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Thread 15: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film?

1000 replies

DisappointedReader · 14/08/2025 10:52

The Observer's original exposé: The real Salt Path: how a blockbuster book and film were ...

The 14 Observer items currently available on their online 'The real Salt Path' page: The real Salt Path | The Observer

4 more from The Observer:
‘Hope is extinguished’: CBD patients respond to Salt Path...

The real Salt Path | The Observer (The Slow Newscast)

(Live/online event)

The Observer YouTube Channel: The Observer UK - YouTube

Raynor Winn/Sally Walker's statement: Raynor Winn

Thread One ^www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5368194-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?^

Threads 2-11: Links all in the OP of Thread 12

Thread 12: www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5384574-thread-12-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?

Thread 13: www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5386458-thread-13-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?

Thread 14: www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5388981-thread-14-to-feel-disappointed-after-reading-this-in-the-observer-about-the-author-and-her-husband-from-the-salt-path-book-and-film?

New posters joining us in the genuine spirit of our civil discourse welcome. It would be helpful to get the background from at least some of the Observer items above before posting. There are currently a number of interesting items on The Observer website and linked to above.

To all - Please be extremely cautious when it comes to naming or implicating people and addresses not in the public eye or with no direct connection to the story, and around the understandable health speculations, especially where details are unclear or still emerging. Remember, even Hollywood rabbits attract the odd flea. Please do not engage with visitors who seem to have their own agenda and seek to derail. Avoid @'ing and quoting them as - from experience - this will only encourage them back to the threads. We have done amazingly well together for fourteen very interesting, very serious and very silly threads so far. I can't be here as much as I'd like so all help with keeping our discussion walking along in our usual reasonable and respectful fashion is very welcome.

#Pinchofsaltpath
#Fudge
#Cider
#OurChloe
#OurSimon
#Correspondents
#Salray
#Timmoth
#MistakesWereMade
#EmbellishedBollox
#JustBollox
#DriveByScolding
#Glumwashing
#ThereBeSharks
#Scones
#NakedHikers
#TurquoiseGString
#BudleighSalterton
#SallyForth
#YesItReallyIsThread15
#Rabbits

Keep to the path. No saltiness. May the fudge be with you.

The real Salt Path: how a blockbuster book and film were ...

The real Salt Path: how a blockbuster book and film were ...

Penniless and homeless, the Winns found fame and fortune with the story of their 630-mile walk to salvation. We can reveal that the truth behind it is ve...

https://observer.co.uk/news/national/article/the-real-salt-path-how-the-couple-behind-a-bestseller-left-a-trail-of-debt-and-deceit

OP posts:
Thread gallery
59
Uricon2 · 16/08/2025 13:41

I'm not a correspondent (sob) Could I be Correspondent for the Poet Laureate? It has a really nice ring and I'm v happy to share the position with anyone else who wants.

Credentials

a) I've read 2 of his books and ever so many of his poems

b) I actually could distinguish him from Mothtim in a lineup.

SunlitUpland · 16/08/2025 13:45

TheBrandyPath · 16/08/2025 13:24

@SunlitUpland contested non-fiction books like Jon Krakauer’s Into Thin Air

Thanks, I didn't know about this. It reminded me of the docudrama of Touching the Void - which I thought was very good. Joe Simpson wrote the book to address the criticism of his climbing partner, the end of the film had criticisms of Yates - so yes different viewpoints, and quite circular.

I think the above are well documented tragedies, though, Now the tragic backstories have been questioned, the walk did not happen when she says, they did not complete it - as she says - TSP doesn't have much to offer?

I think the issue in part is that the Raynor Winn brand is proving more durable than originally anticipated — TSP was huge, and enough people wanted to know what happened next to buy the oddly piecemeal and bolted together TWS, and by LL, the successful formula had been established: Moth-related health jeopardy, a walk, communing with nature combined with occasional moments of hardship or mild danger, and strangely grumpy ‘Voice of Middle England’ asides on ill-fitting boots, Scottish independence, broken stoves, Covid, geology, intensive agriculture, other hikers etc. Walk-on parts for Dave and Julie.

People read ‘adventure’ non-fiction for the story of a disastrous Everest expedition or whatever. Quite often (though not always) those are ghostwritten one-off books ‘written’ by people involved, who may not think of themselves as writers, and who may never write another book, or not unless they’re involved in another expedition or disaster. (Also skews strongly male in readership, whereas one imagines the RW books skew strongly female and sell to people who read fiction as much as or more than they read non-fiction.)

Whereas RW is a ‘brand’ that has outlasted the original ‘book with a hook’. I think that makes her a different proposition.

