Bite? Rabies? Any docs?

[Feelingworriied]

So I feel a bit worried but not sure if I'm overthinking this

Yesterday we went to a national trust place - wallington hall in Northumberland. They have a den building area which has lots of trees, lots of logs and branches for the kids to build with. I had a short sleeved top on. I was carrying multiple branches and bits over to the kids and had them tucked under my arm. Obviously these felt rough but nothing notably painful.

This morning I noticed dried blood on my arm, thought it was a scratch. Wiped it away and could see two puncture marks about 5mm apart. I wiped again and the blood cleaned fully and disappeared. No wound/marks visible after it was cleaned.

At first I thought it was a spider bite but there's no swelling or redness. Then I remembered reading about that lady who died from rabies in the news - at the time I read around rabies because I didnt know much and remember seeing what a bat bite looks like. Basically same as a spider bite. So because of the lack of irriation if it was a spider bit I googled if there are bats at wallington - and this is where the fear started- it's known for bats, it has a large population 😳

Does it sound insane that I'm worried about a bat bite. I didnt see any bats but concerned if one was injured on one of the branches I collected it could have bitten me?

there has only ever been 1 recorded death from bat related rabies in the UK in my long lifetime, in Scotland in someone who worked with bats. Do you often suffer from health anxiety? The person in the news who very sadly died from rabies recently was in a country where it is endemic in the stray dog population and she was scratched by one.

I'd say call your doc.

I'm in the US and had a bat bite that required HRIG and the vaccine series. Even here where rabies is not uncommon, you have to go to the ER to get the immunoglobulin and vaccines, they're not easy to access. HRIG is extremely costly.

My bite didn't bleed and you couldn't see the punctures but I felt them. I thought it was my cat at first.

You would hope so but I suspect not. OP didn’t see a bat, it was day time and she was rummaging around in sticks and logs, there are plenty of other explanations for her injury. Bat bites are not something A&E doctors are familiar with.

I know of someone going to A&E concerned about having been bitten or scratched by a bat. They were watching bats through an open window and felt something brush against them. There was no signs of a bite or scratch but, as @TarnishedMoonstone has pointed out, bat bites aren’t always visible. They were refused prophylactic treatment.

They were fine and they probably weren’t actually bitten or scratched by a bat but don’t expect UK doctors to necessarily be knowledgeable about bat bites.

😁 The idea that you would have a doctor, rather than just a GP roulette at your local surgery, and that you could call them up -even on a Saturday afternoon- makes me green with envy.

Probably a snake or a flea that fell off a fox or badger or something of no significance. Youre fine so don’t worry.
Im not a better but I’d bet you £50 it’s not a bat.

No I don’t expect she was bitten by a bat. But just emphasising how careful you need to be around them. We came home once and a bat was flying around our house. My husband togged up to get it out of the window - that was in broad daylight.
When he worked in Africa, a local woke up to 2 of them latched onto his neck. Luckily hr was able to go for rabies shots. Imagine that!

Bats don’t lurk around in woodpiles during the day. And certainly don’t wait around for anyone to pick them up by accident. Honestly, please don’t worry about rabies.

It's rabies free - except for wild bats. Bats migrate - there is a map in this paper with ring recovery for Nathusius’ pipistrelle:
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/62308e42d3bf7f5a8a6955b8/Appendix_1a.7_-_Bats.pdf
Obviously you can't quarantine wild bats, much like wild birds.

OP, I've accidentally trapped a spider before, they do give a little nip when they're stuck and scared. I've never had swelling or redness, just a bite mark. Yours sounds like a spider.

Bat tooth puncture marks are much bigger than spiders, do upload a photo. I should be able to find a local bat species list and compared teeth marks.

Go and spend a day in A&E if you want

The gov actually have guidance on this OP!
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/rabies-risks-from-bat-bites/information-for-individuals-who-have-been-bitten-by-a-bat
How far apart were the two puncture marks?

I think we have better access here to our docs even if we do end up going to urgent care for minor things. I called at 3: 30 am and left a message with her service and she consulted with a specialist up at Yale and he was on the phone with me at 5:30 when I was already in the ER. I knew I'd have to go there to get the HRIG and 1st vaccine.

