Strange comments about the U.K.

[Lessando]

I often just read threads without posting. But I read one thread on here recently that made me think, and I wanted to start a new thread about it.

There was a thread on here a while ago, it was titled "Do you feel lucky in life".

About one hundred posters came on and wrote a similiar thing, they all wrote

"Oh yes I am so lucky to have been born in the U.K." and they wrote things like

"I won the lottery of life by being born in the UK"

I was surprised at the fawning over the top comments, because they are in stark contrast to how I have experienced living in other countries. Living conditions in many other countries seem to me to be a lot better than living conditions in the UK.

I have lived in other countries and right now I am living in the UK for a year . Don't get me wrong , there are things that are nice about the UK.

What I really wanted to discuss is why do some people in the UK seem to think it is the best country in the world.
But, if you go outside of the UK, a lot of media outlets talk about the UK in a very negative way. Do people know this happesn?

So many other countries are doing better economically than the UK is. Living conditions are better. The last EU country that i lived in, i barely saw a homeless person.

In my current city in the UK, homeless people come up to me and ask me for money all the time. Every single day.

I lived in an EU country last year. The media outside of the UK always reports negatively about the UK. They usually say that the UK is a very bad place to live, especially after Brexit.

Im not really saying if I personally think the UK is good or bad, obviously I am just one person.

I more wanted to discuss the discrepancy between many people in the UK thinking it is the best country in the world and they are lucky to live there, and the media outside the UK who report that the UK is a terrible place to live in.
Any thoughts on it?

@Applesonthelawn
EU media love negativity about UK especially since Brexit but it's just managing the masses

This.

The OP seems to be comparing the UK to the EU, and forgetting about the rest of the world.

Having grown up in the UK and then lived in different countries, I get your perspective OP, and I admit I've wondered about the British "We're the bestest xoxo" attitude as well before, especially as it's such a strong contrast to what's making headlines abroad when it comes to the UK.

Some international press (not serious outlets, but more like the local Daily Mail equivalents) tend to describe post-Brexit Britain as a dystopian hellhole with horrible salaries, crumbling services, non existent healthcare and where generally speaking literally everything is failing and falling apart and there's no point even living there. Which is obviously bs. Granted, the country isn't in its best state ever and the times of Cool Britannia are long gone, but neither is the rest of the West. Most of the critique against the UK could also be raised against other western countries.

On the other hand, those stories live on and are "clickable" because there is some truth to it: the UK today isn't necessarily a bad place to live, but the reason you see these articles in the media is that most people writing them belong to the generation that grew up during the 90s and early 00s, probably the most economically healthy and culturally influential the UK has been in the last 50 years. I could write an essay on this, but to cut a long story short, in 2010 the UK gov's fiscal policy shifted drastically from one of investment and wealth creation to austerity and spending cuts, and public services like the NHS, transport infrastructure and many others (dental services, care homes, the BBC) were slowly but surely eroded to the point where they ceased functioning effectively. Which is a stark contrast to the time before the rule of austerity. Don't even get me started on the NHS... If you've experienced healthcare in any other European country, you look back on it with horror.

In addition to this, while minimum wage and top end executive salaries have increased, there has been huge wage stagnation for middle earners in the last 15 or so years. For example, I graduated in 2007 and got a job. In 2023 that job was listed with the exact same salary. Obviously rents, utilities, food - everything else has inflated considerably except people's incomes. There's a general sense that the country is moving backwards, especially after Brexit.

Again, I know a lot of people who live in the UK and are happy and there is still opportunity. But there is a tangible feeling that the country is regressing and that every year the gap in prosperity between the UK and the rest of the anglosphere is widening, which feeds those stories in the media.

Bottom line, I think people are a bit unfair against the UK and I can sort of see why, I also get the gloomy sentiment because when you're constantly bombarded with negative news it's hard to stay positive. But to be honest with you, if I were a young professional and barring VISA issues, the UK would still be close to the top of my list because it's still such a fun place to be and there's still lots of growth opportunities if you know where to look IMHO.