Catwith69lives · 16/08/2025 13:54

SunlitUpland · 16/08/2025 13:45

I think the issue in part is that the Raynor Winn brand is proving more durable than originally anticipated — TSP was huge, and enough people wanted to know what happened next to buy the oddly piecemeal and bolted together TWS, and by LL, the successful formula had been established: Moth-related health jeopardy, a walk, communing with nature combined with occasional moments of hardship or mild danger, and strangely grumpy ‘Voice of Middle England’ asides on ill-fitting boots, Scottish independence, broken stoves, Covid, geology, intensive agriculture, other hikers etc. Walk-on parts for Dave and Julie.

People read ‘adventure’ non-fiction for the story of a disastrous Everest expedition or whatever. Quite often (though not always) those are ghostwritten one-off books ‘written’ by people involved, who may not think of themselves as writers, and who may never write another book, or not unless they’re involved in another expedition or disaster. (Also skews strongly male in readership, whereas one imagines the RW books skew strongly female and sell to people who read fiction as much as or more than they read non-fiction.)

Whereas RW is a ‘brand’ that has outlasted the original ‘book with a hook’. I think that makes her a different proposition.

Edited

The RW brand

Thread 15: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film?
cricketandwhodunnits · 16/08/2025 13:59

Vroomfondleswaistcoat · 16/08/2025 13:37

You see, you demonstrate your foreignness by using the 'ey up' greeting. Here it is a stern address of 'now then,' leaving you quaking in your boots while you wait to find out what you are about to receive a drive-by scolding for. We do not 'eh up' round here.

And do not get me started on 'hast tha got a pen, then?'

One does not simply walk into North Yorkshire...

onlyinitforthefudge · 16/08/2025 13:59

Catwith69lives · 16/08/2025 13:54

The RW brand

Gosh, Angela Harding has been well and truly Raymothed there.

SunlitUpland · 16/08/2025 14:01

Where is that, @Catwith69lives? Stationery, keep cups, coasters? Or are they cards? Fascinating.

I know the brand is partly AH’s cover images, but I think there’s a wide Middle England appeal.

TheBrandyPath · 16/08/2025 14:01

@SunlitUpland Whereas RW is a ‘brand’ that has outlasted the original ‘book with a hook’. I think that makes her a different proposition.

The moral of “The Salt Path”, an embellished bestseller
The truth will catch up with you, but will readers want to hear it?

Sorry didn't realise the paywall - maybe later

Raynor Winn, Moth Winn, Gillian Anderson and Jason Isaacs attend the London Special Screening of "The Salt Path" at the Curzon Soho on May 22, 2025 in London, England

The moral of “The Salt Path”, an embellished bestseller 

The truth will catch up with you, but will readers want to hear it?

https://www.economist.com/britain/2025/08/16/the-moral-of-the-salt-path-an-embellished-bestseller

HatStickBoots · 16/08/2025 14:06

Catwith69lives · 16/08/2025 13:54

The RW brand

Oh gosh…. That’s awful for Angela Harding… this is her art. I’m upset by this. The contrast between her and the reality of SW is remarkable. SW does not deserve Angela Harding.

onlyinitforthefudge · 16/08/2025 14:07

SunlitUpland · 16/08/2025 14:01

Where is that, @Catwith69lives? Stationery, keep cups, coasters? Or are they cards? Fascinating.

I know the brand is partly AH’s cover images, but I think there’s a wide Middle England appeal.

AH does some lovely things, I got a water bottle for my birthday https://angelaharding.co.uk/collections/home-lifestyle. She has removed all trace of TSP from her website now.

Home & Lifestyle

https://angelaharding.co.uk/collections/home-lifestyle

HatStickBoots · 16/08/2025 14:09

Angela Harding isn’t even credited as the artist on that place card asking us to “celebrate the prize winning author…” 😖

mauvishagain · 16/08/2025 14:09

Uricon2 · 16/08/2025 13:41

I'm not a correspondent (sob) Could I be Correspondent for the Poet Laureate? It has a really nice ring and I'm v happy to share the position with anyone else who wants.

Credentials

a) I've read 2 of his books and ever so many of his poems

b) I actually could distinguish him from Mothtim in a lineup.

Mine is not the final day, but that sounds like a shoe-in to me!

Cornishwafer · 16/08/2025 14:10

Catwith69lives · 16/08/2025 13:54

The RW brand

Urgh! Would SW get a cut of this merchandise...there are even salt path bookmarks in Waterstones.
Was the cover of tsp commissioned or did the artwork exist by that name prior to publication of the book?

FurryHappyKittens · 16/08/2025 14:11

I knew Angela Harding's mum. She was so immensely proud of her daughter, and I'm glad she isn't here to see all this unfold. She would have been so upset on Angela's behalf.

I'm also glad there was no prevarication from Angela regarding the revelations, or on changing the name to the Cornish Path range.

