To this is absolutely insane! Universal Credit Sanction

[ThisIsInsane]

Adult DD has had an absolute nightmare trying to get a job since she was fired just before Christmas,

She wasn’t happy in the role previous to that so applied for another, got it, gave her resignation. Three days into the new role, she was told, she wasn’t a good fit and immediately fired. She did absolutely nothing wrong btw.

This has massively affected her mental health. She’s never been fired before or been unemployed.

She has literally applied for over 1500 jobs since then, only got two interviews which she wasn’t successful at.

She missed a UC appointment in June. Not sure what exactly happened but she has evidence of her job search. At every appointment they tell her she’s applying for a lot of jobs and there’s noting they can do to help.

They have sanctioned her UC so she has only got £7!

According to the letter she has been sanctioned for 30 days for a first offence of missing one appointment after 6 months in which they have not helped her find a job!

She has an appointment later today and I’m planning to go with her to complain as she isn’t in the right head space to. I just think it’s totally disgusting! She lives at home luckily but can’t pay her phone bill even!

Imagine if she was living on her own and had no support!

AIBU to think this is extreme and unjustifiable punishment?

Maybe we have suffered trauma ourselves, maybe suffer ourselves, but you know have jobs, children, families, friends etc, maybe we can't just stay in our houses all day as we won't get paid.

I wonder how many of these people would be better off working? Better off getting outside?

another is so terrified of encountering dogs that they are scared to leave the house.

So they never leave the house in case they come across a dog? Do they claim benefits because of this? And do you think that is acceptable?

What would you recommend to the op and her dc?

That she continues to take time out, sleeps as she is or helps her get back into work?

Sorry to hear about your brother, I had an elderly neighbour on the same 4-weekly medication, I did his shopping and it was difficult and upsetting the nearer it got to the injection, then sad for a few days when he was “too” calm. A lot of other neighbours steered clear but perhaps didn’t know the full story.

UC sanctions drive people into crime, mental illness and drive women into sex work.

Nobody should be left without enough money to feed themselves or attend job interviews. Nobody.

The number of people on this thread who genuinely don't understand the impact of severe mental illness is depressing.

That is so sad. What a lovely person you are to have helped him out. ❤️

I've personally experienced depression and anxiety, and lived around mental health issues all my life ("D"F had paranoid schizophrenia and addiction as well as other issues). DH has PTSD, DS1 has depression, DS2 has a disabling condition and ADHD and guess what - every single one of us drags our arses out of bed every morning and goes to work. I am aware that everybody is different and deals with stuff differently, but those of us with direct experience also have the right to put our tuppence worth in and tell OP's DD to get a fucking grip and stop lounging in bed at our expense.

Getting so sick of every single person who feels a bit sad self-diagnosing with something which is actually a serious and can be a debilitating condition. Kids need to build resilience, not be mollycoddled.

Perhaps your clients are all genuinely suffering from debilitating MH issues, but if you believe that every single person who claims to be suffering similarly is genuine, then perhaps you're in the wrong profession or living in cloud cuckoo land.

@Lemonysnipit @Mayanatalia

Have sent you both DMs as I do not want to derail from the OP's thread but I did want to say bravo for sending such great replies to the OP (@ThisIsInsane).

I hope that the OP's daughter takes you both up on your kind offer of advice as your replies definitely warmed the cockles!

Maybe the OP daughter would be able to stand on her own two feet a little if the OP backed off!

Get her onto civil service jobs and apply for some of those. Decent salary, great pension, usually lots of options.

I really wish that MN had a FCK OFF or a STOP BEING A CNT react button/widget (apologies not too sure what they are called) at times!

And I wish it had a get a grip button. A lot of people on here need to here that and should have been told that a long time ago.

There's a world of difference between "suffering trauma" and having PTSD, just as there's a world of difference between being a bit down and being clinically depressed.

I don't think forcing people to work or "get outside" is in any way beneficial to someone with severe mental illness. Over the years, I've lost 2 clients to suicide following DWP "fit for work" decisions, which is 2 too many imo.

Exactly, but where and how do we draw the line?

You are missing the point, the people she's talking about literally CAN'T get outside etc.

Just because you're coping with your MH issues better than someone else is coping with theirs doesn't necessarily mean the other person is lazy or slacking off. In the case of the ones this poster has mentioned, it's obvious that their symptoms are more severe than yours.

People with symptoms this severe aren't coping with their DC "because they have to". They're neglecting their DC who are in turn growing up with their own issues because of that. Or their partner, if they have one, is doing all the childcare and household stuff. Or they're having their DC removed by social services due to their inadequate parenting.

