate life how much you “play the game”.

There are SLT in large schools on those salaries now who many other teachers say aren’t very good. Meanwhile there are barristers on six figures who work incredibly hard, are very knowledgable and ferociously intelligent: you can’t fake that.

And yes on the barristers. I did a law degree and those who went the barrister route had it very tough. They were paid about £20k pa then about 15 years ago for a pupillage (about the same as an entry level admin job at the time in London), where they worked around the clock, sometimes sleeping in Chambers, just to compete for a place in Chambers. They’d take on five pupils each intake, and only keep one or maybe two. The work was hard, up early and travelling to regional courts and preparing briefs they hadn’t seen before on the way, plus all grunt work and research for the other barristers. I couldn’t have done that. They deserve the money

@RosesAndHellebores yep - my H has an ‘old friend’ ( who he no longer sees) who has done next to no work since he was 18 , he is now 63 . Claimed benefits all the way through on mental health issues - the only mental health issues he has isa massive chip on his shoulder, a belief that work is for the bourgeoise and unless it’s something he ‘wants’ to do he isn’t doing it . He is far more ‘intelligent’ on paper than my husband - He’s still in his home town, sat around the precinct- pretending he’s a journalist when he has never done more than 5 pieces of commissioned work. - when we set up our business in 2003 it got written about a fair bit and this guy called my H and said ‘I’ve seen your name on things, you’ve landed on your feet ‘alright for some’ - at the time we had taken a big risk , £25k business loan , had a young son and my H was working full time for 2 years in 1 job and building the business up on evenings and weekends, as was I . The friend spoke as if it just ‘dropped in his lap’ - some people just do t get that for a lot of higher level jobs it involves years of going the e tra mike, be it study or work - not all I know, there’s a bit ofnepotism at play in some sectors where the not very bright or able (but well connected or even related ) get parachuted in but I do feel that’s very much the minority.

Haha. There you go then - he did. He got that role under his belt and then got whatever he is doing now.

2013. Is that many years ago? My town was certainly cheaper then. But I also live in a 4 bed townhouse and not a detached which run to about £450k here these days.

It would be busting a gut for me to go to London. I didn't separate the commute and the effort in my post. I know three local families with a parent who does this for the salary, that's all.

I think whichever way you look at, it takes hard work and some people are more prepared to put the work in than others.

It applies in all walks of life, not just earnings. I go to a barre class regularly and some people give up each move after a few reps while others push through the burn to get stronger / more toned. My favourite instructor always says “it’s supposed to feel uncomfortable” which I have to remind myself when I’m almost dying mid-class. You won’t see results if you don’t put the work in. Anyway, that was a roundabout way of saying, there’s no such thing as a free lunch!

Completely separate point, but the backpacking thing might be generational. I’m a millennial and all my high earning / successful friends and I did a gap year, backpacking and partying our way around South America / South East Asia / Australia. So having backpacked in your 20s and putting the crazy hours in at the start of your career are certainly not mutually exclusive!

@crushed23 lots of my contemporaries had gap years, either at 18 or 21, as indeed did my DC. I was referring more to 20 somethings in the 80s who gapped and regapped.

@RosesAndHellebores I employed a lovely young woman aged around 26 many years ago, she had been in work 3 years and was honest that she was only working again for 18 months so she could go travelling again for 2 years - whilst I can understand the desire - your CV starts to look really shit when you have little on it before 32 because an awful lot of it has been travelling - which unless you are a travel blogger or writer making money at it doesn’t really constitute a career as others will see it.

Ah okay, I see what you and @RosesAndHelleboresmean. The stop-start career to fund multiple gap years. That’s completely different than having taken one gap year in your 20s which, as I say, most of my friends and I did, before knuckling down and working crazy hours in the City.

I must admit that I am plotting a 4-month sabbatical to go travelling in the next couple of years though (when I will be late 30s…), so DP and I can meet some travel goals before having a baby, but I’m hoping that’s an acceptable gap in the CV!

yes thats another thing no one has mentioned. people have to trust you.

@Crushed23 ah that’s no issue - but seriously 3 years work - 4 years travelling by early 30s as an employer to me was a big red flag —as I say I understand the desire but can’t be arsed to pay recruitment fees etc on people who are just ‘filling in’

It's luck and the fact that the system doesn't reward large parts of the job market.

Plenty of people work hard, are dedicated and are smart with stressful jobs but they're working for a local authority or an environmental charity, or in the arts.

A pinch of luck (where you were born, natural smarts, family money); a lot of graft (for most); and the tenacity / gumption to back yourself (move for opportunity, push for promotion).

I think what’s often missing too is the working conditions for high fixed salaries. By the time you factor in 50+hr weeks, work on weekends, travel for work, plus risk of redundancy or working for commission /bonus, etc it starts to appear less appealing…

Part of it is about being willing to put your head on the line. My boss could go to prison if we get what we do wrong.

The more you get paid the less secure your job is as well.

Most people I know in top jobs don’t actually know the nuts and bolts of the company, their job is to make decisions that affect thousands of people. If they get it wrong they may never be able to get a job above minimum wage again.

@Atina321 a lot of truth in that - a household name company I know was basically getting rid of all the £65k to £100k long timers - not because their jobs were not necessary either, purely to make figures look good ( plc) shortly after that quarters figures a fair old bunch hired back as freelance consultants , because they couldn’t actually function effectively without them

My sibling earns 6 figures and is as dumb as rocks and horribly mean too. But he thinks the sun shines out of his behind because he earns over 100k. Even then I wouldn’t say it was luck that got him there but strategy. He found an easy niche tech career that can only exist in the civil service / local government (strategic programme mananagement of individual web page development) and moved around as a contractor. He went from £40k to £150k in just 5 years and all he does is develop one .gov.uk page a year. AI can’t come for government jobs fast enough in my opinion lol.