To think that “failing upward” is way too common?

[ForBreezySloth]

I’ve lost count of the number of people I’ve come across who were clearly struggling in their roles - only to end up getting promoted. It’s like some workplaces would rather move someone up than deal with the hassle of replacing them properly. Is this just my experience or is failing upwards a real phenomenon?

I thought the title was 'falling upward'. I once tripped over a step and ended up in a&e with a broken shoulder.

I have a special pet loathing for people management as a point for promotion.

I prefer giving people more autonomy and control over the work that happens when they're good at something, not lumping them with an entirely different set of responsibilities!

I’ve definitely seen this. There’s a type of person (often male, often relatively young) who is supremely confident and good at talking the talk, but less skilled at actually doing the day to day work. And so they do very well in interviews and get promoted.

And it’s really tricky as in a lot of roles part of doing the job well is about being a good talker - so being able to think of your feet, come across well in meetings etc. And so appointing someone who shows these skills in interviews isn’t wrong per se.

But the end result is you end up with people who are capable at just this element of the role being promoted, and others who are maybe less great at this, but better at every other aspect of the role, not getting promoted.

Isn't this the basic principle of government.

People are often promoted to management positions but very unfairly not trained or prepared to carry them out. Management positions tend to involve training in finance, people skills, and management of resources. Even people in supervisory positions are not infrequently stressed or damaged, because they simply aren’t trained to do the job they’ve been dropped into properly. Being good at your last job is often a small proportion of the role.

Yes, I’ve seen this too. Someone will be good at a (often fairly niche) part of their job then are told that they now need to manage people.

I get cross when someone says “Well you’ve clearly got a shit manager”. There’s a good chance they’ve been given a bunch of people to manage and almost no guidance nor training.

Freudian slip! It was pretty naughty in the motor manufacturing industry back then - affairs going on left right and centre!

Congrats on your promotion, hope it’s all going well 🙂.

Yes it can become quite demoralising. I left my last department after one of the new young guys told me he’d be quality assessing my customer facing interviews. Now bear in mind I’d been there 10 years already and pretty much sailed through these reviews. He had been at the department for less than a year and in that time I’d already seen him get into an altercation with security as he refused to pull down his hoody whilst a his public facing desk 🤦🏻‍♀️. The managers were a clique and I think they just took a shine to him as they were inclined to often do. At the end of my review he just smiled sheepishly at me, no feedback, suggestions or observations, mumbled a barely audible ‘well done’ and scurried off. This was the final straw really it felt a bit humiliating being constantly overlooked for the types of additional developmental opportunities others under qualified like this young man were given. My face never fit despite my performance and the rare times I got any development opportunities I would literally have to be begging for it and it was always begrudgingly given. In the end a friend told me to have faith in myself and get a promotion elsewhere which I did! Loved the job and helping the public but the managers didn’t and it showed.

Currently applying for a senior position after 8 years in my new department so fingers xd!

This. And the nepotism.

Yes happens in the NHS alot. It's like people get promoted to the point of incompetence.

Happens all the time in the Public Sector.

Yep!!

Happens loads in the NHS. Crap at their job, shove them into middle management, paper pushing roles.

I worked in one of the Big Four banks years ago, and this happened ALL the time. So frustrating and very unfair.

Sadly yes, it’s a way of life where I work…

I have seen this happen, though only once.

And he was genuinely called Peter.

Most corporate speak is meaningless buzz words

Yep. You said exactly what I was thinking?

Was about to say this!

I’ve worked in various industries in my nearly 30 years of working life - journalism, broadcasting, education - and without doubt, talent and hard work only get you so far.

Networking, arse kissing and shouting about your successes (or taking the credit for other people’s success!) get you further.

I have worked with some at best mediocre and at worst incompetent high flyers. Almost all men, too.

I used to see it a lot in the Civil Service, which was why I left. It was 25 years ago so things may have changed in fairness.

Two words:

Boris Johnson.

He’s still biding his time to become world king, then God.

I have this going on at work right now and it’s infuriating. The second I can leave, I’m out.

God, even thinking about it right now pisses me off.

Oil and gas industry is notorious for this along with nepotism.

This happens all the time in my industry (and my current employer). Also rife in politics. In the UK, my personal favourites are: Liz Truss, Boris Johnson, Chris Grayling, Kemi Badenoch, Priti Patel. And among labour: list under construction.

(Every time I am offered / up for a promotion, I too now consider the very real possibility that I am failing upwards. Sad times! Ha 😅)