The vaccine they give before travel is the same as the vaccine they give after possible exposure, yes. It works very well as long as it’s given before symptoms develop, which takes weeks or months.

Surely key here is that you were actively, knowingly handling bats? You can't compare treating a bat in clinic with picking up some sticks in the field.

The wood came from a play area so these branches and logs are regularly used. No sane bat would be roosting there even if the dead wood did have crevices and holes. (Though perhaps it wouldn't be sane if it had rabies!)

The chances of it being a rabid bat just aren't comparable to a clinic situation.

🦇🦇🦇

The woman caught rabies overseas handing a street puppy, there's near 0 chance of getting rabies in this country.

There’s no rabies here. Don’t worry OP. It was prob a twig.

The lady that died of rabies was bitten abroad by a dog.

Yes, exactly. This is the guidance I was given and followed when I was definitely bitten by a bat. The question here is how likely it was that you were bitten, OP. If you were, this is what you should do, but nobody here knows whether you are likely to have been bitten or not. Bats are not that small, they are far bigger than most insects, around the same size as smaller birds. And they are not generally active during the day. They roost in dark, quiet spaces, like hollow trees. Would you have seen one?

Normal healthy bats do not fly around in the day biting people but a rabid one would, its echolocation is all messed up and rabies make them want to bite!

Of course it’s a very different situation, which I said. My point is that lots of posters are saying there is no danger of rabies from bats in the UK, which is wrong, there absolutely is a small risk. Whether the OP actually encountered a bat is another matter, and it sounds unlikely. But if someone else reads this thread in the future I hope it’s now clear that worrying about rabies if you HAVE been bitten by a U.K. bat is completely justified, although the risk is small even from a confirmed bite.

My son had a bat fly in to his face in a London park. NHS 111 took it very seriously, because a bat flying around in the daytime is likely unwell. As far as I remember it was very important to get the first rabies injection quickly (you need 3). Because it was the weekend he had to pay privately at a large Boots branch for the first one, but got the next 2 later at his GP surgery.

Don't delay, it's not worth it.

You mention no redness or swelling but that doesn't always what happens with a spider bite. Both my partner and I have had spider bites (both visibly witnessed and noticing double punctures on different occasions) and neither of us have experienced any redness or swelling (and I've got very sensitive skin and will have random rashes just looking at plants).

We have bats that carry a deadly rabies like virus

Yes this occurred to me too which is why I was worried if I'd picked up a few logs together and there was an injured one or something clinging on.

I know its more than likely just a spider bite but freaked myself out after realising it's a big bat hot-spot.

To the poster who asked about the size between the punctures, I'd say it was about half a cm.

I'm contemplating just paying privately for the vaccine for peace of mind and avoiding explaining that I'm concerned about an invisible bat. I do recognise how silly it sounds, but I didn't see what bit me. Then again on the public health England it says most bat bites are felt not seen. I can't recall any particular moment where I felt pain but I was holding the branches which were bark covered and generally uncomfortable to carry against skin anyway so not sure a nip would have registered.

Gah. I'm not usually anxious about health, pretty level headed. Had a couple of 2 week wait investigations over the years and managed to reason to myself it's more than likely nothing serious - which was correct. But, I am fresh out of an emotionally/psychologically abusive relationship so my anxiety levels are probably higher than normal just on the back of that.

@MonsterasEverywhere thank you for that, that's reassuring to read. Ive had a spider bite before and it was red around the punctures.

Near 0. But not 0.

OP it’s highly unlikely that you’ve been bitten by a bat, but unless you’re 100% sure it’s not a bat I’d go and get checked and have the vaccine. In the minuscule chance that it was and you’ve somehow managed to get rabies it’s a nasty death. It’s not worth the risk.

I recall a previous bat thread but based in USA, and it went a similar way. UK posters don’t understand how serious rabies is, and that if you have symptoms you’re dead, and the only way to test for it is to decapitate the deceased animal. There’s no live test.

If you’re not 100% sure it wasn’t a bat go and get vaccinated.