If benefits didn't exist, these people wouldn't "go to work because otherwise they'd not get paid". They'd stay home until they got evicted for not paying rent. They'd starve to death, whether at home (eviction can take ages) or on the streets, because of not having money for food. Or they'd see their inevitable future and take their own lives.

Thinking that mentally unwell people automatically would go to work if they really had to is utter bullshit.

Some might, if they had the more minor end of symptoms, but that doesn't mean it would work out well. In many cases, people's symptoms are only at the minor end because they don't have the stress of working and have all day to do whatever is necessary to manage their condition and stop it worsening. Force those people into work and they go downhill (this does actually happen in current society, because if someone's symptoms become sufficiently minor then they no longer qualify for sickness or disability benefits) until they can no longer function, their lives are falling apart and they're unwell enough to be able to get signed off sick again. Then when they're not working people like you cite their previous work experience as supposed evidence that they could work if they wanted to.

Now I'm not saying OPs DD is this mentally unwell. Personally I suspect in her case she needs some antidepressants because she's been faced with some big life shocks to get her head around - two nasty incidents in public, a nasty incident at work, and now realising the shitty reality of the benefits system and it's treatment of people (which is enough to make anyone depressed if they're involved with it for long enough IMO). She needs some medical help to get through that and also a boot up the backside to start practicing self care instead of wallowing, alongside some education as to what self-care for MH issues actually consists of (because it's possible she hasn't got a clue). She needs some kind of career coaching too, because her job search/application process is seriously lacking if she's applied for 1500 jobs and only got two interviews.

So I'm not saying in OPs DDs case she should claim sickness benefit and never work again. But in many other people's cases that's exactly what does need to happen. That you don't believe it just means you don't really have much understanding of MH issues in general, regardless of whether you've had any yourself.

Yes so where does the op’s dd sit in this? The thread is advice to her. Clients or relations might have their own difficulties but this is about a young adult who was working and could be helped into doing so again.

Yes, I think it is entirely acceptable when someone has a diagnosis of PTSD (previously agoraphobia) arising from having been attacked by a dog in the street, resulting in losing an eye and facial scarring that is so severe (even after plastic surgery) that they get stared at and often mocked by vile scrotes who are too ignorant to know better, and that they are terrified at the thought of leaving their house, let alone the act.

What I don't think is acceptable is that this someone has now been waiting for 6 years for EMDR therapy, which has excellent results with PTSD, and the subsequent CBT and support to get back to some semblance of a normal life. It's especially unacceptable that after waiting years for help in one trust area, they had to start again at the bottom of the waiting list when they had to move to a different trust area.

I’m not sure why the client stories are on this thread when it’s not applicable to the op’s dd

Your examples are extreme, and extreme cases exist.

How do you distinguish between somebody who has been through unimaginable trauma, and someone who is a bit down because they've had a bad experience and is now potentially spiralling in self-sabotage? Lots of people are susceptible to MH issues, but recognising and dealing with the early symptoms can prevent a full on crisis for many. Getting out of bed and doing something is a very good start.

Perhaps your clients are all genuinely suffering from debilitating MH issues, but if you believe that every single person who claims to be suffering similarly is genuine, then perhaps you're in the wrong profession or living in cloud cuckoo land.

My work doesn't involve MH care or treatment. I rely on reports from psychiatrists and lead MH practitioners, all of whom are MH qualified, for MH info. Almost all the cases that cross my desk have a recent history of acute MH episodes of sufficient severity to require admission, often under section.

I have enough experience to know that conditions like anxiety and depression vary widely in severity, and that the symptoms at the less severe end of that spectrum could well be faked. But I also have enough experience to know that the person staying in bed all day this week could well be the person depressed enough to be suicidal in a couple of weeks time.

Probably the BEST username in the World EVER @IdrisElbow !!!

And a lovely post too ... makes me very happy to see people actually wanting to help the OP (@ThisIsInsane) and her daughter.

@IdrisElbow

How I wish they had this for the over 30s, 40s, 50s too!

The King's Trust | Confidence, courses, careers

if "realising the shitty reality of the benefits system and it's treatment of people (which is enough to make anyone depressed if they're involved with it for long enough IMO)." is enough to make somebody actually clinically unwell enough to not work and be entitled to claim benefits @Alstromeria, would you also agree that being stuck in a shitty job you hate is also enough to make someone actually clinically depressed enough to be able to claim benefits? We're all right royally buggered if that's the case, when millions of people realise they can just self-declare as depressed because actually they've been living with that for years, but just soldiering on.

Either the benefits system should treat everyone equally - anyone who has hade had a mildly bad time and doesn't want to face the daily grind should get benefits enough to live on, OR those who've had a mildly bad time should get up and get on with it.