HatStickBoots · 16/08/2025 14:12

I wonder if she could ask to have her artwork retracted from OWH or if she’s legally bound not to be able to? She has already hopefully been paid for producing the artwork but does she retain the rights to it?

cricketandwhodunnits · 16/08/2025 14:13

Uricon2 · 16/08/2025 13:41

I'm not a correspondent (sob) Could I be Correspondent for the Poet Laureate? It has a really nice ring and I'm v happy to share the position with anyone else who wants.

Credentials

a) I've read 2 of his books and ever so many of his poems

b) I actually could distinguish him from Mothtim in a lineup.

Sounds great. And the Poet Laureate of course is a West Yorkshireman! Unlike Big Northern Dave Like.

Uricon2 · 16/08/2025 14:13

HatStickBoots · 16/08/2025 14:09

Angela Harding isn’t even credited as the artist on that place card asking us to “celebrate the prize winning author…” 😖

Her work is lovely and stands on its own merits, so hopefully the association will have done her no harm. I think the inital success of the book may have been much helped by the wonderful cover art (PRH played a blinder there, at least)

HatStickBoots · 16/08/2025 14:28

Uricon2 · 16/08/2025 13:41

I'm not a correspondent (sob) Could I be Correspondent for the Poet Laureate? It has a really nice ring and I'm v happy to share the position with anyone else who wants.

Credentials

a) I've read 2 of his books and ever so many of his poems

b) I actually could distinguish him from Mothtim in a lineup.

Fellow fan here!
Some time ago, before the big reveal, there was an article somewhere in some online news or magazine which was about “RW talking about (this and that) and on finally meeting the real Simon Armitage.” Like everything else I’ve tried to search for since, I can’t find this and it’s so frustrating. I didn’t read it at the time, thinking I would later but it doesn’t matter what key words I use, I can’t get it and am wondering if it’s another article taken down.

Catwith69lives · 16/08/2025 14:35

Uricon2 · 16/08/2025 14:13

Her work is lovely and stands on its own merits, so hopefully the association will have done her no harm. I think the inital success of the book may have been much helped by the wonderful cover art (PRH played a blinder there, at least)

What do we do when this thread comes to an end?

Well there is always an AH 1,000 piece Salt Path jigsaw puzzle to while away the hours!

Thread 15: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film?
Uricon2 · 16/08/2025 14:38

HatStickBoots · 16/08/2025 14:28

Fellow fan here!
Some time ago, before the big reveal, there was an article somewhere in some online news or magazine which was about “RW talking about (this and that) and on finally meeting the real Simon Armitage.” Like everything else I’ve tried to search for since, I can’t find this and it’s so frustrating. I didn’t read it at the time, thinking I would later but it doesn’t matter what key words I use, I can’t get it and am wondering if it’s another article taken down.

Oh how frustrating @HatStickBoots , that would be an interesting read. Not unlikely it's been taken down I suppose (and you wonder what else has been quietly edited out of existence now)

Catwith69lives · 16/08/2025 14:40

Not sure if this has been posted yet!

Thread 15: To feel disappointed after reading this in The Observer about the author and her husband from The Salt Path book and film?
SunlitUpland · 16/08/2025 14:44

Surely someone is now penning a Kafka-esque sketch where Simon Armitage is puzzled by the fact that keeps getting turned away from restaurants, is excoriated by passersby and cut from literary festivals, and keeps receiving emails from bookshop owners reporting defacement of his books with ENJOY YOUR ILL-GOTTEN GAINS, YOU FAKER!

HatStickBoots · 16/08/2025 15:08

Uricon2 · 16/08/2025 14:38

Oh how frustrating @HatStickBoots , that would be an interesting read. Not unlikely it's been taken down I suppose (and you wonder what else has been quietly edited out of existence now)

I’d love to know his thoughts on meeting them!
All this stuff that has ended up on the virtual ‘cutting room floor’. Nothing to see here! Any more….

HatStickBoots · 16/08/2025 15:11

@Catwith69lives 😲
@SunlitUpland 😱😅

BlueHorses · 16/08/2025 15:14

TheBrandyPath · 16/08/2025 14:01

@SunlitUpland Whereas RW is a ‘brand’ that has outlasted the original ‘book with a hook’. I think that makes her a different proposition.

The moral of “The Salt Path”, an embellished bestseller
The truth will catch up with you, but will readers want to hear it?

Sorry didn't realise the paywall - maybe later

Edited

You can read one article by creating a free account.

It doesn't tell us anything new, but is in parts quite funny and I agree with the journalist's contention that part of TSP's appeal to Middle England is down to how much of a moanfest it is, under the guise of it being 'feelgood' and 'uplifting', and that some people don't care whether or not it's true.

