To think forgiveness is overrated?

[MyPoisedDenimReader]

We act like healing requires forgiveness. Why? Some people don’t deserve peace. Some wounds don’t need closure - they need distance. “I forgive you” has become another way to tone-police pain.

Damn right it's overrated. I was trafficked. I'm not forgiving the man who did it to me or the men he sold me to. I wish him dead every day.
Don't forgive, never forget. I'm not letting the bastards off that easily. I don't care if anyone thinks that's stopping me healing or whatever. They weren't there.

I don't know if this makes sense but
you need to be able to forgive yourself for not needing to forgive other people so that you can move on.

Yes, I know what you mean

There is the mild version - as Taylor Swift said "you don't have to forgive and forget to move on. Eventually, you just move on and everything's fine." That's not verbatim by the way - I'm sure she put it much better.

Then there is Schopenhauer - "to forgive and forget is to throw all the benefit of experience out of the window". That's the one I heard first obvs 😂 and I find it useful.

To be honest, I think people mostly forgive because that's the only way they can feel better themselves. I suppose it's hard work to carry a grudge for some people or they need some kind of closure.

Having been a teacher and gone through the "restorative justice" bollocks, were victim and bully sit in a room and talk it out, a lot of time all forgiveness does is let the abuser/bully (whatever) know that they have got away with it and they just carry on as they did before.

I went to a talk about this with a teacher friend - this was years ago - like maybe 15 years.

It was the biggest load of bollocks I've ever heard. I couldn't find any justice in it. And it did actually get implemented in schools I think did it?

I agree. I think you need to find a way to move on from hatred eating you up, but there are people I will never forgive and I think forgetting would open me up to having people treat me badly again. I think it would be far better to change the sentiment to 'learn from the experience and don't let it happen again but don't give that person space in your brain'. Easier said than done.

Agree 100%.
I don't forgive certain people in my
past for their behavior, and never will.
According to some, this means I can't move on. Not true, I have.

Yes it got implemented in schools and is still done today.

Some SLT love it so much that they even make the teachers have these sessions with the pupils that they have given sanctions too (even at the higher levels of 'mis-behaving').

It really is a joke.

I agree

Yanbu some things are unforgivable. Why would I forgive my abuser/rapist.

I think there are somethings that shouldn’t be forgiven. I think to forgive on some circumstances minimises the harm that’s been done.

I agree with you OP. I have never forgiven my best friend for having an affair with my now ex husband and I never will. Ten years on and I’m happily remarried (to someone else)and fine. I didn’t need to forgive her to move on and be happy. She didn’t deserve forgiveness. I doubt she cares what I think about her now and I couldn’t care less about her. But I still don’t forgive her.

I think the starting point is at the very least that the perpetrator begs for forgiveness and shows genuine remorse and a definite commitment to do better.

Even then any such decision is entirely up to the victim and should never be some sort of psychobabble requirement.

It is rare these days for anyone to own up to their actions and take responsibility.
Nobody apologises anymore.

It’s like the world has copied those arrogant fantasists on The Apprentice and think that humility and accountability are weaknesses to be avoided at all costs.

I agree. I am easy going but some things I can’t and won’t forgive.

My DD came home from school recently & said “we forgive those who hurt us” and I was like wft, no we do not have to do that. Some things in life ARE unforgivable. To tell people to give everything is telling them to hold their standards low.

Forgiveness is difficult to achieve, some things are unforgivable.

Thank you FrippEnos for acknowledging what a load of bollocks that was, especially with you being a teacher. My son was bullied and the restorative justice was missing a playtime so that he and the bully could discuss it. Used to make me mad. Where is the justice in that. In the end, my son never reported it just got his own back.

It’s a legacy of the previous dominance of Christianity in our culture - in Christian teaching, forgiving people who have wronged you is envisioned as a reflection of God’s own forgiveness of us, his children, who err and sin. Forgiving people thus makes you more godlike.

But I’m not a Christian, so forgiveness is not an important value to me - particularly where someone shows no remorse.

Forgiveness isn't an action you choose to take. It's a feeling. You either accept what was done to you, and feel you can get past it with no ill will against the person, or you don't. Personally I think true forgiveness, as in the emotion, is pretty rare unless the wrong was minor, or there were extenuating circumstances. I think what people mean when they use forgive as an action, is that they've decided they won't dwell on it and nurse a grudge.

I think it depends on how you define forgiveness. If you see it as letting go of the inner rage and anger inside you, at the wrong someone has done to you, something that is poisoning you, not the other person, then it can be helpful. It can make a person feel back in control and stops the other person from controlling you, albeit unknowingly, and hopefully lets go of some of the damage that negative, stressful feelings can cause you. I don't think it is something that has to be communicated to the person who hurt you. It's about you being kind to you.

I don't think it's something that can be dictated by others, however. No-one can ever tell you to forgive and as others have said we don't want to forget the lesson the hurt has taught us ...

Completely agree. There are some devastating replies on here, my love to those who have suffered so much.

Nothing wrong with righteous anger or indeed vengeance or just a cold lack of forgiveness. If someone’s not sorry for how they hurt you it’s stupid to forgive them. Not forgiving doesn’t have to mean holding onto bitterness which will only hurt you.

I agree I come from a family where there was abuse. Forgiveness was weaponised against me by people covering for the abuser. I was the problem because I wasn’t forgiving enough even though they had forgiven my abuser, aka hid the abuser out from accountability.

A relative who is a Catholic priest told others to hide out the abuse and not speak about it to preserve the family.

Forgiveness can be manipulated and it can be used as part of people failing morally and ethically.

It’s not about absolving someone of responsibility for what they have done, it’s about choosing to let go of it. What happened to someone may be traumatic or however you want to describe it and some people have a hard time accepting it but, ultimately, carrying around all that hatred and anger isn’t good for the victim in the long term.

You can’t control what others choose to do, only how you react and how you heal from that. Perhaps ‘’forgiveness’’ is the wrong choice of wording. I prefer to see it as just learning to let go and learning that what happened to you isn’t a reflection of you.

It isn’t about inviting your abuser, for example, around for tea and a hug, it’s just about learning to move on and redirecting any negative feeling you have towards somebody.

I never forgive. I bide my time and when they least expect it, they get what’s due to them.

could be months or years of waiting. I don’t forgive, I don’t get mad, but I will get even.

That’s one of the best things I’ve ever heard. Makes so much sense but I never thought of this. It is just awesome. Changes a few difficult situations for me. Thank you

So if someone murdered your child you would forgive them and move on