The UK obviously isn't perfect but then nowhere is.

I like: that we don't have extremes of climate or politics; that we have a developed economy; that we don't have very many guns; that we have decent engineering knowledge; that we have good writers; that we have the BBC.

I dislike: that we still have royalty and aristocracy; that we're mired in neo-liberalism; that the combination of these two means wealth isn't working/being distributed as it should be, and related to that that housing is a rip-off - small, damp and overpriced; that our health service is shit (and it really isn't because "all the doctors are moving to Australia", it's just fucking crap and the BMA is a bloody disgrace).

On balance it's possible to live a tolerably safe and enjoyable life here and it suits me because I've grown up here and "get" its cultural and social nuances so it's less effortful than being an immigrant elsewhere.

It's only been 15 minutes since Ilast posted You would think that I had been gone for a day.

Are you glued to mumsnet every second of every day?
How embarassing for you!
I am literally on a phonecall typing this one post. Are you going to let me take a phonecall? The people on here..

I read that thread and did not think people meant that the UK was the best country in the world.

I took it to mean that by comparison with being born in a vast number of developing, and some developed, countries, being born in the UK is ‘lucky’.

We currently do not have extremes of climate, are not prone to natural disasters, do not have on going problems with war, famine, easily treatable diseases, access to food or healthcare. My children won’t die before their fifth birthday due to malnutrition, cholera or malaria.

I have freedom to make choices about where I live, work and my and my kids’ education. I can vote for who I like and can openly criticise the government without fear of reprisals.

So yes, I think being born in the UK is an incredibly fortunate thing. But that doesn’t mean this country is the best, or without many problems. It just means the problems we have are less ‘life or death’ compared to many other nations.

I think that I am lucky to live in a country which, at the point of law, protects, for example, women, gay people, disabled people, pregnant women, people of different faiths etc.

I’m lucky to live in an English-speaking country - lucky in that I can make myself understood in many countries around the world with no particular effort.

I’m lucky to live in a country that doesn’t experience extremes of climate or natural disaster.

I’m lucky to live in a country that hasn’t been invaded in 1000 years.

I’m lucky to live in a democratic country.

All of that is pure luck. I didn’t do anything to make the UK like that, but I do benefit from it. As do all who chose to make this country their home, even if sometimes they want to take us in a different direction or slag us off.

Luckily, those people are free to leave.

That’s cool. I’ll wait.

X post with @summershere99!

Are UK people being brainwashed by UK media into thinking the UK is a better place to live in, than it is.

Highly doubtful given the media bias towards the negative! If you relied on trending news, you’d think you had a 50:50 chance of being violently attacked every time you left your house and that society had completely collapsed. I agree with a pp that we often think the UK is suffering uniquely with many economic and political issues, when I see the same happening elsewhere. I work in Germany a lot and the same problems with high rents and the impossibility of buying for people under about 35 in big cities (seems a total myth that nobody in Germany is fussed about owning their home, btw!) are factors there too.

I’m also not recognising your depiction of foreign media. I have family in an EU country and have seen a LOT of TV news there over the years. ‘How terrible the UK is’ is not a story I’ve ever seen covered.

I'd say I see the opposite.

People in the UK tend to be on the "rubbish here, innit?" side of discussions. We get so many threads saying how dreadful the "UK" is alongside the regular London bashing here.

I've met a lot of people from various countries over the last year or so who have a rose-tinted view and would definitely tell me I'd won the lottery by being born here. My Spanish friend is very vocal about it particularly. If I hadn't been talking to her I wouldn't have known how bad it is in her area of Spain.

I feel lucky to be born in the U.K. but tbh I would feel lucky to be born in any EU country. I think you’re comparing to the wrong countries tbh.

