To think it's okay to shoot horses?

[Angels1111]

I've always been vegetarian but I'm not sanctimonious about it. The way I see it, as my family was vegetarian it wasn't a conscious choice I made. Who knows what I'd be doing if I had been born into a family eating meat and two veg every day. I also have huge space to improve my environmental footprint...the clothes I wear have probably been stitched by kids working long hours, I don't always remember to take a bag with me to the shops, quite a lot of my diet is imported...etc..
My point is, unless we're living off the land and making our own clothes we're all affecting the environment and we can all improve where we can reduce our impact on it.

All that to say....I was watching a show with some friends about how race horses, once past their point of use, are often shot. This was accompanied by protests of "that's so sad, so cruel" etc.

I wondered how it's any different to raising a pig for food and killing it once it's fat enough. Or a chicken for eggs and killing it once it doesn't lay eggs. To me, the horse may even have had a better life than animals raised for meat, since there is an onus on the owner to make sure it's well fed and kept healthy.

Of course, ideally I'd like the horse to live out it's natural life in retirement. I'd like all animals to live out their natural lives. But I can see why that might not be feasible for the owner.

I really don't understand why some animals are okay to eat, but others aren't. Why is okay to eat pig but not dog? Why chicken but not parrot? Why cow but not horse?

Please could you educate me?

You are naive! Geldings can hardly go to stud!

I wish we had that option. I'd far prefer to be shot when the time came. No waiting around in hospital in pain to breathe your last breath. None of that assisted suicide slow chemical stuff. Just bang, dead.

The UK is one of the larger exporters of horse meat to the EU so it must be coming from somewhere.

I would be happy to eat the meat of any grazing animal, so horse, cow, deer etc. but I don't like eating pigs, cats or dogs because they eat meat and somehow that feels wrong.

I do think there is a huge misunderstanding about the sustainability of meat that needs to be addressed. I know several vegans who eat ultra-processed food from the supermarket but claim their veganism is a more sustainable alternative - it's not! Think of all the rain forests that have been replaced with cultivated land to feed the masses. The most sustainable meat in the UK is wild venison, probably followed by lamb from the Wales - nothing but grass can grow up on the mountains, but the sheep and deer convert grass to meat.

We shouldn’t get to pick and choose which animals we deem acceptable to treat badly/keep in poor conditions/torture/kill.

They are all equal and worthy.

Evidential the last butcher officially selling horse meat in UK was in 1955
For context food rationing occurred in UK from 1940 to 1954 & there are pealive now who lived through these times.

I have also travelled abroad & seen horse meat butchers & horse on the menu

I live near a zoo & horse meat is fed to the carnivours

Personally, I would not eat horse, but war can change things

You can tell how intelligent the different animals are and judge whether they are ok for food

People will say dogs and cats are pets, but really it all boils down to being inefficient to eat carnivores. Grazing animals consume grass etc, which we can't eat, and convert it to meat, which we can. We can use marginal land that won't grow food crops and still gain food from it.

It makes no sense to eat animals that need a meat diet. Their prey would often be edible to us, or we would need to source meat for them, making it inefficient. Instead we used cats to get rid of vermin eating the winter cereal stores and dogs for hunting and protection. Over the years that morphed into keeping them as pets.

I’ve both owned horses and been vegetarian for decades, and been vegan for the last few years. And I don’t disagree with your logic at all.
But people are very defensive about their choice to eat meat and rationalise it in strange ways.
The argument I have seen trotted out here about plant based diets destroying habits is bizarre, when the vast majority of the worlds soy production for example is used to feed livestock.

75-80% of the global soy crop is used for livestock feed. So let’s be realistic about vegans destroying the planet.

We can all try to make sustainable choices, but raising livestock by its very nature is going to require more land use than growing and eating crops directly.

I don't think you have to reason it out. Ask yourself if it is wrong or not that's it

@Brbreeze I did state that I only eat grazing animals - I do avoid factory farmed ones which is where the soy crop goes. I actively avoid imported foodstuffs when feeding my own animals or myself.

I am going dairy free this week and will be buying almond milk. I care less about the environment than animal suffering in the dairy industry

There is a secondary market for ex racehorses but they need to be retrained first to be safe for the average hobby rider. The racing industry has lots of flaws but professional retraining centres are now properly funded as a % of race prize money is reserved for this purpose. There is also a register of non-racing agreements so that a horse given away or sold for a few hundred as unsound or unsuitable for racing can't make a reappearance without the consent of the previous owner.

Horses that severely fracture a limb can't be kept in traction so it's kinder to euthanise them a.s.a.p. There are some countries where the permission of the owner needs to be given but luckily UK allows on-course specialist veterinarians to act immediately in the animal's best interests.

I have worked on a farm where one half of the owning couple rehabilitated race horses. Upon arrival, they were very highly-strung and neurotic. None were ever shot, but they were quite hard work (because of their previous lifestyle) and unsuitable for pet pony homes. Thus, while I personally disagree with horse racing, any 'unsafe' animal would be shot for health and safety reasons.

I still work in farming. Our cows do not eat 'rubbish'. When they are calves, they have milk, straw and specially-formulated calf nuts which are designed to meet their nutritional need. When they're a bit older, they swap the milk for water and straw for silage (fermented grass). This is usually in the winter months, when the ground is too wet and muddy for them to be out (seriously, they shelter by the hedges and bawl to come in as they do not like wet, windy weather), and also because the ground becomes 'poached'. Silage is also given in periods of low rainfall, when the grass doesn't grow very well. We keep them outside on grass as much as possible. We keep mainly dairy cows, which are kept for as long as possible, and in any case, their meat would go for cheaper cuts (e.g. pet meat, mince, burgers, etc). The more expensive beef cuts are from beef cattle (e.g. Belgian Blues or Limousins), which have muscling and fat marbling that is better suited for the meat industry.

If farmers stopped farming and released their livestock, then they would become wild (and potentially dangerous) vermin. Cows are quite large animals and non-farming folk often find them terrifying.

Some countries eat horse meat. It used to be common in the UK, but probably fell out of fashion at some point, like rabbit meat. Rabbits were possibly considered to be 'cute and fluffy' and non-working horses are very expensive pets (or field ornaments...). Cows, sheep, chickens, etc. are not generally seen as being cute, fluffy or as good pets, and milk, wool, meat and eggs are good by-products.

Personally, I'd rather stick to a more natural diet of eating meat, fish, pulses, fruits and vegetables than UPFs. Also, milk is one of the most perfect things to consume, as it contains small amounts of all minerals and vitamins apart from iron and vitamin B. If I could have a viable smallholding, I would, but at the moment, it's not economically viable.

They need to spend time feral as a kitten to learn from the mum. Even well domesticated cats will catch a mouse but only the ones raised feral will be ratters.

We have 2 working cats. 1 completely feral - can't touch her , the other is more confident around people - you can touch her but not luck her up. Both great workers. Feed barns are mouse free & both have been known to catch rats too.

They still sleep more than half the time though - that's just cats for you.

I think a house cat who wants to will catch a rat. I’ve had ones do it. But only a ratter raised to do it will eat them.

Soy? If so , you’re wrong

wwf.panda.org/discover/our_focus/food_practice/sustainable_production/soy/

Mine carries small teddy bears in his mouth and recently a stress ball was carried upstairs when my son was having a stressful night unable to sleep it was amusing and definitely worth a tin of whiskers