To think that there is no hope here?

[Taxed]

52.6% of UK individuals are reliant on the State (that is 35 million people). Only 47.4% are net contributors. How did we get here?

AIBU to think that the UK is now a declining economy that will never recover if this continues to be the case?

I am 49 and a high earner (just shy of the top 1%). My husband is also a high earner and we are thinking of leaving. We don't know where but we know we have to as the situation in the UK is getting worse not better. The only thing that is keeping us here is our son, who is still in secondary school. I am actively encouraging him to consider a future outside of the UK.

I genuinely feel that being ambitious and successful is not worth it in the UK. People hate you for it and want to see you penalised. They think that whatever you do to earn the money it must be easy and a breeze. That you are greedy and need to be made to pay for doing well. Just last week, I heard that the government might be thinking of implementing a charge, payable by high earners, to access the NHS. Everything is about taxing the already heavily taxed even more and few want to face up to the fact that this is unsustainable when you have most of your people relying on the State to live.

People complain about the immigrants but they make up a tiny proportion of 35 million.

I feel disliked for doing well and just can't see a future here and it is making me angry and sad. I believe in having a welfare state, in helping those who are in need but 52.6%? The country is on its knees when most of its people are in need. That is like a developing country not a developed and thriving economy.

Sorry for the long rant. I'm just tired, sad and have just about lost hope of enjoying life in the UK.

Doubtful. If that were the case he would have moved for full recognition without conditions.

Muslims are a mere 6%. Nobody is going to put excess work into courting their vote.

Instead of feeling 'disliked' for paying more tax why not see it as part of your civic duty? The overall tax rate of the rich is typically far lower and it's much more expensive to live poor.

So, you believe that this Government is the best custodian/allocator of your tax receipts, correct?

I thought MPs like Jess Philips and Wes Streeting are in constituencies where panding to the Muslim vote is essential. Wes Streeting seems to be one of the few ministers that are effective and relatively normal so it would be a shame to lose him.

Higher earnings do not equate to moral merit it's an arbitrary societal ranking that often bears no relation to how hard people work and is much more likely to reflect their societal privilege
I can sort of see where you are coming from in some cases. You are saying that people's parents were the hard workers that gave their children "societal privilege " to be high earners. Because this societal privilege must come from somewhere. And presumably it can't come from inside a person themselves or by their own drive and hard work. These people have no agency themselves. Therefore they didn't earn their own money themselves through their own graft really and the Labour Party is entitled to lift as much as possible from them in tax.
I suppose that means you don't agree that doctors deserve a payrise. Because getting through medical school usually only happens due to "societal privilege " rather than their own brain and hard work.

Gaza is a political issue that has resonance. It’s shaping policy and Corbyn’s new party mentions two things, economic readjustment and Palestine.

We are seeing the impact on politics here for sure, the pp is closer to that.

They are 6% of the vote and zero evidence of “pandering”.

Just seems like a weird bigoted myth.

It may have resonance but it’s not about pandering to a minuscule portion of the population.

If he wanted to pander he could have just moved immediately for full recognition like so many countries have.

I took it to mean many hard workers are also very low paid.

Think it will depend on demographics in each constituency and what is important to a particular demographic. Eg farming issues are not going to be of interest in Islington. Are there constituencies where there are a large proportion of Muslims? If so, Gaza may well be a voting issue as it seems to be of great importance to many Muslims, perhaps more important than many UK national issues. Hence independent pro Gaza MPs and councillors. I don't think they would be very pleased if you called them a "myth" and that talking about them was "bigoted"?

Idk what his motivation is tbf. It’s a bizarre condition that no one else is suggesting.

They are 6% of the population….

But not evenly spread through constituencies, surely? I understood there are some constituencies with significantly more than others so there could be bloc voting. Labour are obviously immensely unpopular so will need every vote.

Disability benefits are not a gravy train. They are there to support disabled people and if you knew what you were talking about you would know that fraud and error in these benefits is very low. That you’ve fallen for government rhetoric designed to get the public onside for reducing the support available for disabled people is made clearer each time you post. Just because you stop supporting a need through one means doesn’t mean that need disappears. It just gets shifted to another part of the budget. The proposed cuts to disability benefits won’t save a penny. The responsibility for the support disabled people could previously buy in cheaply with PIP and carers allowance will pass to social care. Much more expensive and will probably push costs up, not down.

And I think you know the meaning of my comment about the motability scheme.

I don’t think that’s really the point.

I’m not the slightest bit embarrassed thanks. You posted your opinion. I posted fact.

1000 people a day going in PIP says it is a gravy train. The masses of people abusing the system are making it worse for genuinely disabled people. But that is the problem with free money. The needy will get penalized when you start dishing it out like it’s going out of fashion.

The government doesn’t have a choice. They have to and absolutely should cut this down to size. Real deep cuts. Because there ain’t no money left. £20b paid in debt interest every month tells us that.

Still looking for where the fact was. It was just a loaf of words, not saying very much.

Plenty of facts there to be fair, in @Rosscameasdoody’s post. Which ones do you dispute?

It’s really not my problem if your comprehension isn’t up to scratch and you prefer slinging random insults to proper debate. Have a good evening.

I don’t think there are any proposed cuts to disability benefits now are there? The left of the party were having none of it and Starmer (predictably) capitulated.

The oligarchs should pay proper wages. It’s extraction of shareholder value and an infeasible expectation of growth which results in wages being too low to live on and a need to supplement wages with benefits. Effectively, taxpayer funds are subsidising company profits.

Do you read the telegraph by any chance? I was gifted a subscription and every other article is moaning that the country has gone to the dogs or sad face middle class people who can’t go on holidays as often any more.

edited for grammar (still bad grammar)

Don’t forget to include businesses who pay their employees such low wages that they are entitled to benefits. Those businesses are dependent on state aid., too.

They’re proposing to bring in the same changes to disability benefits for new claimants only from the end of next year - effectively creating a two tier system. So the disability premiums on UC will be less for new claimants and the four point rule for PIP will apply.

I think they’ve watered down some of the other proposals, and they’ve been asked by several disability organisations for clarification as to what they mean by ‘new claimants’. Unless the claimant is severely disabled and their condition is deemed unlikely to improve, PIP awards have a built in review date and any reported changes to circumstances can also trigger a review. It’s not been made clear as yet whether these claims would be subject to the changes on renewal.