The journey begins with a climb out of Minehead. It is “excruciatingly steep”, says Ms Winn, leaving her with a “huge blister two inches across”, which soon halts progress. There are many grassy spots but, inexplicably, the duo decide to pitch their tent on heather (like “lying in the fork drawer”). Ms Winn’s thin sleeping bag is “bone-aching cold”. Moth’s pills mean he doesn’t want to have sex. He snores.

The adjective most often applied to “The Salt Path” is “uplifting”. Yet what strikes the reader most is constant grumbling, which surely accounts for part of the book’s success. In “The Wild Places”, Robert Macfarlane, perhaps Britain’s finest naturalist writer, happily nestles down in his bivouac with some cheese and rye bread for dinner; a few sonnets are enough to keep him warm. The book sold around 100,000 copies. Ms Winn’s moan-fest sold 2m and was translated into 25 languages. Its message: you too could be redeemed by nature, even if you find it annoying.

Ms Winn finds everything annoying. Slights, perceived or imagined, seem to lurk around every corner. After making it down to Bossington—a pretty descent that Ms Winn spends mulling whether she dislikes uphills or downhills more—the couple stop for a cream tea they can’t afford. Here they admit to a family that they are homeless, whereupon “the man reached out and pulled his child towards him and the wife winced and looked away.” Ms Winn finds such pathos in this scene that she repeats it twice later, almost word for word. Elsewhere, complete strangers call the couple “disgusting”.

The journalist walks (or claims to walk Grin) the first 30 km of the SWCP, gauges local people's response to both the book and the allegations, and points out that a memoir is subject to far less fact-checking than a reputable newspaper's journalism:

A few miles on, in Porlock, locals have mixed views. “It’s all a load of old nonsense isn’t it,” says Lesley Thompson, buying her morning paper in SPAR. Her main gripe is that a scene in the film featuring a local beach has led to streams of confused tourists looking for a path that does not exist. Paul McGee, the owner of The Lorna Doone Hotel, is more chipper, crediting Ms Winn with a slight uptick in business. Next year he expects a surge, when Ms Anderson’s fans stream over from America.

One question raised by the scandal is whether publishers should be more sceptical. Climbing the hill out of Porlock, the Winns encounter a blind man practising yoga on the path, who catches them up at a picturesque church. “We’re just walking the path,” they tell him. “You are, and you’ll travel many miles,” the blind man replies. “You’ll see many things, amazing things, and suffer many setbacks,” the blind man continues, before laying his hand on Moth’s. “But you will overcome them, you’ll survive, and it will make you strong.”

Perhaps one far-fetched scene could be overlooked (“I’ve been in that church many times and I’ve never been spoken to by any blind man,” says Tony Richards, the church warden). But most of the reported speech in the book sounds like a Hollywood script rather than real life. Industry figures have noted that many publishers have no fact-checkers. A book billed as a “true story” is subject to far less scrutiny than this article.

The article references James Frey and his excuse, in subsequent editions of A Million Little Pieces (later marketed as a novel) that he was writing' about the person I had created in my mind':

Ms Winn insists her book is true and says she “can’t allow any more doubt to be cast on the validity of those memories”. But it will be, in part because the scandal itself is such a good story. “The Salt Path” is a morality play in which the protagonists—homeless, dying, poor—endure a callous world, indifferent to their suffering. Not only does that tale now appear fabricated, it has caused suffering of its own, including to CBS patients who took false hope from Moth’s recovery.

What, then, is the moral of this story? It could be, as Ms Winn would put it, the power of keeping going. The journey has brought her riches, though it seems unlikely she will be counting her good fortune. Perhaps it is that the truth will always catch up with you. Yet Ms Winn’s book will remain in print; while some readers are angry, others seem not to mind. “I’ve heard all that stuff and I don’t care,” says a woman inspired to walk the trail, a few miles before Lymouth. “It’s about the theory.”

toooom · 16/08/2025 15:16

Ive been listening to some of the podcasts etc people have been linking to here.

I think for me the problem isn’t so much the books are to be taken with a pinch of salt, it is that the timeline and story is trotted out in all of the interviews. It is understandable IMO to take some liberties with times and dates and characters for the greater literary good in a book (and I think the unflinchingly honest bit is probably marketing speak for the discussions of toilet habits and food rather than speaking to the 100% truth of the timeline etc). But in a podcast or show (like that walking one on the BBC that someone linked to on FB\YT) the same lines are trotted out verbatim and that for me is the lie and the issue with the lie. That was where it was the time to point out the indolent nature of the diagnosis or that it happened at a similar time but not of course the same week. Etc. but she always doubles down on the timings and that is the con. That and the deliberate obfuscation around names and locations.

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