Nobody ever says things like that on here on the contrary they are overly negative about the uk ,I don't think the uk is the best place in the world but it far from the worst
I also don't understand why you think the world's media would be overly concerned about the uk
Have you seen the news recently there's a lit more worrying things going on
Than the by contrast the mundane things going on in the UK.

This. By most measures the UK is pretty safe and relatively wealthy in comparative terms.

I live in a Med country close to the ME. The men from Syria ( it's always the men) came to this country as refugees and were ruthless about targeting British women for marriage as their ultimate goal was to get to the UK and obtain a British passport (this was pre Brexit). They weren't interested in other European women as they thought the streets of London were paved with gold and the UK was the best country in the EU. That's all gone to shit now obviously 🙄

I’ve spent time in Ghana and South Africa and Cambodia and Laos and Thailand and Morocco and Egypt.

i’d rather be born in the U.K. than any of those countries and this applies to most non European or anglosphere countries.

Most people won't have lived anywhere else OP, so they won't have anywhere to compare it with. Other countries slag off the UK, okay, our media slags off the UK too, but if people are happy living here that's their opinion and they're entitled to it. You've obviously lived in several places, which gives you more insight into this issue and other countries to compare the UK to, but most people don't have that insight and if they're happy, why does it bother you?

I actually find the media in the uk to be very negative about living here. Out of control immigration, sky high property prices, stagnating wages, long nhs waiting lists etc etc....not sure why you think our media could be brainwashing us op. I still feel lucky to live here compared to many other countries outside of the EU / west

Precisely. I can afford private healthcare and have financial stability which would enable me to live well in Canada (where half my family already lives) as I like the city/outdoorsy lifestyle mix. From a PP, it sounds like I should be looking at Denmark too!

Where have you been, and which international papers, are you reading the local language ones. I can assure you that they aren't negative about the UK, and most of my European friends and neighbours are pretty level on which countries are good, bad or indifferent. Most of Western Europe is indistinguishable in general terms,each with its own good and bad.

I tested to know where you lived and who you socialized with.

What countries have you found the standard of living is better than the UK?

Our standard of living has really dropped here. Would love to move as I find the envy of politics very, very depressing.

I’ve lived in many countries in the world and don’t recall anyone saying that the UK is a terrible place to live. And that includes signifiant chunks of time in the US, several countries in SE Asia, Africa, and a few European countries.

I’ve had to dispel a few myths the over the years though - my Japanese colleagues were convinced that it was always raining in the UK, and didn’t believe that Tokyo has three times the annual rainfall that London has. That blew their minds. My colleagues in the Bay Area were convinced that taxes were sky high in London, yet we when compared what someone earning £150k in the UK paid compared to some in the US on $200k there was only around $10,000 dollars in it. But they paid 2 or 3 times the level of property (council) tax I’d paid in the UK and all healthcare was free. Note, this was almost 10 years ago - so numbers have changed I am sure.

Nowadays I spend much of my time in France at the moment, and at many levels it is better than the UK - healthcare, public services and pride, climate. But I still prefer the freedom from bureaucracy in day to day life, the tolerance towards difference and the far wider range of types of cuisine available in every town or city in the UK. I also don’t want to become a France tax resident as that’s not helpful for a widowed single person. Even the climate and the wine don’t make up for that. I am toying with a move to Italy though where tolerance seems somewhat higher than in France. So overall, we have it pretty good in the UK, but as with everywhere there are areas that are less attractive depending on who you are and what stage you are in your life. I think is fair to say that the UK, along with the west in general, is in a state of decline…but that’s a function of population and the Japanese have existed happily for decades with problems we are just beginning to face.

I've lived in quite a few different countries and I think the UK is fantastic - we have a fabulous lifestyle that's vastly superior to what we experienced living elsewhere (I'm British, DH is not). We both feel very lucky to live here. However, I realise that individual circumstances differ and this isn't the case for everyone - all opinions are valid though.